Funny Innit ..

[Faithless]

[quote name='silddx' post='1356833' date='Aug 30 2011, 10:52 PM']Over the past couple of months, I have hardly played bass at home, but I play guitar every day. And when I go to rehearsals as a bassist and play songs we know, and work on new songs, I am a much better bassist. I am more fluid, more imaginative, more dynamic, more expressive and more comfortable. I am also playing more with a pick and right hand damping more.

I am a much better player through not playing at home.
I am finally happy not being a reader, I got fed up of feeling guilty about it and shed that stupid burden.[/quote]


[quote name='Gust0o' post='1358966' date='Sep 1 2011, 06:34 PM']I'd go back and read it all again, lah. I don't think you've got what he was saying, at all.

"Better" reads a number of ways - either just technically better, as in some improvement in skill; or better in an emotional sense. I have no doubt Nige has come back in the latter space.

He knows his limits; he knows what he wants; he's able to compartmentalise that from some of the guff and judgement on here; and yes, I absolutely believe he's better for it [/quote]

I think that my English is good enough to understand what he's talking about, and while I understand where he's coming from, he also clearly stated that he became better in number of ways (leaving emotional sense and such aside) that are developed through practising your axe by NOT doing it.
If you don't know where I'm coming from, please read the article I provided in previous post.

[SteveK]

Come on guys...you're coming across like a bunch of 6 year olds. Nobody's forcing/laying anything on anyone.

If somebody asks, " How do I become a better musician?" on a forum such as BC, It's perfectly reasonable to recommend learning to read and learn some theory. On a forum it's not really possible to tailor the advice.
Advice is given, it's up to us adults whether we act on that advice, or not. Of course there's more to music than reading and theory, that's stating the bleedin' obvious...but, on a general level, it's good advice.

[xilddx]

Sorry Steve, I'll stop now.

[SteveK]

[quote name='silddx' post='1359214' date='Sep 1 2011, 08:45 PM']Sorry Steve, I'll stop now.[/quote]Sorry Nigel, my post wasn't aimed specifically at you. As for your OP...

There really is nothing to feel guilty about re: reading.
Since my early 20s I've been fortunate enough to have always had a reasonable to well paid gig. However, if someone thrust a couple of pages of music in front of me and said, "Play that", I'd be stumped.
My reading was at best[i] fair[/i], and now best described as [i]barely adequate[/i]. I've simply let it go. But i've been lucky!
I would also say that some of the best (world class) musicians that I've played with...Don't read!
Don't let it get you down You're the best judge of what you need/want to do.

[Gust0o]

[quote name='Faithless' post='1359167' date='Sep 1 2011, 08:01 PM']Pretty much exactly what Doddy says. Listen, learn, get the band together.
What about 'scientific' side of that - scales, theory, etc - if player would really dig what he's doing, he would sooner or later come up with questions, when answers to them would involve all that mentioned stuff.[/quote]


What band are you in, tiger?

[Doddy]

[quote name='silddx' post='1359104' date='Sep 1 2011, 06:45 PM']That's idealistic and a cardboard cut-out approach though, Doddy. Also disparaging of people's natural inquisitiveness to find out more about the things they love doing. The beauty of music and anything creative is that there are always limits to your own ability, and no limits to the possibilities. When the student is ready, the teacher will arrive.

Also, have you any idea how dispiriting it is to try and learn something but have little application for what you are learning? And trying to absorb too much too quickly? If someone starts playing in a band they enjoy, they will not remain static, their desires will show them a path to their needs and create their own particular evolution of musical expression, which is surely the objective? They will seek out knowledge and guidance that suits their needs. If they don't understand their own needs and desires, what are the possibilities of them becoming expressive?

Don't take this ill mate, but you do sometimes come over as treating music as a job, for which a common set of tools is necessary.[/quote]

Why is it 'disparaging of people's natural inquisitiveness' to suggest that they should study alongside playing what they enjoy? And it's not
really idealistic either is it? There are tons of players who play in rock or pop bands yet study jazz or theory or whatever. Studying music
isn't going to take away your creativity or your expression-if anything,it will give you more tools and options with which to express yourself
on your instrument.

As for treating music as a job,for me it is...but it is also something that I'm very passionate about,which is why I take lessons when I
can and why I practice whenever I get chance.I'm constantly trying to become a better musician.

[peteb]

[quote name='Pete Academy' post='1359159' date='Sep 1 2011, 07:52 PM']I'm exactly the same. Nothing more to add. Wish I'd learned more theory skills, but I was busy having fun instead. I have lost gigs through not being able to read, but what the hell. I can compose my own stuff by ear.[/quote]
In more than 30 years of gigging, generally with good quality players (some who have been in bands with decent record deals, some who have toured the world as sidemen with household names) I have never lost a gig thru not being able to read!

I have however lost gigs thru not being able to sing very well.......

[Dood]

[quote name='silddx' post='1356833' date='Aug 30 2011, 08:52 PM']Over the past couple of months, I have hardly played bass at home, but I play guitar every day. And when I go to rehearsals as a bassist and play songs we know, and work on new songs, I am a much better bassist. I am more fluid, more imaginative, more dynamic, more expressive and more comfortable. I am also playing more with a pick and right hand damping more. Along with the volume pedal which has become a large part of my natural style, I am really feeling it now, not just mechanical.

I am a much better player through not playing at home. Not that I am advocating this approach you understand.

I am finally happy not being a reader, I got fed up of feeling guilty about it and shed that stupid burden.

I am a happy bassist (for a f***ing change ).[/quote]

Hi Nigel! Ahhh I totally have to agree with the advantages of playing Guitar as well as Bass. I've always played Guitar and a very little Keys too, but after many years of tinkering with drum kits I finally have a lil kit of my own. I've been watching Bob Gatzen and Jo Jo Mayer DVDs, learning all the really geeky stuff like different stick grips too. I've found that my playingbhas taken yet another step up and not only am I enjoying playing a bit of drums, bass has taken yet another new lease of life too. That's great because I've notched up about 22 years playing now and I'm still in love with the damn thing!!!

[steve-bbb]

[quote name='Faithless' post='1358934' date='Sep 1 2011, 04:12 PM']Oh my.. It's just not funny. The thing is - you don't become better at something by [b]not [/b]doing it.
If you needed a break, and now feel fresh coming back, then that's fine, but stating that you got better is just wrong.
Not wrong for you, Sildx, but wrong for those upcoming players who read this and catch on this.

I probably wouldnt be arsed to go into this, but stuff like this reminds me of hundreds of young players catching Jaco's quote on "Being able to do it without practising" the wrong way.

If there are any upcoming players, who need info on practising and getting better [u]through [/u]working, then there is some material for you to check out:

[url="http://www.joehubbardbass.com/332/bass-guitar-practice-principles-part-1/"]http://www.joehubbardbass.com/332/bass-gui...nciples-part-1/[/url]

All questions are welcome via PM.

Easy
Laimis[/quote]


I think the whole improving without practising thing should come with a caveat about AGE/EXPERIENCE

clearly as a newbie player to stop practising will simply lead to little or no development whatsoever

but for experienced players (in my case old and cynical) then stopping the practising i believe does help because it does give your brain chance to forget dirty habits that youve fallen into over the years

i personally stopped playing for 15-16 years and just resumed six months ago - whilst my technique and finger strength have not returned to their youthful prime ( ) i have definitely noticed a few general things about my playing and mainly that i ma a lot cleaner and more precise (and slower!) through not playing - its as if i picked my bass up six months ago and my brain kinows how i 'should' be playing and has gone straight into that groove (rather than 'how i used to play' with all the dirty sloppy lazy technique that just creeps up on you unless you beat it back with the chair and whip)

hope that makes sense

[xilddx]

[quote name='Doddy' post='1359407' date='Sep 2 2011, 01:41 AM'][b]Why is it 'disparaging of people's natural inquisitiveness' to suggest that they should study alongside playing what they enjoy?[/b] And it's not
really idealistic either is it? There are tons of players who play in rock or pop bands yet study jazz or theory or whatever. Studying music
isn't going to take away your creativity or your expression-if anything,it will give you more tools and options with which to express yourself
on your instrument.

As for treating music as a job,for me it is...but it is also something that I'm very passionate about,which is why I take lessons when I
can and why I practice whenever I get chance.I'm constantly trying to become a better musician.[/quote]
Hello mate. I said that because you are being prescriptive without context. If people are inspired and enjoy what they do, they will most likely naturally gravitate towards more formal study.

[xilddx]

[quote name='dood' post='1359490' date='Sep 2 2011, 08:49 AM']Hi Nigel! Ahhh I totally have to agree with the advantages of playing Guitar as well as Bass. I've always played Guitar and a very little Keys too, but after many years of tinkering with drum kits I finally have a lil kit of my own. I've been watching Bob Gatzen and Jo Jo Mayer DVDs, learning all the really geeky stuff like different stick grips too. I've found that my playingbhas taken yet another step up and not only am I enjoying playing a bit of drums, bass has taken yet another new lease of life too. That's great because I've notched up about 22 years playing now and I'm still in love with the damn thing!!![/quote]
Drums is another thing, I love playing drums, but I sadly have to sell my kit because the impact on my hands and wrists is taking its toll now. I only play for pleasure anyway, I like hitting them quite hard German grip is my favourite, softer on the hands. Hope you have great fun with your new kit, mate!

[xilddx]

[quote name='steve-bbb' post='1359544' date='Sep 2 2011, 09:38 AM'][b]I think the whole improving without practising thing should come with a caveat about AGE/EXPERIENCE[/b]

[b]clearly as a newbie player to stop practising will simply lead to little or no development whatsoever[/b]

but for experienced players (in my case old and cynical) then stopping the practising i believe does help because it does give your brain chance to forget dirty habits that youve fallen into over the years

i personally stopped playing for 15-16 years and just resumed six months ago - whilst my technique and finger strength have not returned to their youthful prime ( ) i have definitely noticed a few general things about my playing and mainly that i ma a lot cleaner and more precise (and slower!) through not playing - its as if i picked my bass up six months ago and my brain kinows how i 'should' be playing and has gone straight into that groove (rather than 'how i used to play' with all the dirty sloppy lazy technique that just creeps up on you unless you beat it back with the chair and whip)

hope that makes sense[/quote]
I completely agree with this and probably should have made that a bit clearer in my OP. I've been playing for over 30 years and have a well developed ear and pretty decent technique.

The primary tool for my musical endeavours is my musical sense, taste, compositional skills, and my personal way of expressing all these. The less I play, the brighter the beacon of music is in my mind. When the beacon increases its luminosity it inspires me to do focused practice on my weaknesses because I have a compulsion to play something that's in my mind, or that is required by one of my bands. A tiny revelation can spark this off. I played in my studio for about three and a half hours last night on electric and acoutsic guitar, drums, and lastly, about half an hour of bass just sitting on the sofa with no amplification. I was doing things on the bass I have never done before, interesting challenging things that I theoretically don't understand, and it inspired me even more!

[Faithless]

[quote name='Gust0o' post='1359289' date='Sep 2 2011, 12:19 AM']What band are you in, tiger?[/quote]

Me? I'm currently working for country's biggest commercial TV, sitting in its house-band and playing for the biggest pop acts in the country.

Anyway, how does your question relate to what I said in my previous post?

[xilddx]

[quote name='Faithless' post='1359997' date='Sep 2 2011, 03:40 PM']Me? I'm currently working for country's biggest commercial TV, sitting in its house-band and playing for the biggest pop acts in the country.

Anyway, how does your question relate to what I said in my previous post?[/quote]
Wow congratulations man! When did that happen?

[Wil]

[quote name='silddx' post='1359647' date='Sep 2 2011, 11:18 AM']I completely agree with this and probably should have made that a bit clearer in my OP. I've been playing for over 30 years and have a well developed ear and pretty decent technique.

The primary tool for my musical endeavours is my musical sense, taste, compositional skills, and my personal way of expressing all these. The less I play, the brighter the beacon of music is in my mind. When the beacon increases its luminosity it inspires me to do focused practice on my weaknesses because I have a compulsion to play something that's in my mind, or that is required by one of my bands. A tiny revelation can spark this off. I played in my studio for about three and a half hours last night on electric and acoutsic guitar, drums, and lastly, about half an hour of bass just sitting on the sofa with no amplification. I was doing things on the bass I have never done before, interesting challenging things that I theoretically don't understand, and it inspired me even more![/quote]

Like.

This is what it's all about for me - giving the music in your head a chance to pour out of it's own accord.

[Faithless]

[quote name='silddx' post='1360100' date='Sep 2 2011, 06:43 PM']Wow congratulations man! When did that happen?[/quote]

Thanks, mate - well, audition happened in the end of April, I think, but I got the call only in the mid of July (when I broke my arm through over-pracitising... ) - on Monday we pulled TV season opening (and European Basketball Championship too - Great Britain team is playing there too)..

You can check it out there:

[url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AGjdw_2PZ6c"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AGjdw_2PZ6c[/url]

You will unlikely see the band (at 3:26 at the best), but we were there..

easy
Laimis

[xilddx]

[quote name='Faithless' post='1360496' date='Sep 2 2011, 10:11 PM']Thanks, mate - well, audition happened in the end of April, I think, but I got the call only in the mid of July (when I broke my arm through over-pracitising... ) - on Monday we pulled TV season opening (and European Basketball Championship too - Great Britain team is playing there too)..

You can check it out there:

[url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AGjdw_2PZ6c"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AGjdw_2PZ6c[/url]

You will unlikely see the band (at 3:26 at the best), but we were there..

easy
Laimis[/quote]
Fabulous, great tone and great playing mate, congratulations on the gig! You'll have to forgive me for this, but you often come across as a bedroom hero and a little bit arsey sometimes (that's English for being a bit of a prick ) Some of your YT vids are not a reflection of what I see and hear on that house band vid, there is little feel on those, but in this BIG pop vid you have loads of punch and emotion. I saw you on this house band vid seriously giving it some, lipstick and everything!

You should be very proud, congratulations!

Best wishes,
Nigel

[Doddy]

[quote name='Faithless' post='1359997' date='Sep 2 2011, 03:40 PM']Me? I'm currently working for country's biggest commercial TV, sitting in its house-band and playing for the biggest pop acts in the country.

Anyway, how does your question relate to what I said in my previous post?[/quote]

That's awesome dude. Nice one.

[Faithless]

Thanks, guys, I really appreciate it!

easy
Laimis