4000

[quote name='Waldo' post='907317' date='Jul 27 2010, 04:58 PM']I was going to make a joke about onions then 4000 [/quote] Maybe I should have left it; might've lightened the tone. If you'll excuse the pun.

[quote name='JTUK' post='907126' date='Jul 27 2010, 02:19 PM']Well, there you go. All the sounds I can't stand, you seem to love. Who cares? I stated my opinion and you can either live with it or not. It is a thread asking for opinions.[/quote] Absolutely; couldn't agree more. However what I find weird is that you seem to have it in your head that the artists in question are/were [i]wrong[/i] to use those sounds. Surely that's up to them? Neither of our opinions matter one jot really, it's [i]their [/i]opinions that count.

[quote name='JTUK' post='905118' date='Jul 25 2010, 07:26 PM']Not really, because everytime I have seen their work on TV, the worst tone they get is from their efforts with the more boutique basses basses. It just doesn't suit McVies basic style and some of the recordings have been woefully weedy the way they come across on TV/DVD. If ever there was an opportunity to fix something, that would be it...so I can only summise they wanted it like that... and for a RnB gig, he needs a good talking to, IMHO.[/quote] In your opinion. Which I don't share. Just because it's your opinion doesn't mean it's fact. As I already stated, I love the Alembic sound that both use, and prefer both sounds to any P Bass I've ever heard (with the posible exception of JJ Burnel). And this may surprise you, but my opinion is just as valid as yours. [quote]As for Entwistle, his early stuff is as good as he got for him, I think. His work with Moon was great because they were both all over the place... and when it came off, it was something, but they were also very scruffy sounding players hence the car crach comment. He would never be my type of bassist anyway but I agree the chemistry between Entwistle and Moon worked ...upto a point. You couldn't have planned that and got aweay with it... Do nothing for me.........and niether have a cultured enough style to make the typical Alembic sound work, IMV. At lest McCartney knows his limitations soundwise with his Hofner..[/quote]

[quote name='jazzyvee' post='903502' date='Jul 23 2010, 07:14 PM']It is an incredible sounding bass. The normal body wood of alembics tend to be mahogany, but this one is all maple except for the purpleheart laminates in the neck so it is a very up front, with a very powerful bright, and with a heavy meaty tone. I'm not used to having that level of high frequencies in my sound so it is going to take a bit of time before I can find my starting sound on it in a live situation. I agree with you on the justification angle and if I was to I focus on the price of them it is probably quite hard to justify. I think the cheapest ones are at least the price of 2 or three good quality pro basses. But I rationalise it to myself in this way. I've been a guitar player for years and years and it has taken me so long to find get a guitar that I'm completely happy with and to think what I spent on duffers to get here. So when I decided I wanted to start playing bass as well to broaden my gigging opportunities I just cut out the middle man well most of them and went straight to the source of where I thought my voice on bass would be. I think i have made the right choice. I appreciate that many people think they are over priced and not worth the money and dated etc etc. I do think the sound is not for everyone and it does take a while to get your head and ears round the way that the alembic electronics work so that it becomes second nature, but for me Alembic is sonic ecstasy. If I'm ever gigging down your way I'll let you know. Jazzyvee[/quote] Having owned 2 it makes complete sense to me!

The second time I saw Rich my mate (who is a drummer) came along. At one point he actually fell out of his chair with amazement. Anyway, back to the amazing Billy....

Absolutely; Macca is another example. But think we know what the OP means.

[quote name='Pete Academy' post='904228' date='Jul 24 2010, 06:49 PM']Probably the greatest drummer ever.[/quote] Love Cobham, but for me the greatest drummer ever, by a nautical mile, is Buddy Rich.

My 2 CSs have actually been possibly my least favourite sounding of my Rics, but yes, that's a reasonable example of a "typical" Ric sound (whatever that is). Check out Chris Squire (Yes), Bruce Foxton (the Jam) and Geddy Lee (Rush) for more of if not the same, then not dissimilar.

[quote name='dougal' post='901697' date='Jul 22 2010, 10:22 AM']Give a guitarist, any guitarist, a bass guitar, and he can play Mustang Sally in five minutes. Give a guitarist a proper bass and... it wouldn't be pretty. It's a guitar.[/quote] It's called a bass guitar, so I reckon that's what it is.

[quote name='Doddy' post='903987' date='Jul 24 2010, 01:33 PM']However I don't get Entwistle at all. I don't like his playing or his tone.[/quote] This is what I essentially said about Marcus and got a load of grief for. Works both ways doesn't it? Personally I'd take the Ox every day of the week, but each to their own.

[quote name='thisnameistaken' post='903709' date='Jul 24 2010, 01:22 AM']Actually his fuzzed-up flatwound sound on My Generation was the only time he ever sounded good. He sounded worse the more technology he threw at it.[/quote] In your opinion. Personally I think it was the worst sound he ever had, and he only arrived at it because he kept breaking the thin roundwounds on his Danelectros.

[quote name='JTUK' post='903535' date='Jul 23 2010, 08:25 PM']I preferred his sound in the earlier days....as much as I ever took notice of him ...but his stints with Alembic and the like didn't really work, IMV, for a rock sound. He has the same problem as McCvie with his efforts... too wimpy a sound for their type of bass/drums section. IMHO. Give these guys a freakin P-Bass[/quote] Seeing as they both used P-Basses at various times in their careers that's a strange thing to say. Completely disagree with the other comment BTW, although you're perfectly entitled to your opinion. Entwistle's Alembic sound is one of my favourite rock bass sounds of all time (I think the last thing it is is "wimpy"), and I love McVie's Alembic sound too.

[quote name='purpleblob' post='902885' date='Jul 23 2010, 10:12 AM']Totally agree. I think when a musician is still around and has an output of new music they end up, in a way, being a little forgotten, sometimes because their output reduces (or fluctuates) in it's quality other times just because we get used to their style and so maybe it's no longer different or because others have copied or extended their style to become the next "best" thing. Obviously Jaco's life was cut short and so to an extent we always wonder if he could have done even more amazing things. But Stanley Clarke (imo) is without doubt one of the greats. A pioneer every bit as important to the bass (if not more) than Jaco, but often forgotten because he's thankfully still with us. I write this whilst listening to his latest album As for the whole "who is best" type debates - these are pointless as it depends on the type of music you like, the type of musician you like and so on. It's not based upon some truly quantifiable measurement. If we could quatify and therefore score musicians it'd still be meaningless. So let's not concern ourselves with who is the best but instead just enjoy listening to them.[/quote] Were we separated at birth?

[quote name='jazzyvee' post='902622' date='Jul 23 2010, 12:23 AM']I'm a big fan of Stanley and he is by far my favourite bass player on electric and double bass. Yes he does have a trademark sound/ style and is easily recognisable on record but then isn't that what we are looking for as musicians, a sound that represents us. I don't see it as a bad or negative thing. I heard an interview by marcus miller where he suggested that people should be able to recognise who you are in two notes. Jazzyvee[/quote] I would completely agree, but I guess that takes us back to the stylist/versatility debate.

[quote name='XB26354' post='902646' date='Jul 23 2010, 12:39 AM']Funny, on this forum I've considered the revisionism has gone the opposite way. It is easy to knock a dead man. When I heard Jaco's first solo album and Heavy Weather it sounded like music from another planet. Stanley was and is great but came across to me as souped-up funk. Never liked his bass tone or his tendency to muck around with piccolo bass (who's the bass player Stan? Jimmy Earl!) He has had a lot longer to grow and change, and whilst I don't doubt for a minute that his playing was top notch, as others have said he hasn't really gone anywhere stylistically. And that's without any (perceived) mental disorders... Still, each to their own.[/quote] I wasn't talking about this Forum per se, I was speaking generally. Besides, even if Jaco gets knocked on here (although I'm not sure he does apart from possibly in response to a "Jaco is the best ever" kind of comment - you could insert anyone's name in that sentence and someone will have a go!) Stanley hardly gets a mention normally, which kind of proves my point. Whenever I read an article about the the true giants of the electric bass it always seems to be about Jaco. Not that he shouldn't be up there, obviously he should...but Stan should be up there with him. Personally I feel that even if you only make one statement, if that statement is strong enough then you've confirmed your place in history.

[quote name='EssentialTension' post='902740' date='Jul 23 2010, 02:55 AM']Firmly put, I think. I saw the Who with Pino Palladino playing bass a few years ago. For me his tone was so much preferable to Entwistle's and made the band sound better. Heresy maybe, but there it is.[/quote] Personally I don't thnk Pino suits the Who at all, so it's horses for courses. I also love pretty much every permutation of John's sound (the T-Bird sound least though) but I [i]like[/i] the "guitar" part of "bass guitar". Oh, and personally I think Phil Collins is a [i]great[/i] drummer, but if someone doesn't like him fair enough.

[quote name='MoonBassAlpha' post='902399' date='Jul 22 2010, 09:49 PM']Just out of interest, what was the electric sound like? Almost everytime I've seen him on telly it has sounded terrible, nothing like as nice as on record. Could that be just bad tv mix? I expect that close-up at Ronnies you hear exactly what's coming out of the amp.[/quote] I thought he had by far the best electric bass sound I've ever heard. It wasn't a thin nasal sound at all (he does sometimes sound a bit weird on more recent footage; maybe his live sound doesn't translate, although I know plenty of people who simply hate his sound regardless which is fair enough, each to their own); it sounded bloody huge, with teeth. I love how he uses the filters to sweep through completely different sounds for different phrases. I also loved his upright tone which was really clear and singing. FWIW, I love his Brown Album (one of my all-time favourite albums), but after School Days probably lost interest to a greater or lesser degree, not that that diminished to my eyes in any way what he accomplished prior to that. But live, certainly the last two times I've seen him (maybe not quite so much the first time with George Duke) he has just blown me away. Yes he does his thing, he has a distinct style, uses distinct phrasing and doesn't stretch too far away from that, but what a thing! IMO of course. As stated elsewhere, I'm far more interested in stylists and his style floats my boat big time. I actually bought Jaco's debut and Stanley's Brown Album on the same day many, many years ago; my dad suggested getting the Stanley album and I was like "yeah, whatever" (I'd never really heard either of them but had heard such great things about Jaco). I was expecting Jaco's to blow me away and wasn't that bothered about Stanley's; I listened to the Jaco album and thought "hmm, not really impressed", then put Stanley's album on and it blew my mind. Speaking of which, since Jaco died I feel like there's been a bit of revisionist history; all we ever seem to hear is how Jaco single-handedly changed the face of electric bass. Well when I was much younger and they were both around they were considered neck and neck at the top of the tree, which is how it should be. BTW Mike, looking forward to that interview.

[quote name='Pete Academy' post='902365' date='Jul 22 2010, 09:16 PM']On the early Beatles songs - which were my era - I can't hear anything special at all. I've often heard people mention him, but can't hear anything different from the other 60s bands. Please enlighten me to something that he did that was special.[/quote] Pete, I think he's a genius and you can't see it; remind you of anything?

Always been one of my favourites; in fact I suspect that he was my earliest influence (aged 8, 9 years before I touched a bass!) and I know he was an influence on many of my other favourites; utterly sublime.

Seen him 3 times now; early 80s, a few years back and last friday. Got something different every time.

If I hadn't just bought a very rare Ric I'd be trying to get that off you. In fact if I decide to let my new acquisition go, I might still be trying to get that off you!

I was at the last show on Friday. I was always a huge Stanley fan (one of my greatest bass heroes) but Friday was unbelievable. It was probably one of the 2 or 3 best gigs I've ever been to; the band was incredible and Stan played out of his skin. My favourite live bass performance ever by a long way, and that really is saying something.

[quote name='Spike Vincent' post='854263' date='Jun 1 2010, 10:31 PM']Somewhere in between Lemmy and Jah Wobble.[/quote] Nice one. Depends what I'm doing. If I was playing reggae, obviously I'd roll everything off. Playing noodly fusion, I'd aim for something that allows that, possibly more in a Janek / Richard Bona vein (I'd prefer to go more Stanley but I'd look a prune). For rock (which I tend to play most, although I'd probably class it more as power pop), I tend to favour something big, growly, trebly and slightly distorted (think Squire, Entwistle, Geddy or possibly a deeper-sounding Lemmy). It really varies according to the setting and song / passage though. Of course people's perceptions differ anyway; I always classed Chris Squire as trebly (in a good way) but a guy I used to know completely disagreed. I guess if you're used to active basses, hi-fi amps and tweeters then he's not trebly at all. If I have tweeters the first thing I usually do (although it depends on the guitar and the rig) is turn them off. I never have my amp flat, it's normally heavily eq'd. Unlike the OP, most of my life I've had to compete with distorted guitars and that has shaped my typical sound, although not to the degree that I stifle my natural tendencies; I probably compete for our guitarist's frequencies more than I should. I've always like the sound of flats on record but have never liked the sound I produce when playing them, at least up until playing an old Warwick Thumb with TIs in the Gallery at weekend. That was a revelation and I may buy myself a set to put on some bass or other in the future.