JTUK

I am seriously thinking I need a P Bass 4 as they are so versatile... Just about any gig can take a P and that is why they remain 'the' choice, IMO.

I liked the twinvalve I had as it was the only TE I got along with..and made sense of that ghastly gp7 EQ stage. Even putting in a pre valve couldn't do that..and also by the time they'd gone down that road, the competition had moved way ahead. Not sure I'd use one for training, IIUC..?? I'd get a more resiliant SS amp for that sole purpose. I'd be more keen to gig a Twinvalve if I wanted to own one. But yes, their twinvalve was amongst their very best efforts amp-wise, IMO

[quote name='Jenny_Innie' timestamp='1418113711' post='2626866'] So, could I ask a technical question about these cabs? If I add a 12 Ohm version of the Retro Two10 to a Gen 2 Barefaced Compact (8 Ohm of course) - what would the resultant impedance be? I saw on one of those online calculators that it would be 4.6 Ohms. Is that right? Would seem sort of ideal if that's correct? [/quote] On paper, your thinking is ok, and the reason why 115 and 210 was a good mix was because the power ratings were around the same at 300w per cab. But..as others have said, this may not work with your models so best to get advice or try them first.

TH500 for me over the LM. I can push the TH to 1 on both dials and that is plenty loud. It still retains a faithful sound and so therefore 'amps' up well. I find the LM sounds great at low volume but loses that 'focus' when driven and I am alway having to drive amps. The LM gets harsh and hard and a bit sterile to me which is why I've never liked them or been convinced. The TH does not have hi sheen, but I've never found it lacking there and am a bit bemused by people who say it lacks there...and this coming from someone who has a toppy sound...!! I don't say the TH500 is the only answer and it has limitations as a class D... but less so that the others, I've tried, I think it will suit old skool as Aguilar have targetted and stolen Ampegs market and just do that all better...again, IMO. I would say the PF500 is a reasonably close second to the TH for a certain sound and if they have sorted the reliability issues. Some in the trade say they have, going by the lack of returns of late..???

I think experience teaches you if the gig is worth a spare or not... I've broken a string once on a gig in ...er..eons, but I've had a bass go down with the battery connect came loose and I had to repair that in the time I had before the start. I take a spare mostly and tune them both up and I might even decide my no 2 bass is on the gig if it sound-checked better. I use to swap them for tracks but since they are set up the same, I'll choose which is the main gig bass and stick with it through..mostly. I travel with basses in a gig bag so it isn't a problem to carry a spare.

I've always made the distinction between functions and other dates and stages re dots

It isn't so much the now.. it is 20 years down the line and it is those sort of guys you'll be wanting to use as they have experience, and range and frontman abilities. But 20 years of hard use can kill a voice. One of the best singers round here never used monitors and sang over a loud band so he was straining most nights... He has had to give up now. I think its is something that a lot of singers just aren't aware of... so this might be a wake-up call for some to do something about it before it is too late...?? Longevity is the reason why I don't beat the hell out of my bass..or beat my hands up doing it..same sort of thing, IMO.

It is not april yet is it..??

[quote name='chris_b' timestamp='1418121308' post='2626966'] Sorry, but I don't believe any sane audience member "walked out of a gig" without hearing the band, because there were music stands on stage. It might make a good story, but I just don't believe it. As is being said, the band can be good, bad, professional or a bunch of amateurs, but there are far better ways of judging that band than their use of stands. Anyone who hates a band without hearing them isn't someone whose judgement I'll take seriously. [/quote] Do you think some people would take a look at the band and decide the image that band portrayed wasn't for them... i.e the band were in biker jackets and had long hair and were all round scruffy...etc. I could easily imagine some people would decide that wasn't for them.. same with stands. It doesn't matter what their judgement is like, it doesn't matter that they may be wrong. In one or two of the pubs I am thinking of, I can well see people walking out before hearing them.... they might have seen enough. Personally, I know when some bands are going to work or not without hearing them play their set... I can do that with drummers within a few seconds... but agree I might stay for a while to have my 'fears' confirmed... A regards stands, I've been party to both camps but for rock n roll gigs, stands look quite silly, tbh.

[quote name='stingrayPete1977' timestamp='1418072084' post='2626621'] And maybe some suggestions of what they should wear just in case they thought they were out to enjoy themselves rather than nit pik every aspect of the band!? Lol [/quote] That is only after half of them have walked out of the pub.. It is tough gig round here.. The better gigs aren't really open to all bands as the rosta is good enough to be picky with. The LL..who may or may not get it, will decide if he likes your set, likes you, punters likes you.. - which is likely led by the LL's opinion, likes your singer, thinks you are too loud... If they can afford to be picky, then that may or may be up for grabs... and judging by the standard of the bands there are more than a few that don't get invited back. It is more perception than anything else.. and I've done pelnty of gigs with both, but playing AC/DC with music stands doesn't quite work and that is what most of the bands round here do.. that and Thin Lizzy.

^ Does this take into account depreciation...as you'll lose 25% from new prices straight away... basically retail VAT and a bit more.

You might get a better more reasonable valuation off here if you list the kit and model. 5 year old kit might not have much real value..he knows this which is why he probably wants to keep the more desirable/useful elements. The mixer might only be worth it to him because he wants it.. it may not be worth what he has listed. The valuations are worth nothing until you actually achieve those prices and posession is 9/10ths so I'd get all 4 boxes to you and then think about selling them... If you get £400 for 4 boxes, and take the £63 ... then that seems as good a deal as you'll get I'd reconcile the values and get rid as soon as poss....

[quote name='No lust in Jazz' timestamp='1418046181' post='2626231'] [color=#222222]That said, I have used a Walkabout 12 on and off for the past six years and I have never had an issue with hearing myself on stage, this combo has covered a whole range of gigs from garden parties and wedding functions through to sizeable beer and blues festivals without issue.[/color] [color=#222222]The wider point that comes from threads that I read on here regarding gear, is that as bass players we're very good at seeking great tone, which often take the form of 'cab voicing' debates, or competing and cutting through the mix against busy drummers and guitarists which lead to more powerful gear or larger speaker area debates, but for me it’s the overall contribution to the music that matters the most and I'll settle for hearing the notes that I'm playing with the band[/color] [color=#222222]If I want a great tone this is best delivered by the Walkabout into a 1x15” – I wouldn’t gig this though, as the nuances and timbres would be lost in the mix and render it pointless.[/color] [color=#222222]I don't see any rights or wrongs in this thread, but if you want to carry big amps and cabs, go for it.[/color] [/quote] No one would be more anal about hearing every note I play, than me and of course, there is a saturation point.

Rod Stewart was on the TV last night and it touched on his history before going solo quite a bit. Jeff Beck, Faces, and who split them up. Rod and Kenny Jones said it was Ronnie Wood going to the Stones that was the catalyst to Stewart going solo, which might be 'correct' but it was always going to happen. That Kenny Jones boy was in the right place quite a few times..

ahhh cross post.

[quote name='FuNkShUi' timestamp='1418041523' post='2626171'] Our singers issue is he has never been in a band before. So this is all brand new to him. We have played about 10 gigs now, and his voice is excellent. But he has no experience. So all these remedies and potions other more experienced singers may have picked up, he has none. He had a cold the week running up to the gig, but his voice was fine so he thought he would be fine to sing. Hopefully next time, he will be a little more aware of how he's feeling. [/quote] Tell him to go and find a 'good' vocal coach who can teach them to look after and prepare their voice. This should have short term advantages but also might help preserve their voice and range much later on...

[quote name='chris_b' timestamp='1418031803' post='2626051'] On Wednesday I'm gigging with a "power" Blues/Rock trio. We will be [i]very[/i] loud and I'll be taking 3 Berg 12's, 800 Thunderfunk watts and both volume controls will be set to at least 12 o'clock. I don't know if that will equate to 300-400 watts actual volume through the speakers but but the one thing I do know; Phil, I don't disbelieve your science but 1 112 wouldn't get anywhere close to the volume I'll need. I wouldn't even risk 2 12's at this volume. I know it's mad and I never played this loud when I had my Marshall and Hiwatt stacks in the 70's, but the one thing that I'm trying to do with this rig is be loud enough to keep up with the guitarist, be clearly heard in all parts of the room, keep a good tone in the process and be able to carry the cabs out of the gig at the end of the night. Parts of this rig are also used for gigging with an acoustic guitarist. Modularity is an important option with this gear. [/quote] Quite... A 212 should be enough on a smaller stage or quiet band levels on a larger stage. An acoustic drum will have quite a large dynamic range. To be a monitor for me, I'll use a 750w into 4 ohms amp and a 212 and 210. ( it is probably capable of putting out a good sound at around 600w or so and anymore and I'll hear the 210 start to struggle...) There will be spillage and this might get into mics but there is also a volume control which will be set up an sound check. The sound check will have just bass running on the stage with drums for a basic level..and then others will ask for bits and pieces in their monitors.... IF the P.A has 4 mon mixes or a stage mix... My point is that you don't know if you don't have the P.A spec..and even then..what you request and what is delivered can be two different things. I just say take what you are VERY confident will cover that gig... but sorry, a single 112 is very unlikely to be it... unless the band is very quiet, has In-ears ( then they'd probably not want amps on stage either ) or have 'produced' the stage spec... If you are getting stylists in to sort out the band image, part of that will also be what looks ok on stage as well, but for our level, a 112 cab will struggle and so will certain 212's.. Depending on the gig depends what sort of stage volume you can go for as well... Bands should know this which is why they'll have plugs as well... and be prepared to use them.

I think a lot of vocalists know when their voice is likely to go... so they will have their soothing remedies, but I'd have no compunction about getting a dep in on the date and brain-storming a set that would get us through... Depends on the gig though.... and if it is really important, then the vox will be working on getting their vox in shape all week..??? hopefully.

[quote name='EssentialTension' timestamp='1418033430' post='2626066'] I don't see how any of that has got anything at all to do with whether or not there's a music stand. [/quote] You'd empty half the pubs round here if you put up music stands for a 'rock' gig...before you even started. For jazzers, totally acceptable as the band leader will have a pad for horns and some pretty obscure tunes that his 'dep' band would be lost of... plus they will probably play a lead horn. The point about the 'playing' is about the gears the band will go through if they get hold of the tune... and for that you are going to have to be all ears... you can't be reading it. I get vocal prompts on a pad at foot level and out of sight, but if you are a playing covers bands, which is what most pub bands have to try and be... there is no place for stands... not round here, IME. For low key gigs where the band isn't really taken much notice of or 'watched', then nobody will notice anyway... It seems like we are getting into no dots, can't play it, or dots and can't read it anyway but the difference is, to me.. more of a performance or more of a 'recital'..both have their place...but..??

[quote name='EssentialTension' timestamp='1418026426' post='2625993'] Around here people dance at pub gigs. Know your market. [/quote] We do..and no music stands in pubs whether they are dancing or singing.. It is only 25 songs to remember and play well... Even deps don't put up a stand, they'll look at the sheet at the start of the track for a change or two and then they get down to playing..or we wouldn't have them back. There is a differnet between performance and tunes for tunes sake. We'd want the guy to 'play' the part ..not interested in playing by numbers.. Would it be a hard and fast rule..?? not with the set we do, but for a regular guy, then no..

I am always amazed how many singers seem to have no regime for looking after their voice.. One of the reasons why we don't/can't do more than 2 hrs... Talking to mate in the U.S and he says they have 5 main singers in the band and that that equation is more important than how they play.. but then they play ridiculously long gigs.. 4x45 hrs plus 1 hr..!! You've got to love the band to do that..!!!

Going round in circles here... How do you know what stages you get to play...? Is it a question you routinely ask..? do you use a stage tech rider etc etc Do you get one..?

If you are a function gig then no one cares as they are dancing to a musical juke box... but they go to watch a band in a pub first and foremost and reading those sort of gigs is boring to watch... and possibly boring to hear. People know which gig is which and which gig they are 'acceptable' at.. I think you can have visual prompts, but don't think they should be visable. A pub gig is by no means a serious gig but you wouldn't be taken very seriously by punters if you used a lot of charts and you'd be a filler band and not one of the better draws around here. Know your market...

[quote name='stingrayPete1977' timestamp='1417976609' post='2625682'] There isnt a gig where my 2x12 would lack enough stage volume, if that was running flat out and the rest of the band were matching it then it's not a stage I want to be sharing [/quote] Stage not big enough then... 500w isn't really man enough, IMO. and running it flat out wouldn't be a good sound as most of these amps can't handle it.