Little Bastard

[Stroopy121]

I recently picked up an Ashdown LB30 - delicious tubey goodness without a monster pricetag, but also without a monster output. I wanted a tube amp because I want grit and grind, not hugely fussed about having a clean signal, before I got the LB I was using a Muff to add some grit into a solid state head.

Now I know tube amps love a bit of abuse, but I've read that these LB30s have been used for small gigs and practises and I'm on the fence - I could JUST keep up all the dials near 11, and that was with a pretty beefy input signal coming through a Hartke VXR preamp pedal and running through a 4ohm 8x10! I know I could take a DI out and run into a PA channel, which would pretty much my problems, but I just wanted to see if anyone else has used these amps in a "loud" scenario and what kind of settings they used to get the maximum OOMPH out of it?

And also, I've read that tubes love abuse but I've never ran one before so I wanted to check again - surely running an amp with EVERYTHING at full toast can't be good for the thing? There was a little warmth coming from the vents after an hour or so but nothing out of the ordinary.. just seems like it's the kind of thing that SHOULD be breaking the amp..?!

xx

[Conan]

Oh - I thought this was going to be another Barefaced thread...

But isn't the main problem the "30" in the name? Is 30 watts ever going to be enough (assuming the rating is accurate) to manage a decent gig?

I'd have thought not...

[Stroopy121]

[quote name='Conan' timestamp='1386843992' post='2305176']
Oh - I thought this was going to be another Barefaced thread...

But isn't the main problem the "30" in the name? Is 30 watts ever going to be enough (assuming the rating is accurate) to manage a decent gig?

I'd have thought not...
[/quote]

I was skeptical too, but other users said they'd gigged them and been fine! As I said, it did have just about enough juice in the practice room so I imagine if I had a less "enthusiastic" guitarist then it would still work for small gigs, providing I turned it up to 11!

xx

[skychaserhigh]

30 watts will probably work for some gigs , all depends on what type of gigs they are of course.
Would never be enough for my gigs though that's for sure.

[EliasMooseblaster]

[quote name='Stroopy121' timestamp='1386844296' post='2305184']
I was skeptical too, but other users said they'd gigged them and been fine! As I said, it did have just about enough juice in the practice room so I imagine if I had a less "enthusiastic" guitarist then it would still work for small gigs, providing I turned it up to 11!

xx
[/quote]

I have gigged mine in a small venue with just a 1x15, and I don't think I turned the volume past 12 o'clock. (It certainly never goes past 11 o'clock in the rehearsal room!) Granted, the place was probably under 100 capacity, but it was perfectly loud with no PA support.

I think it may depend on your playing style, though: our guitarist often describes me as a "lead bassist" so it's fine to have my tone dominated by honking midrange and valve grit. If you're more of a groove/pocket player then you might need power to push the low end...though for a 30W amp, the Little Bastard really can put out a [i]lot[/i] of low end if you crank the bass control!

[Stroopy121]

[quote name='EliasMooseblaster' timestamp='1386845433' post='2305202']
I have gigged mine in a small venue with just a 1x15, and I don't think I turned the volume past 12 o'clock. (It certainly never goes past 11 o'clock in the rehearsal room!) Granted, the place was probably under 100 capacity, but it was perfectly loud with no PA support.

I think it may depend on your playing style, though: our guitarist often describes me as a "lead bassist" so it's fine to have my tone dominated by honking midrange and valve grit. If you're more of a groove/pocket player then you might need power to push the low end...though for a 30W amp, the Little Bastard really can put out a [i]lot[/i] of low end if you crank the bass control!
[/quote]

Out of curiosity, was the cab 4 or 8 ohms?

xx

Edited December 12, 2013 by Stroopy121

[andydye]

I'm very tempted by the Ashdown CTM100 (I think that's what it's called) or a Matamp if I decide to fly first class!

[badboy1984]

[quote name='Stroopy121' timestamp='1386847603' post='2305234']
Out of curiosity, was the cab 4 or 8 ohms?

xx
[/quote]

For the LB30 this shouldn't be a problem running a 4ohm cab or a 8ohm cab? The amp will pure out the same amount of power whether you use 4ohm or 8ohm cab ......

[EliasMooseblaster]

[quote name='Stroopy121' timestamp='1386847603' post='2305234']
Out of curiosity, was the cab 4 or 8 ohms?

xx
[/quote]
[quote name='badboy1984' timestamp='1386849369' post='2305268']
For the LB30 this shouldn't be a problem running a 4ohm cab or a 8ohm cab? The amp will pure out the same amount of power whether you use 4ohm or 8ohm cab ......
[/quote]

...but to sate your curiosity either way, my cab is 8 ohm! I've never tried it into a 4 ohm, though I think badboy[s]Stroopy[/s]'s right about the power.

Edited December 12, 2013 by EliasMooseblaster

[Stroopy121]

T'was a 4ohm 8x10 I was running. Yeah I know the power output will be the same, just curious if the different load has any effect on the perceived volume - since 4ohm will pull 2.7A at ~11V, but 8ohm will take 1.9A at ~16V, so although the power is the same, perhaps the whole is greater than the sum of it's parts.

Weird though, I would have expected an 8x10 to move WAY more air than a 1x15...

Either way, I'm happy with the purchase, I love the wee guy! Just wanted to compare some notes with other folks who have gigged 'em. Will try her through some different cabs and see what the result is. I have an LB2x12 on its way too so I look forward to putting that through it's paces!!

xx

[EliasMooseblaster]

[quote name='Stroopy121' timestamp='1386851440' post='2305296']
T'was a 4ohm 8x10 I was running. Yeah I know the power output will be the same, just curious if the different load has any effect on the perceived volume - since 4ohm will pull 2.7A at ~11V, but 8ohm will take 1.9A at ~16V, so although the power is the same, perhaps the whole is greater than the sum of it's parts.

[b]Weird though, I would have expected an 8x10 to move WAY more air than a 1x15...[/b]

[/quote]

Yeah, me too! I could hazard a guess that maybe the perceived volume is down to response curves and overall cab sensitivity - or maybe just that my idea of a "small" venue is a bit smaller than yours!

Could be partly down to the bass, of course: I played these gigs on an Epiphone EB-3, complete with notoriously huge neck mudbucker. Put more in, get more out, perhaps...but I doubt even that would make a 1x15 seem louder than an 8x10!

[badboy1984]

Venue i play usually require DI bass and mic the guitar amps. As long as the amp and the cab i'm using (TC BC 212) can pure out the volume i need for monitoring purpose then I'm all good to gig.

I don't know how to explain this properly but the DI on the amp is after the output section, so DI from the amp will sound different then DI from my MXR M80 box. I take that as a plus for my preference.

[Thurbs]

I am in a rock band and the LB is too quiet. Also, if you turn it up loud, you will need a attenuator to knock down the signal to the desk.

I wish I could be in a band which gigs at volumes which would allow the LB to be used on it's own, but I haven't found one yet.

[davedave]

I've gigged a forty watt valve head and a single 1x15. It only just kept up with a loud drummer and two loud guitarists. It was only really for monitoring though.
I upgraded to a Matamp gt200 and for it's first proper outing it was used as the bass rig for an all day festival and was on more or less full volume from 11am til 2am. Didn't miss a beat.
Dave.

[dan670844]

I have used mine with a ashdown cl610 at a gig and it was plenty loud enough for me. I also use it with a LB212 As with any valve amp cab choice is paramount. A high sensitivity cab is a must, (the cls and lbs are) tweeter is best off as they sound horrid as they cant reproduce the harmonics that a valve output stage produces. Cheap cabs are a no, a lb30 will nail a behringer cab, for example (i tried) even with its 30 watts, the low end is a problem and you cant eq it out. With the LB30 the preamp goes into overdrive before the output stage so, if you turn down the treble /mids / bass in equal measure you will have maximum headroom. If you do this you will hear the powerstage 'on the money' its wonderful warm, punchy tight. No compressor / solid stage will ever do that.
I use mine a lot in the studio and on gigs, just cant leave it alone. I also have a CTM300 which is the other end of the spectrum, its as loud as hell. I think a CTM100 and a CL610 or a barefaced 69er is all you need for most gigs.

Cabs that are great with this amp are ashdowns own cl series, ashdown lb series (havnt tried the vs) Aguilar DB's are great, Bergantino CN and HD are good. Ashdown ABM and Trace elliot stuff also sounds cool, but the sensitivity is down so they are not that loud, cabs of choice would be a cl610, berg nv610, aguilar db412, barefaced 69er. I.e big cab with high sensitivity. That is the way to go. I love the tone of a CL610 but I think you could get the same results with one of the other esp the barefaced 69er as it very sensitive and lightweight.

Now you have the same problem as me, once you have heard the 3D tone, the warmth, the punch and clarity, its difficult to use anything else..........
I think it is very possible to gig with this amp, most often I use a LB212, its all about volume on stage, for most bands it is always too loud, you need to work with the drummer and guitarist to get the sound levels down. the singer will thank you and you the band will sound much more balanced and professional. But that is a problem world over, for most bands.

[EliasMooseblaster]

[quote name='dan670844' timestamp='1387019290' post='2307436']
I think it is very possible to gig with this amp, most often I use a LB212, its all about volume on stage, for most bands it is always too loud, you need to work with the drummer and guitarist to get the sound levels down. the singer will thank you and you the band will sound much more balanced and professional. But that is a problem world over, for most bands.
[/quote]

I'll drink to that! We've been quite lucky with sound engineers for our last few gigs, but previously we've had to get into the habit of telling them "just make sure the audience can hear the vocals!" (Though I think our relatively polite lead guitarist is also a blessing in that respect.)

[RandomBass]

I successfully gigged this amp (it used to be mine) with a BF Compact, and more recently with a Super 12, no probs. Rarely needed to DI. The key is a decent sensitive cab.

[badboy1984]

I still in search for a better cab to go with my LB30 instead of the TC BC212 i'm using atm.

[RandomBass]

[quote name='badboy1984' timestamp='1387189903' post='2309054']
I still in search for a better cab to go with my LB30 instead of the TC BC212 i'm using atm.
[/quote]
I'd recommend a BF Super 12.

[badboy1984]

Thats an option, the Super 12 is even lighter then the BC212 but 1-2kg. I heard many great things about the BF cabs with the LB30.

[Jestermab]

I have the Ashdown LB-30 Drophead and owned it from new. I use an active German Warwick Streamer $$ bass. The tone I get from this combination is [i]ridiculous[/i]. Ive gigged at small to medium pubs and clubs and lovely big venues.. This amp is great but you need to do a few things to it to make it really shine in a gig situation. [list]
[*]The first thing is to get the Ashdown specific 2 x 12 cab. I have tried others, BF GB TE Vanderkley etc but the VS 212 is the one that brings out the best tone.
[*]Buy a clip on fan and aim it at the output valves, and remove the metal shroud. (This keeps too much heat in the valve zone otherwise)
[*]Buy 4x matched Cryo Electro Harmonix EL84 output valves (15% bigger vacuum tubes) and replace the wooly sounding smaller JJ Tesla valves - Which IMHO are better in AC30's! (Watford valves provides the cryo EH tubes for £75)
[*]Buy a phillips ECC82 (12AU7) valve approx £45 and replace this in the ECC82 slot (the other two ECC83 work fine) This give more definition in the played note and allows the amp to be driven HARD
[*]Use a DBX compressor and dbx eq. This boosts the specific waves as a concentrated source - but dial out the clipping on the EQ and watch for the threshold breach on the compressor, keep the noise gate low.
[*]Make sure your using proper heavy duty speaker 1/4 jack cables and speak-on to speak-on from the 15 cab to the 2x12 cab (helps with sensitivity)
[/list]
On average I used to go through output valves every 6 to 8 months at least... or i did until I fitted a clipped on fan to the handles on the side and pointed it at the output tubes. The tubes will last ages now, and I can drive it at virtually full power and get a nice warm sound with hardly any noticeable clipping. It gives great harmonics and can perform well.

However, if at a large venue, the DI feed is very very hot and theres no ground lift or pad, it simple terms the amp volume has to be at noon and be heard through a monitor (which is totally crap) so I get the sound engineer to put a pencil mic on the horn and if possible two mic's for the 15 and just one on the 12. This is not always possible so I get them to mic just the 12. (That way you get to have a monitor of the 15 and 2x12 ) I have had the 15 mic'd and have destroyed PA speakers before now (SO stick to the 12).

Also pedals make a great addition, I use a BOO instruments tremolo, Digitech chorus and TC electronics reverb and delay. I place in a 3 piece band and get a great sound from this set up. Sound engineers love this bass amp!

Thanks, Mark

[discreet]

[quote name='RandomBass' timestamp='1387030852' post='2307588']
The key is a decent sensitive cab.
[/quote]

+1. Wattage is no indication of 'volume' or 'power' - it's about which cabs you're using and how sensitive they are.

[RandomBass]

[quote name='discreet' timestamp='1387245121' post='2309892']
+1. Wattage is no indication of 'volume' or 'power' - it's about which cabs you're using and how sensitive they are.
[/quote]
Indeed. I've all but given up trying to explain this in layman's terms to my guitarist & keyboardist. Should've seen their faces when I told them I'd bought a 30w valve head lol.

[Bigwan]

I gigged my lb30 through my tech soundsystems 4*12 once. Really efficient cab. Got pretty loud and sounded very VERY nice. Ended up DIing from the head as my mxr m80 died so had to drop my stage volume so the DI signal didn't clip the desk - still sounded very nice!

[badboy1984]

Is ampeg cab any good to pair with the LB30? I'm struggling to find the Ashdown VS cabs. It seems the VS cabs is discontinue ........