JTUK

[quote name='Froggy' timestamp='1423520887' post='2685983'] I don't think JTUK's comment is harsh at all, I think it's very pertinent. After all my experience is very limited, I've asked the question to hear advice from you all who know much more than I do. In answer, I've been concentrating on scales, arpeggios, patterns and grooves in my lessons. My teacher will often give me a bass line and chord progression which I'll play over a drum track with him playing guitar. I guess it's a bit like jamming, and I'm encouraged to change the line if I think of ways to improve it. As for what I can play, I'd say only 3 songs in all, and they're simple ones. Come as you are by nirvana, the chain by Fleetwood Mac, and Lady marmalade by pretty much everyone. (yeah, I have eclectic tastes) but I've learned these within a couple of hours practicing, and I play them regularly to tighten them up. oh, and a 12 bar blues that my teacher gave me, but the name escapes me. Playing with my teacher is why I think my timing is good, he says that I keep in time really well. One thing this thread has shown me, I may not be ready, but when I give it a go, not to let the knock backs disheartened me. ............... [/quote] Froggy, which style do you play..fingers or plectrum? The tracks you mentioned are indeed a mix, The Chain is more than the riff at the end...so assume you know that..? and a 12 bar learnt well will pretty automatically add another 50 or so songs to your knowledge base straight away.. especially if you can shift the key of them. If you can play fingerstyle, then a good test of time and technique is to play Stereophonics 'Dakota'. It is a rigid straight 8 part for bass and the trick is to get it smooth across the changes and the first change is difficult because it is down a tone and a half ( 3 frets ) on the same string so you need to decide how to fret the first note ( typically an E on the A string, 7th fret. A tough choice between 3rd or pinkie which is hard to fret cleanly but makes the step down easy... or use the index and get in a mess changing down as the landing freting finger will also be the index finger needing you to shift the whole left hand quicklt, precisely and cleanly within the time between notes. You can't miss or waver here, unfortunatley.. Anyway, if you can do the whole verse with good time and consistancy and make it sound even, then I do indeed applaud you as I see many players at gigs who can't do that. A plectrum makes that sort of thing much much easier, but it is beyond more than a few finger players that I see. The 'lesson' in this is to get the straight 8 notes firm and rigid, consistant ... and er,... straight 8th notes ( quavers ) and the song fails totally if the bass can't do this Anyway... if anything I've said doesn't make too much sense, then maybe ask your teacher to explain as again, these are the types of terms people will throw at you in a musical environment. Just an exmaple of an easy song butchered because it isn't actually as easy as it seems. It is harder to play these type of lines at this stage than lines that move around a bit more and have space as they are more forgiving .. Dakota is no let-up bass wise.

[quote name='discreet' timestamp='1423517998' post='2685909'] Well I think it does no harm to get out there regardless. You might embarrass yourself but nobody's going to die and it is by far the quickest way to improve. Isn't that what punk was all about? Anyone can pick up an instrument and have a go? [/quote] it was..but 90% of it was sh*te..IIRC

[quote name='SpaceChick' timestamp='1423513224' post='2685827'] JTUK - I think you are coming across as quite harsh in your last post. I'm sure we were all ropey when we started out. However, everyone has to start somewhere in a band environment and I think if Froggy can find others that want to play with him and he wants to play with then it will be a great development experience. ............ [/quote] I think getting out and playing is a great goal.. many never get out of the bedroom.. but you need to have realistic goals as like it of not, you will be judged in the harsh world even by the people you aim to play with... Also, I think learning on the job before you are ready is fine but you do the mistakes behind closed doors. Nobody wants to be crushed in a live playing arena. I think Happy Jacks timescale is useful. I seem to recall my first 'gig' within a year but the audience was very very polite as the keyboards mum arranged it for her friends and when you learn as kids you are practising like a demon.. and I was still ropey. probably still am

[quote name='Froggy' timestamp='1423508976' post='2685733'] Good point Nicko, luckily I don't seem to have any issues with timing, but that's another thing for me to keep in mind. [/quote] I'd be interested in what you can play after 3 months and how you see that in a potential band context. Not wishing to embarrass you but a recent soundcloud clip put up was pretty ropey... again in context.. and the part was also pretty basic. Just trying to get a feel for what people think is workable and would be 'acceptable,

He is local here and his partner announced it .plus people closer to him haven't been able to contain it either. So I held off for a few days before posting. The news is about a week old so surprised it wasn't posted before. He plays local but wouldn't know about how he fits in as their drummer..

[quote name='xilddx' timestamp='1423392216' post='2684163'] Not that keen on those type of tones but they work for the sort of music he plays. He's good. [/quote] Yep, will go with that.. but then most of Mars's stuff has had a pretty chummy bass sound, IMO.. but having said that, it works for the tracks.

As in the title, and from people very close to Chris Slade, he is back out with AC/DC this year.

At 8 ohms I'd get the TH500. It doesn't have glassy highs, which are unusuable anyway, but it needs a cab that has higher end, IMO It has character without being too coloured.

Doesn't sound like a very capable chassis then..??? and you are running quite a signal into it where you can't or maybe don't always get to hear the chassis's struggling..? I'm old skool in that regard so I've always been paranoid that I don't have enough power in hand and also why I'm not into effects... using distortion? what's distorting..?? FWIW, I always try to get a sense of what the limit of a cab is by running it very hard and then using that as my limit at gigs. As for watts and power, I never take that as gospel as what should and what does happen can be too different things..

[quote name='EBS_freak' timestamp='1423438098' post='2684884'] Shame these cabs didn't break into the mainstream [/quote] I agree they seem to have all the right stuff to do so. I see plenty worse.... maybe they were too good..??

[quote name='Twincam' timestamp='1423432703' post='2684775'] Yeah to me this seems right, ive known mainly guitar players but other people who play various instruments. And while you do get these people who can play well, learn and gig in a short period of time this is the exception rather than the rule. I have 1 friend who was good enough in around a year of playing on guitar, he was a natural and put in the practice was also confident. But most people ive known have taken 3 plus years before they gigged. [/quote] It's not so much what they can play or think they can play... it is everything else as well. But if you get an early chance to get out into the real world, then go for it, just don't be surprised if you get knocked back..and getting knocked back is quite hard to recover from. I do think getting out there and trying all sorts is the thing to do... as you learn just as much from 'how not to do its, as you do from the good guys. But the simple fact is that with the best will in the world, good guys aren't going to really want to take you on. But onward and upward.. The worst musical situations, IMO, is the bunch of mates you've played with for eons, and no one is able to bring anything else in..as you've all learnt the good AND bad together but that is all you know..??

As for the tour. Get accomodation sorted to a standard that is acceptable....single rooms if poss and a decent meal at least once a day. BnB for hotel, and the promoter pays for the evening meal, along with a basic food/drinks rider.

[quote name='Lozz196' timestamp='1423476963' post='2685103'] Get absolutely hammered on the first night after the show, wake up feeling really rough and use this a a reminder to not to do it again until the last night of the tour. Apparently it`s a rotten feeling being hungover and having to go to all the tour places. I wouldn`t know about that as I didn`t suffer hangovers, but my band-mates did, and they used to look pretty fed up much of the time, when they really should have been enjoying a great experience. Other than that, eat and drink healthily - make sure you drink lots of water - and take enough clothes with you. If you`ve not got enough clothes, then take some febreeze with you, so that you can make your stage clothes smell nice and fresh for the gigs. [/quote] We had a band 'sack' their gtr for doing that...drove off and left him there, came back a couple of days later to 'collect' and put him on the flight home

As always, there are agents and agent here. Some just have a list of 'in's with venues and they will put their entire stable in there... That might work for the venue as they give everything to the agent, and the agent might work for their money, but for me it does really work. Basically, you have subbed out the job of getting the gig, which isn't that great a deal. However, if everyone else in the band gets paid the same, and I spend all the time hassling for gigs, I'm going to want to be paid admin, if I feel it a put-upon..!! This, unfortuneatley prooves to me that all in a band is not equal. Continuing with the local small agent, they are in that position as they are known for last minute type cover, and they have just broadened their scope. But the price for them throwing everyone one of their gigs at you, is that you work exclusively for them and they want commision on every fee you get..whether they got it for you or not..?? We have too many other points of contact to be able to ..or want to..do that, so we say we'll work on a one-off. This normally doesn't work as they want to stick with the 100% regular bands. I'd argue that they ( the agent ) are now working more for themselves rather than the client as some of their bands aren't always the most suitable.. Having looked at the rosta of these type of agents, the bands aren't even that good, so you don't want to be associated with their stable, and you are only probably losing £30 a gig anyway. We've given them a band price on a one-off basis, but we haven't really missed out on anything. If you are talking about weddings agents... I'm not sure I'd do that, but events organisers in London are a different ball game. We'd expect to pretty much double our party fee to go into town but I think we undercharge because I can't see an agent being happy with 10%/£200 for that sort of degree of organisation..?? Maybe a London party band using an agent/event org' can comment.

[quote name='stingrayPete1977' timestamp='1423433243' post='2684785'] If other bands were asking about the car you drive I'd never get a gig again![url="http://s997.photobucket.com/user/stingraypete/media/Mobile%20Uploads/2014-11/20141115_114018_zpsxgszovir.jpg.html"][/url] [/quote] What car as in...do you have one? You have to get rid of the jokers before you get off the phone

[quote name='LukeFRC' timestamp='1423421268' post='2684584'] I think it's important to make a distinction between gigs where that is important and gigs where it isn't. If I were a 19 year old wanting to get into the big time with my indie pop band then the ubiquitous Fender USA P or J would be an absolute necessity. If you were in a a beatles cover band then a violin bass would be it I guess.... on the other hand me turning up at church to play image really isn't important so as long as it works I can play what I want - the PA guys very much prefer my higher end stuff but some of the other guys play budget stuff. So it's important (for the sanity of this thread at least) to differentiate between the two extremes and suggest that all bands lie between the two somewhere. Also it strikes me that ability plays a part. I imagine if I came to audition to dep for your band and brought my couple of Warwicks I might be nicely asked to go away. I imagine is Pino, or someone of his ability, turned up with the same bass the playing would be what matters. [/quote] Well, since sound is very important, getting a sound out of your gear is the issue. With regards to a keyboard gig, we want 3 core sounds, Acoustic piano, Organ and elec Piano..and a decent synth sound as a bonus. Some keyboards can't even manage one good sound, so if someone turns up with something that sounds bad or poor, then that isn't going to work... same with drums, gtr and anything else. It kind of defines the deal you bring to the gig. You don't need the best gtr/amp to sound good but whatever you do have needs to sound good. There is nowhere to go if you don't sound any good... My point really relates to a keyboard who turned up with a 61 key piano which frankly didn't cut it soundwise, and he ran that thru a poor monitor and headphones. The band couldn't hear him and neither could the audience..even tho he ran thru the P.A as well. So whilst he came with a good local reputation, you couldn't hear him contribute the the sound of the band...and the few times when he played the intro to a song, you heard the core sounds just weren't there either.. It did make me question the recommendation as well....hence, that is why that is one of the first things we ask.. what kit? what monitoring? what car? etc etc

[quote name='dadofsix' timestamp='1423424633' post='2684621'] One of the great problems with being too critical of yourself is that it makes it too easy, sometimes, to be too critical of the musicians you are playing with at the moment. That doesn't speak well to enduring musical friendships, or bode well of band rehearsals being productive while also being enjoyable. [/quote] Sure, if you are hard on everyone else, you should be at least as hard on yourself, but this is the driver and you'll find a level, and hopefully you'll go thru that level. You should always try and play up a bit but you don't want to be playing down unless you aren't at all bothered.. The best musical relationships are borne out of mutual respect and the sense that no one is a passenger

I wouldn't touch this myself as cabs are 'engineered' to the spec of the Chassis and putting any unit in a box is more than just that it will fit. You could try it and see what it sounds like but I'd just pick a cab I like the best and sell the other one..or rotate either on a whim, for the gig

[quote name='stingrayPete1977' timestamp='1423404481' post='2684363'] You need to give us a clue as to which one now JT, lol [/quote] I've met about 10... so maybe 10% is average. I'd be surprised if it was that low tho, tbh..

I do think the correct gear for the gig is important so if it look crap and sounds about the same, then I'd not want it on the gig, tbh. When we've had deps in, we've learnt to ask what they'll bring as turning up with inappropriate kit is somewhat insulting. By the same token, when we get together and decide what sounds are needed, a keyboard, for example, needs to have very good sounds and if it doesn't, its not on the gig, and probably neither is the player. That's not snobbery, IMO, that is just picking the right person with the appropriate gear.

I prefer a larger stage and definietly a barrier between the audience and the band. How large depends on the monitoring and we tend to take up enough room but don't want to be too spread out where the band is disconnected and more to the point, looks it. I'd far rather these gigs that squeezing in a corner...so much so, that unless I have room to move a few steps each way, we wont be doing the gig again. When we gig in halls, marquees or where the stage needs to be built, we specify 24x16ft

[quote name='stingrayPete1977' timestamp='1423393572' post='2684192'] When you think as bass players we are concerned about how thick the paint is regarding amplified tone of it in a live mix it is amazing any of us have ever seen a naked lady never mind actually touching a real one possibly even in a rude place! [/quote] That the nature of the place... potentially full of weirdo's altho of the ones I've met here, only one would come close to qualifying for that...

Don't expect too much after 3 months. If you are of a gigging standard after 3 years, you'll be doing well. It's all relative...

[quote name='essexbasscat' timestamp='1423388699' post='2684114'] Just thinking around this one. How does one tell what the problem is ? after all, in many cabs there's the crossover and tweeter as well as the main driver Is it possible the problem may be something other than the driver ? loose wire ? Just some ideas [/quote] Take it apart and isolate every unit. Apart from a loose/bad connection, it's a fair bet one unit has 'blown' or is failing. I'd turn off the horn and see if the problem can still be heard and then connect one speaker up and test that...etc etc

You need to trust them and be on the same page. What is a great gig for them is 10/15 % but you the ones who have to honour it. So, I'd be very wary about where they are putting us as they don't play the shi*holes, but they get paid for you to..?? Personally I'm very picky about what gigs to play so I'm not doing them just so someone else can make money. I'd only use them for what gigs I couldn't get myself but I'd not be using them in pubs. Basically, you have to think that they get half what you get and it depends whether that is worth it to you.