Monkey Steve

While I'm sure that the OP was nothing but diplomatic and sensible in his dealings (and really, the whole issue of wanting to book gigs and then cancel them once his holiday is arranged, that's just out of order) a mate tells me of one of his former bands where the entire band except the BL quit purely because of the BL's blind dedication to the band. My mate had departed a couple of years previously on good terms, but noted at the time that the semi-retired BL was happy to live in the back of a transit and devote all of his spare time to the band, and didn't seem to allow for the rest of the band having jobs and needing to get up for work five days a week. the band was actually doing very well - loads of gigs, albums released, management in place, but it wasn't a living for any of them, and it seemed that the BL's attitude ground them all down over time

On a more general note (not just the hotel rooms) I tend to think that the gigs we've done where the promoters/venues have been the worst have typically been the ones where the band made this mistake of expecting them to know how to do their side of things properly, and haven't bothered checking arrangements beforehand. Still, you live and learn...sometimes more slowly than you'd hope... The most memorable one was turning up at a pub and being told that they hadn't really thought about where the band would be set up, and being directed to an alcove off one of the two bars, with no electrical sockets, and no room for any punters to fit in the bar once we'd finished setting up. Which wasn't a huge problem because, unsurprisingly, they hadn't actually told anybody that there would be a band playing that night so we had half a dozen of our mates and two regulars who sat in the other bar and complained about the noise. Turns out the pub had an entertainment budget from the brewery and was seeing what having bands on would be like. Other examples of being told that we're to play in a particular area of the pub, but the pub then expect us to shoo away the drinkers that are already there, and move the furniture so that we can set up, usually finding that the pubs estimate of how much room a band would take up was way off. The best ones have always been venues that have a lot of music on so know what they're doing and what they need to tell the bands in advance, or the ones where the venue says that they want the band but don't really know what to do so could we come and have a look round ahead of the gig? Wouldn't suit every band, but I've done a couple of really good gigs in London at non-music pubs on the basis of the landlord asking me to pop in and have a chat about how it's going to work and what do I need them to do ahead of/on the day of the gig.

yep, that's my experience too. last time sharing with someone I had never met before that morning (he was doing the sound for the band I was depping with)...knew him considerably better by the end of the stay

totally agree with @12stringbassist It's like @dave_bass5 says, some people actually want to be in a band, some people just want to be able to tell everybody that they are in a band without having to do any of the hard graft like actually playing gigs And can't see that their attitude of only showing up when it completely suits them is at all unfair on the other members of the band. After all, they are "really committed" to playing when they aren't at their holiday home, or doing the weekly shop, or watching football, and it's a night that EastEnders isn't on... It's usually a short step from there to the "I only do this for enjoyment so if I'm not enjoying every second of it you shouldn't expect me to be here" speech, completely unaware that there are other people in the band who would be enjoying things a bit more if they weren't such a c#nt Why it's never a short step to actually looking for band mates who have a similar attitude and only want to play a handful of times during a year is completely beyond me

s'funny isn't it, there's always one in the band who does absolutely nothing but turn down gig dates because they don't suit him, or never reply to the messages asking whether they are free on a particular date, and they are always the person who complains the loudest about not having any gigs lined up In one of my old bands, the rhythm guitarist organised our first couple of gigs through contacts he had from another band, but then exploded and told everybody that he wasn't going to book any more because the lead guitarist did nothing but complain about how awful they were to play. So I then organised the next couple and he did exactly the same, just a little black cloud of misery about how badly organised everything was, how he wasn't happy with his sound and that was apparently everybody else's fault, etc. But it never once occurred to him that if he didn't like the gigs we were playing then he could book some himself

I read this quite differently It's not that the guitarist is saying that he doesn't want to do the gigs, or that more gigs are being booked than he is comfortable with, in fact he's saying that the band should be booking gigs, but that as and when he arranges his holidays he isn't going to pay any attention to gigs that are in the diary and those can just be cancelled If it was simply that the band wanted to do more gigs than the guitarist then there would be a very simple solution

Agreed - "Consideration" is the actual payment for the goods or services However, for Dave's benefit, Consideration is not required under Scottish law. Of course, enforcing the contract would require a trip to the Courts so unless Dave has a lot of time and money spare, whether or not it's actually a breach of contract is moot

He's completely out of order. Cancelling gigs is the quickest way to get a bad reputation amongst the people at the venues, especially if you're not an established band. It's not like the threads on here are completely understanding when venues have to cancel gigs, so the same applies for the band. Rule of thumb is that everybody in the band should stick to what gets into the diary first - if there's a gig you don't book a holiday for that date, if there's a holiday you don't book a gig. You never cancel a gig because one band member fancied a break and didn't care about playing the gig. My personal experience is that nobody ever remembers to use the band diary, but they damn well know how to use their own and once a gig is confirmed it should be set in stone. there should certainly be a band discussion about "I'm looking to book gigs in February, any dates you can't make?" and when somebody pipes up that they're thinking of going away that month and won't be able to commit until much closer to the time, that's fine, you don't book any gigs for February. Or February, March and April if he's being really vague about when he's going away. It shouldn't be a problem. Well, there might be a problem if you are all depending on gigs for your livelihood, but I'm assuming that it's not the case Too early to look for a dep?

I thinks it's getting happy with the level of commitment required, whatever that is. I'm more than happy to go out of my way if it helps the band and see things like late nights or early starts as a pretty minor inconvenience. Even having to travel by the rail replacement bus service on occasion - my attitude has always been that I expect to be at all rehearsals unless something very major prevents it, and am always frustrated by the band members who will cancel rehearsal at the drop of a hat for the slightest of reasons. Same with gigs - always do everything to make sure i can play a gig, even if it means cancelling something else that I had arranged (although, there is a sliding scale - easier to skip out on watching a band play or going for a drink, less simple to miss a family occasion that's been months in the planning) The last lot I played with involved two mid week practices a week that finished at 10.00 pm which in reality means 10.30 by the time I left, at least an hour on the train and half hour walk home, so generally I was lucky to be in before midnight. Not what i would have designed from scratch, but OK because I wanted to be playing with the band. It also helped that I have some flexibility around my working hours that let me catch up on sleep... YMMV, and it's not a criticism if that wouldn't work for others. For me playing in bands is my favourite thing to do, and I don't see my late nights and train trips as any different to the people I know who get up at sparrow's fart on a Saturday to go fishing, or drive half way across the country to take their kids to an athletics meeting But if it's not going to work then best to discuss it with the band sooner rather than later. maybe there's a compromise like @dmccombe7 suggests. In one old band of mine the drummer moved from Surrey to the Kent coast, and driving home after practice eventually wore him down. So to keep him in the band he kipped over at my place on practice nights

yeah, it depends. If it's a playing style issue then you can address it before it becomes a reason to sack somebody, or can have a grown up discussion so that everybody knows where they stand and the sacking won't be a shock if they don't pull their socks up. If it's a personality issue then you're going to have a hard time fixing it.

somewhere in between I've got through a fair few instruments, both guitar and bass, over the years. the ones that have stuck have tended to be the ones that I love to play and cannot be easily replaced, whether for sentimental reasons or because the model isn't made any more and it would be hard to find a match. Anything I don't really enjoy playing gets moved on reasonably quickly, and in times of financial need I'm OK with selling on any that don't have a sentimental value, or are simply a standard model that I can pick up when my finances improve, For instance, I'm on my third Lowden acoustic - love them, but in the past if i needed to raise cash in a hurry I haven't minded parting with them because it's pretty easy to find a replacement to exactly the same spec when I next have the funds. Same with Warwick basses - I'm on my fourth now and will almost certainly stick with that (because it's a custom shop Stage 1 built to my spec, including paint and inlays) but didn't worry about offloading the previous ones because I knew that I could always buy the same model (in fact they were largely moved on when I got a new Warwick that I preferred) My longest serving bass is my 1975 Rickenbacker 4001 that I got at 19, and I can't see that it will ever be sold because it's the one that means a lot to me - my only bass throughout my 20's, gigged regularly in my first serious band, etc. In fact my girlfriend of that time always said that in the event of my death, it would be the one thing of mine she would keep because it most closely reminded her of me. So that's never getting sold. Of my current collection: Never selling: Ricky (obvs), Fender Tele (dirt cheap USA version that I stripped, customised, and have battered to bits playing - not easy to replace), Warwick Custom Shop Stage 1 (to my specs). When it arrives I'm confidently adding my new Wal to this, again because it's to my specs, but this will be my third so maybe it should go onto the next list) Unlikely to sell unless I'm really hard up: 2 x Les Pauls of varying vintage and specs - no intention of selling if i can help it, and replacements to the exact specs would need a lot of tracking down, but I'm open to the idea that I might find other LPs that I like better; Not intending to sell but would be the most easy to move on if I do ever tire of them: 7 string Explorer; 1 Les Paul that I don't love as much as the other two; acoustic Ortega 5 string bass, FarWest UEB, Lowden acoustic

Latest update from the drummer (for those that have been wanting to know what happened) Seems that it will all resolve itself quite amicably. The incumbent drummer is absent due to some personal/family issues and has let the band know that he's probably not going to return, albeit that he hasn't quite quit just yet. So my mate will carry on depping for now, and has been asked whether he will join permanently if the original drummer does formally quit. He gets the spot in the band, and nobody is the bad guy

I feel your pain. Until I gigged it for a couple of shows at Christmas, my Rickenbacker had sat untouched for months, sometimes years at a time, and ungigged for more than a decade. I'll never sell it because it was my first proper bass and was solidly my number 1 choice for well over a decade, but I just never play 4 strings any more...that said, I have since used it for a one off 70's covers band, because 4 strings are all I needed, and the five string sat at home

yes - that's the scam They pay by PayPal and ask you to send it to a different address. Then then say that it didn't arrive, and regardless of whether you have tracking and can prove that it was signed for, PayPal gives them the money back (which they take from your bank account) because their Ts & Cs only offer the seller protection if you send it to the address registered on PayPal

it's been a journey... 30 odd years ago, I only had one bass, and that was the case for about the next ten years. Rickenbacker 4001 Since then I've always had a five string as my main bass, usually a Warwick, so my Ricky was initially relegated to being the spare that I would bring with me, and then left at home if I had another five string. Then about ten years ago the band i was in was playing a lot round London venues and transport was mainly by tube, so bringing a spare was a load of hassle for what was usually a 45 minute gig and I just stuck to whatever my main five string was at that time - either a Warwick or a Wal. Mostly the Warwicks because of how much thinner the necks were, but I would mix it up, and have had a couple of Warwicks at times and would take one to one gig, another to the next one, then the Wal. Got very used to changing strings ahead of gigs and regularly changing batteries, to prevent any disasters. But I did have one incident where the wiring for the input jack socket worked it's way loose, no way to quickly fix it, and no spare bass. Fortunately it happened in the last song of the set. Depped for a band at the end of last year and was umming and aahing about bringing a second bass - they had plenty of room in the van, but I wasn't that keen on bringing out a second bass if I was unlikely to use it. What made my mind up was them doing two songs in a different tuning, most in C, with a couple in E and not requiring anything below a low E...so rather than re-tuning between songs I brought back the Ricky for the stuff in E, and used my Warwick Stage 1 for everything in B Which is currently all of my electric basses...but I'm expecting my new Wal in the next few months so that may change the next time I play

If I'm conscious by then and remember, I'll tune in Hope it goes brilliantly

fair enough - I can only think of one where I've struggled to hear any bass at all, and even then I could hear just enough for staying in tune. less of an issue with a fretted bass and a tuner pedal than with a fretless, and I'd probably have kicked up more of a fuss if I'd been in your shoes

And I fundamentally disagree with the point you made that the performance will suffer if you can't hear yourself with your ideal sound on stage. You are somewhat misquoting me by suggesting that I said at any point that a good on stage sound will prevent there being a good FOH sound - I never said that. What I thought I was very clear about was that I personally don't see that having a bad on stage sound affects my performance Again, never suggested that you shouldn't be able to hear yourself at all, simply that as long as you can hear enough to be able to stay in tune and play with the rest of the band, the actual quality of the on stage sound doesn't matter

YMMV but I completely disagree about the on stage sound being linked to the performance - I've played gigs where i can hear myself perfectly and I've played gigs where I can barely hear myself beyond being able to tell whether I'm in tune or not, and I'm not aware of there being any difference in the performance It is definitely a mindset though, and I've trained myself to not care about what I sound like, and to only be bothered about hearing enough of the other instruments to get my cues, timing and tuning. The attitude is that the gig isn't for my benefit, it's for the audience, and as long as they can hear everything perfectly well my needs are a very distant second

I got into this when playing round London on multi band bills - easier to pack a VT Pedal than try and get my amp on the tube. It taught me not to worry about on stage sound as long as it sounds OK out front, and now I much prefer it: quick, easy, the soundperson is going to DI you anyway, and it saves a lot of space on small stages. If there's a small combo, or even a stack knocking about then I'll happily use that as a monitor rather than the PA monitors, but all the amp sound comes from the VT

somewhere I have the pickup cover for my Ricky 4001 Pointless bit of hardware, but I'll hang on to it forever more, should I ever want to part with the bass

I had a chat with a couple of lads at Download this year in a similar position - one of them worked at East Midlands Airport and there are always spare tickets knocking around so if you fancy going you ask and see if you get lucky. Although they reckoned that nobody ever asks so if you want to go you can guarantee that you'll get the tickets (and they didn't like heavy metal and had only gone to see Die Antwoord, and only then because it was free) Funnily enough, the only one I clearly remember from the Sunday was Pitchshifter - loved them

I was at both of those what surprises me is that while I remember some bands very clearly, there was a lot of bands on that I like and have little or no memory of seeing. Not sure if I didn't care about seeing them at the time, fancied something else on a different stage, or was just drinking elsewhere in Reading at the time

I also find it very interesting, not least because we often perceive people to be "odd" because they are a different personality type and react to things in ways that we cannot empathise with. I once went on a people management course for work and they had a whole afternoon of this sort of stuff, and made the point that most people are unaware of their personality type unless they are really at the extremes, and think that the other types are all rude! But most people have some extrovert traits and some introvert traits We did an assessment that put me right on the borderline between an introvert and extrovert personality, and the rest of the people on the course seemed surprised because they knew I played in bands and assumed that I must be an extrovert, whereas I wasn't shocked at all because I know what I'm like, and I don't enjoy meeting a room full of strangers. However, I know that I am comfortable where I am confident in what I'm doing - I can get up and do presentations as long as I know my subject, and I can get up and play bass because I know what I'm playing. And there's enough of an extrovert in me that I do actively enjoy playing live

Sir - take a bow I used to love going to the Reading Festival but haven't been for about ten years because over the last few years it went from being a festival about music to a festival as a right of passage experience for teenagers who have just sat their GCSEs and have been allowed off the parental leash. Deciding which bands to see seemed to be far less about listening to the music and watching the performance as being present while a band played so that they could say they were there That said, there was always plenty of good and varied music if you went looking for it - I remember a Sunday in 2000 where I saw most of Slipknot (not having heard any of their music previously) before popping across to catch some of Lauren Laverne's acoustic set and then wandering in to a tent to see some bloke by the name of Elliott Smith who I'd never heard of before playing an excellent set. Hopefully some of the kids will have been doing something similar this weekend