MiltyG565 Posted March 20, 2015 Share Posted March 20, 2015 I'm subscribed on Youtube to this guy that does 8-bit remixes of popular songs, and today he has uploaded this video explaining how the BBC used his version of Get Lucky without permission or even a request for permission. The question that springs to my mind is - Does the BBC need permission for this? I do hope that a big corporation like the BBC, with possibly the most experience in the world in "clearing", would have correctly assessed whether they needed to seek permission for the use of this song, but perhaps I'm being naive. IIRC, the BBC has long-standing agreements with a lot of big record labels so that they can use their music with permission implicit. Video - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6N6hx-JtoSA Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ambient Posted March 20, 2015 Share Posted March 20, 2015 Surely all the copyrights belong to the original composer/songwriter ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MiltyG565 Posted March 20, 2015 Author Share Posted March 20, 2015 [quote name='ambient' timestamp='1426887805' post='2723259'] Surely all the copyrights belong to the original composer/songwriter ? [/quote] Do they, though? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alyctes Posted March 20, 2015 Share Posted March 20, 2015 I'm pretty sure that if you post some original thing on YouTube, YouTube owns the rights to it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mornats Posted March 20, 2015 Share Posted March 20, 2015 (edited) [quote name='alyctes' timestamp='1426888433' post='2723266'] I'm pretty sure that if you post some original thing on YouTube, YouTube owns the rights to it. [/quote] Might be more complex than that, otherwise YouTube would own the rights to most of the music in the world. Edited March 20, 2015 by Mornats Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ambient Posted March 20, 2015 Share Posted March 20, 2015 [quote name='alyctes' timestamp='1426888433' post='2723266'] I'm pretty sure that if you post some original thing on YouTube, YouTube owns the rights to it. [/quote] I'm not sure that's right. I have a few videos on youtube with my music, I don't remember giving up my rights to the ownership of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JapanAxe Posted March 20, 2015 Share Posted March 20, 2015 [quote name='ambient' timestamp='1426890538' post='2723279'] I'm not sure that's right. I have a few videos on youtube with my music, I don't remember giving up my rights to the ownership of it. [/quote] You may have done so when you signed up to Google, YouTube etc. - I guess it would be the rights to the video and its soundtrack rather than the composition of the work itself. But that is just a guess! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dad3353 Posted March 20, 2015 Share Posted March 20, 2015 [url="http://www.videomaker.com/article/14680-youtube-copyright-rights"]Youtube and copyright ...[/url] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alyctes Posted March 20, 2015 Share Posted March 20, 2015 (edited) [quote name='Mornats' timestamp='1426890294' post='2723277'] Might be more complex than that, otherwise YouTube would own the rights to most of the music in the world. [/quote] That's why I said "original thing", by which I meant stuff posted without prior copyright. Edit: Having read (some of) the link provided by Dad3353 (thanks ), it's obvious I was wrong in detail and more or less correct in fact. They can distribute anything of yours you put there as they please, but they are not liable for it. Edited March 20, 2015 by alyctes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JapanAxe Posted March 20, 2015 Share Posted March 20, 2015 [quote name='Dad3353' timestamp='1426891720' post='2723288'] [url="http://www.videomaker.com/article/14680-youtube-copyright-rights"]Youtube and copyright ...[/url] [/quote] Thanks Dad! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mornats Posted March 20, 2015 Share Posted March 20, 2015 I've not read the link Dad posted but I suspect it's bang on the money. Anyway, this bit of what you said caught my attention: [quote name='alyctes' timestamp='1426891795' post='2723290'] ...without prior copyright. [/quote] Copyright is automatic. As soon as you create something original (photograph, painting, song) you own the copyright to it. I believe the tricky part comes with trying to prove that you own that copyright if contested. Back to the topic though, I'd have thought that yes, the BBC would indeed need to seek permission before using someone's original work. I'd look into it if I were him as there may be some compensation due perhaps? Worth reading up on at least just in case! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dad3353 Posted March 20, 2015 Share Posted March 20, 2015 [sharedmedia=core:attachments:167485] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigd1 Posted March 21, 2015 Share Posted March 21, 2015 (edited) I don't see how you could possibly own the copyright of a mix. The music or recording no problem, but just the mix you wouldn't own anything............................................... I think The BBC etc would have permission to play music, a mix is not music. If this was the case you could say the way you set Bass and treble when you play a track is your copyright, so if anybody was to set there own eq the same you would be owed money for breaking copyright............................................ wouldn't you, or am I missing something? Ta very glad BIGd Edited March 21, 2015 by bigd1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
booboo Posted March 21, 2015 Share Posted March 21, 2015 I think we are all missing the main point here - did you see that ZX Spectrum Vega gamepad thingy at the end of the clip? £100 gets me my eighties teenage years back! Manic miner, jet set willy, the lot. Over 1000 of the original games in one box. As an added bonus the sh*tty 80's 2D graphics will keep my kids from monopolising it too. I just hope the keypad stands up to the 1500m race better than my Spectrum did on DT's Decathlon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alyctes Posted March 21, 2015 Share Posted March 21, 2015 [quote name='Mornats' timestamp='1426892940' post='2723306'] I've not read the link Dad posted but I suspect it's bang on the money. Anyway, this bit of what you said caught my attention: Copyright is automatic. As soon as you create something original (photograph, painting, song) you own the copyright to it. I believe the tricky part comes with trying to prove that you own that copyright if contested. Back to the topic though, I'd have thought that yes, the BBC would indeed need to seek permission before using someone's original work. I'd look into it if I were him as there may be some compensation due perhaps? Worth reading up on at least just in case! [/quote] Okay, thank you. I stand corrected. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris_b Posted March 21, 2015 Share Posted March 21, 2015 I wonder if this guy got permission to use the songs he mixed in the first place? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chrismanbass Posted March 21, 2015 Share Posted March 21, 2015 Its a very complicated subject but heres what it boils down to - if you have the original copyright owners permission to create an arrangement of their song (lets just define this is an arrangement which is known as a derivative work) then yes you own the copyright to that arrangement and the BBC would have to ask your permission to use your work - if you DO NOT have the original copyright owners permission to create an arrangement of their song then the copyright defaults back to the original copyright owner/ their label as this is copyright infringement on your part in this case i would imagine that the BBC has an agreement with Daft punk's label and so will check with them about copyright issues, and i would also imagine that the original arranger has not been given clearance to create this arrangement (i'm making a big assumption here in the absence of facts) unfortunately there have been a couple of cases like this in the last few months the other one that springs to mind is the band Post Modern Jukebox who had their arrangement used by the voice recently with no credit to them Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mornats Posted March 21, 2015 Share Posted March 21, 2015 [quote name='alyctes' timestamp='1426941831' post='2723711'] Okay, thank you. I stand corrected. [/quote] It's a very complicated area! I hope I didn't come across as a know-it-all Not my intention at all Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chrismanbass Posted March 21, 2015 Share Posted March 21, 2015 [quote name='Mornats' timestamp='1426892940' post='2723306'] I've not read the link Dad posted but I suspect it's bang on the money. Anyway, this bit of what you said caught my attention: Copyright is automatic. As soon as you create something original (photograph, painting, song) you own the copyright to it. I believe the tricky part comes with trying to prove that you own that copyright if contested. Back to the topic though, I'd have thought that yes, the BBC would indeed need to seek permission before using someone's original work. I'd look into it if I were him as there may be some compensation due perhaps? Worth reading up on at least just in case! [/quote] problem being that it's not his original work its an arrangement of a previously copyrighted piece of music Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alyctes Posted March 22, 2015 Share Posted March 22, 2015 [quote name='Mornats' timestamp='1426959412' post='2724101'] It's a very complicated area! I hope I didn't come across as a know-it-all Not my intention at all [/quote] Absolutely not Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ambient Posted March 22, 2015 Share Posted March 22, 2015 [quote name='Chrismanbass' timestamp='1426960112' post='2724114'] problem being that it's not his original work its an arrangement of a previously copyrighted piece of music [/quote] That's what I was getting at in my first post. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ambient Posted March 22, 2015 Share Posted March 22, 2015 [quote name='MiltyG565' timestamp='1426888301' post='2723264'] Do they, though? [/quote] Well yes, this is a remix, not an original work. Unless the remix guy got permission which I doubt, then the owner is the original composer/songwriter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris_b Posted March 22, 2015 Share Posted March 22, 2015 An arranger is never the owner of the song. That's why they get paid a fee and not royalties. But I thought it was OK to steal peoples songs these days, in our online world. YouTube is built on people taking songs without permission. Ironic that someone who nicked the songs in the first place is complaining that what he's nicked has been nicked from him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MiltyG565 Posted March 22, 2015 Author Share Posted March 22, 2015 [quote name='chris_b' timestamp='1427020737' post='2724690'] An arranger is never the owner of the song. That's why they get paid a fee and not royalties. But I thought it was OK to steal peoples songs these days, in our online world. YouTube is built on people taking songs without permission. Ironic that someone who nicked the songs in the first place is complaining that what he's nicked has been nicked from him. [/quote] It's very hard to use songs that aren't your own on Youtube. They blocked one of my videos when I used a song from McNach's band, Sea Bass Kid. Unfortunately, Sea Bass Kid aren't one of these globe-trotting mega-bands with millions of album sales, so I was quite surprised to find that their work was picked up on by the fraud filter. And I had asked for permission before using it anyway, so they had no need to block it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iain Posted March 22, 2015 Share Posted March 22, 2015 [quote name='Dad3353' timestamp='1426891720' post='2723288'] [url="http://www.videomaker.com/article/14680-youtube-copyright-rights"]Youtube and copyright ...[/url] [/quote] Worth noting that the article is from 2010 and I'm fairly certain there was some fuss recently over a recent set of changes to their agreements that gave tehm more control over what you do with content posted to YT and who can make money from it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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