Vintage MIJ (formerly J@pCr@p) Spotting

[Metalmoore]

Thought i may show what some evil people are capable of... [url="http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/80s-ARIA-ZZB-EXXXX-EXPLORA-BASS-made-JAPAN-/120557650435?cmd=ViewItem&pt=UK_Musical_Instruments_Guitars_CV&hash=item1c11cbc203"]LINK[/url]

[Annoying Twit]

Aria Pro II Primary bass. I thought this looked a bit newer than the 1970s, but I've found quite a few references to them.

[url="http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Aria-Pro-II-Primary-Bass-/130389528637?cmd=ViewItem&pt=UK_Musical_Instruments_Guitars_CV&hash=item1e5bd2503d"]http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Aria-Pro-II-Primary-...=item1e5bd2503d[/url]

E.g. here:

[url="http://www.talkbass.com/forum/showthread.php?t=450199"]http://www.talkbass.com/forum/showthread.php?t=450199[/url]

[quote]My 80's Aria Pro II P (Primary) Bass is the BEST P Bass I have ever played.[/quote]

[Bassassin]

[quote name='Annoying Twit' post='831657' date='May 8 2010, 06:32 PM']Aria Pro II Primary bass. I thought this looked a bit newer than the 1970s, but I've found quite a few references to them.

[url="http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Aria-Pro-II-Primary-Bass-/130389528637?cmd=ViewItem&pt=UK_Musical_Instruments_Guitars_CV&hash=item1e5bd2503d"]http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Aria-Pro-II-Primary-...=item1e5bd2503d[/url]

E.g. here:

[url="http://www.talkbass.com/forum/showthread.php?t=450199"]http://www.talkbass.com/forum/showthread.php?t=450199[/url][/quote]

The serial number he gives would date it to '78, if it works like a Fujigen number. I've seen serials like this a few times on Mats & I think they're the same. Aria certainly did make copies into the 80s for the Japanese home market (there are a few 80s Jap catalogues [url="http://www.geocities.jp/guitarofworld/AriaPro2Catalog.html"]here[/url]) so it's likely they were around all the time Matsumoku was making guitars, and might or might not have been officially exported.

Nice Primary, you don't see very many of those.

J.

[Annoying Twit]

Thanks Jon. The pictures of the Primary are small, but it looks to be in very good condition for a 70s bass.

Speaking of 70s basses, yet again an Ibanez Artist bass sells for £10 more than my maximum bid.

[url="http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=140403325388&ssPageName=ADME:B:EOIBUAA:GB:1123"]http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vie...EOIBUAA:GB:1123[/url]

But, given that this has happened twice recently, and that I'm in no hurry, it gives me some sort of confidence that I'll get one some day some how.

[Annoying Twit]

What is an Azumi bass? I can't find much information on them.

[url="http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Vintage-Azumi-Victory-Bass-guitar-Super-rare-/180504789979?cmd=ViewItem&pt=UK_Musical_Instruments_Guitars_CV&hash=item2a06ec83db"]http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Vintage-Azumi-Victor...=item2a06ec83db[/url]

This is local to me and if it were interesting, I could pick it up. Except, that I'm not sure that it is sufficiently interesting for a £200 starting bid.

Looking at this page, the guitars look a bit like a "me too" effort copying Matsumoku style, but not as good. [url="http://www.jedistar.com/jedistar_vintage_guitar_dating_a3.htm"]http://www.jedistar.com/jedistar_vintage_g...r_dating_a3.htm[/url]

[Bassassin]

[quote name='Annoying Twit' post='832367' date='May 9 2010, 05:15 PM']What is an Azumi bass? I can't find much information on them.

[url="http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Vintage-Azumi-Victory-Bass-guitar-Super-rare-/180504789979?cmd=ViewItem&pt=UK_Musical_Instruments_Guitars_CV&hash=item2a06ec83db"]http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Vintage-Azumi-Victor...=item2a06ec83db[/url]

This is local to me and if it were interesting, I could pick it up. Except, that I'm not sure that it is sufficiently interesting for a £200 starting bid.

Looking at this page, the guitars look a bit like a "me too" effort copying Matsumoku style, but not as good. [url="http://www.jedistar.com/jedistar_vintage_guitar_dating_a3.htm"]http://www.jedistar.com/jedistar_vintage_g...r_dating_a3.htm[/url][/quote]
Azumi was something to do with Chushin Gakki - a light engineering firm turned guitar factory, as far as I can find out. This looks familiar - I think this has been up before, & it's pretty expensive considering it's a basic P-derived design & has been majorly refinished. If it was £100 (ish) BIN it might make an interesting player, but Azumi ain't exactly a collectable brand, considering there's only half-a-dozen people who've heard of them.

J.

[razze06]

I always like [url="http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=120565400332&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT"]westone quantums[/url], but i'm saving up for something else now.
Nice swirly knobs there (oo-er) and gig bag

[Annoying Twit]

Thanks Jon, as always.

Too much to do right now to research this one a bit and see if it's actually notable, reasonably priced (I suspect not), etc.

I'm getting tired of everyone always describing anything Japanese as "rare" though.

[url="http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/SD-Curlee-Bass-RARE-MIJ-/320529910094?cmd=ViewItem&pt=UK_Musical_Instruments_Guitars_CV&hash=item4aa112494e"]http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/SD-Curlee-Bass-RARE-...=item4aa112494e[/url]

[TankJon]

Now this looks interesting....

Im quite tempted as long as the reserve isn't set too high.

[url="http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=370374525338&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT#ht_500wt_1182"]http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vie...T#ht_500wt_1182[/url]

Edited May 10, 2010 by TankJon

[LukeFRC]

[quote name='Annoying Twit' post='833058' date='May 10 2010, 01:42 PM']Thanks Jon, as always.

Too much to do right now to research this one a bit and see if it's actually notable, reasonably priced (I suspect not), etc.

I'm getting tired of everyone always describing anything Japanese as "rare" though.

[url="http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/SD-Curlee-Bass-RARE-MIJ-/320529910094?cmd=ViewItem&pt=UK_Musical_Instruments_Guitars_CV&hash=item4aa112494e"]http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/SD-Curlee-Bass-RARE-...=item4aa112494e[/url][/quote]

a rare way to string your bass though

[Jerry_B]

[quote name='TankJon' post='833064' date='May 10 2010, 01:54 PM']Now this looks interesting....

Im quite tempted as long as the reserve isn't set too high.

[url="http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=370374525338&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT#ht_500wt_1182"]http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vie...T#ht_500wt_1182[/url][/quote]

That's a very nice bass!

[Happy Jack]

Were there any Japanese basses that were NOT made by Matsumoku, then?

[url="http://www.gumtree.com/london/88/58409888.html"]http://www.gumtree.com/london/88/58409888.html[/url]

And what a truly Godawful name, too.

[Annoying Twit]

[quote name='Happy Jack' post='833549' date='May 10 2010, 08:23 PM']Were there any Japanese basses that were NOT made by Matsumoku, then?

[url="http://www.gumtree.com/london/88/58409888.html"]http://www.gumtree.com/london/88/58409888.html[/url]

And what a truly Godawful name, too.[/quote]

Que? This advert seems to be hinting that this Sumbro bass was made by the Fujigen factory. Although, a bit of internet poking around suggests that unlike the CSL instruments, Sumbro weren't made by Fujigen. Not Matsumoku though. Some Sumbro guitars were rebranded Rokkoman products, a page says. Sumbro is a contraction of Summerfield Brothers. CSL stands for Charles Summerfield Ltd.

I think

Edit: More here: [url="http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=41538&st=0&p=412334&#entry412334"]http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=...mp;#entry412334[/url]

Edited May 10, 2010 by Annoying Twit

[Bassassin]

I've never seen one of those branded as Sumbro before - they're usually unbranded or labelled Zenta or Jedson. No idea who made these - they're very early copies, possibly late 60s, and don't have any manufacturer-specific traits I've been able to identify.

One of my first JapCrap tart-up jobs was the guitar version of this, which I still have, & it's a nicely-made & somewhat quirky little plank. I'd quite like a matching bass - but £220 for this is fruitloop, about £100 over the odds on an optimistic day and about 75% more than I'd consider paying. Plus he gets an automatic 15% deduction for his "Ibanez Factory" bullsh!t. Where does he think he is? Ebay?

J.

[Annoying Twit]

What is this? Looks like one of the early Hondo basses doesn't it? Nice (IMHO) through neck, except the headstock seems to be making a bid for freedom.

[url="http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/QUALITY-MADE-THRU-NECK-BASS-PROJECT-LINCOLN-/270577702175?cmd=ViewItem&pt=UK_Musical_Instruments_Guitars_CV&hash=item3effb0151f"]http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/QUALITY-MADE-THRU-NE...=item3effb0151f[/url]

Edited May 11, 2010 by Annoying Twit

[Bassassin]

[quote name='Annoying Twit' post='834682' date='May 11 2010, 08:45 PM']What is this? Looks like one of the early Hondo basses doesn't it? Nice (IMHO) through neck, except the headstock seems to be making a bid for freedom.

[url="http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/QUALITY-MADE-THRU-NECK-BASS-PROJECT-LINCOLN-/270577702175?cmd=ViewItem&pt=UK_Musical_Instruments_Guitars_CV&hash=item3effb0151f"]http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/QUALITY-MADE-THRU-NE...=item3effb0151f[/url][/quote]
Real shame about the headstock break on this, been slightly gaseous towards these for a while. These are a bit of a mystery (which I'd like to think I've solved) on the JapCrap boards - they appear with several thousand different names all over Yurp & the US in both bass & guitar versions. There are several threads about these on the Matsumoku board - Ebayers usually claim them as Mats because of the Hippy Sandwich body/neck - but this is what they really are:

[url="http://www.fernandes.co.jp/others/catalog/1978_f_01/27.jpg"]http://www.fernandes.co.jp/others/catalog/1978_f_01/27.jpg[/url]

With a few variations in pickup/controls, it's a Fernandes "Custom Hand". Where do they get these names? According to one of the Japanese vintage sites, Fernandes was built by either Kawai or Tokai at this point.

And I've seen an 8-string version of this.... :brow:

J.

[Annoying Twit]

[quote name='Bassassin' post='834955' date='May 12 2010, 01:36 AM']but this is what they really are:

[url="http://www.fernandes.co.jp/others/catalog/1978_f_01/27.jpg"]http://www.fernandes.co.jp/others/catalog/1978_f_01/27.jpg[/url]

With a few variations in pickup/controls, it's a Fernandes "Custom Hand". Where do they get these names? According to one of the Japanese vintage sites, Fernandes was built by either Kawai or Tokai at this point.[/quote]

That all makes them sound quite high spec. The brochure says that it has a mahogany body, "a pickup that can be used as a single coil or a humbucker" ("coil tap" would be shorter) and an optional boost switch. How did the Kawai instruments fit in among the other manufacturers if they are ranked as to quality of goods? (Approximately of course).

[FlatEric]

[quote name='Bassassin' post='834955' date='May 12 2010, 01:36 AM']Real shame about the headstock break on this, been slightly gaseous towards these for a while. These are a bit of a mystery (which I'd like to think I've solved) on the JapCrap boards - they appear with several thousand different names all over Yurp & the US in both bass & guitar versions. There are several threads about these on the Matsumoku board - Ebayers usually claim them as Mats because of the Hippy Sandwich body/neck - but this is what they really are:

[url="http://www.fernandes.co.jp/others/catalog/1978_f_01/27.jpg"]http://www.fernandes.co.jp/others/catalog/1978_f_01/27.jpg[/url]

With a few variations in pickup/controls, it's a Fernandes "Custom Hand". Where do they get these names? According to one of the Japanese vintage sites, Fernandes was built by either Kawai or Tokai at this point.

And I've seen an 8-string version of this.... :brow:

J.[/quote]

Jon. I've got one of these.

Mine has a break but is has had a solid fix. Bought it ages ago, for too much money if I'm honest,
meaning to do something with it. Just liked the look of it. I [i]nearly[/i] bought the guitar version
but missed it. I have never seen another one.
Will get you a pic. You may wish to make me a Gypo offer for it.

[Clarky72]

It hasn't gone to eBay yet, but anyone looking for an Aria SB Elite II ?

[url="http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=87478"]LINK[/url]

[Annoying Twit]

Kay SG type bass. £9.99 start. The seller is local to me but doesn't do collection or viewings. They sell a lot of stuff, and I wonder if they do house clearances.

[url="http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/VINTAGE-KAY-BASS-ELECTRIC-GUITAR-PLEASE-VIEW-/400121220661?cmd=ViewItem&pt=UK_Musical_Instruments_Guitars_CV&hash=item5d29154e35"]http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/VINTAGE-KAY-BASS-ELE...=item5d29154e35[/url]

Edit: Does that bridge cover look a bit wonky? Does the whole thing look a bit home made?

Edited May 12, 2010 by Annoying Twit

[Bassassin]

[quote name='Annoying Twit' post='835135' date='May 12 2010, 10:55 AM']Kay SG type bass. £9.99 start. The seller is local to me but doesn't do collection or viewings. They sell a lot of stuff, and I wonder if they do house clearances.

[url="http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/VINTAGE-KAY-BASS-ELECTRIC-GUITAR-PLEASE-VIEW-/400121220661?cmd=ViewItem&pt=UK_Musical_Instruments_Guitars_CV&hash=item5d29154e35"]http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/VINTAGE-KAY-BASS-ELE...=item5d29154e35[/url]

Edit: Does that bridge cover look a bit wonky? Does the whole thing look a bit home made?[/quote]
I think these are low-end Taiwanese beginner stuff - I'd pay a car boot price (about £15 - £20 ish) just as a flipper, but I doubt an Ebay one would go for that little. This one looks quite tidy considering it's being sold as a project - so I'd say house clearances or car boot trawls is where their stock comes from. The bridge cover's just held on with that screw in the middle - it'd twist straight.

In answer to your earlier question about Kawai - I can't do much better than point you at this coincidental thread:

[url="http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=87742"]http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=87742[/url]

They made good stuff, alright.

Eric - love to see some pics of your bass (is yours branded Lincoln?) but sadly I'm too skint/got too many basses to be making any offers right now. Must clear a few out first! If you're after a guitar version, try searching for these names as well as Lincoln: The Asama, Memphis, Bozo & Torchy. I love Euro brand names! Asama is the most common brand - apparently it's a mountain in Japan & the name translates literally to "Big Bottom".

J.

[Annoying Twit]

[quote name='Bassassin' post='835182' date='May 12 2010, 11:41 AM']In answer to your earlier question about Kawai - I can't do much better than point you at this coincidental thread:

[url="http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=87742"]http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=87742[/url]

They made good stuff, alright. [/quote]

Yes, I saw that, and noted the price!

[quote]Asama is the most common brand - apparently it's a mountain in Japan & the name translates literally to "Big Bottom". [/quote]

If you mean 浅間山 for Mt. Asama, then that is a very strange name. It more or less translates as "wretched" or "cursed" "interval". Maybe that has something to do with the volcanic activity there.

BTW: It's not only in basses and guitars that there is "JapCrap". I was at my local car boot on Sunday, and was looking at some old binoculars. They were made in Japan, looked a couple of decades old, and were "Plus" brand. The seller wanted £5 for them. I couldn't make them focus properly even going through the whole focus the left then focus the right separately business, so was going to leave them. But a gentlemen appeared and asked to see them. He was saying that these were actually decent, and all that was to open them up "on the bench" and clean and polish the lenses and other bits. But that he wouldn't buy them himself as he just has too many binoculars at home. The seller then dropped his price to £3, but i don't think I'd get around to taking them to bits and manage to clean and put them back together again. But I recognised the existence of another field of "JapCrap".

[Bassassin]

[quote name='Annoying Twit' post='835289' date='May 12 2010, 01:54 PM']If you mean 浅間山 for Mt. Asama, then that is a very strange name. It more or less translates as "wretched" or "cursed" "interval". Maybe that has something to do with the volcanic activity there[/quote]
Thanks for that - I have no knowledge of the Japanese language & was just regurgitating misinformation I picked up on one of the other boards! I hope the rest of my sources are not as misleading!

J.

[Jerry_B]

Or it's just that the factory or company is based near or in some town or location with that name.

[Annoying Twit]

[quote name='Jerry_B' post='835373' date='May 12 2010, 03:38 PM']Or it's just that the factory or company is based near or in some town or location with that name.[/quote]

Seems more likely!

I was going to be arrogant and post that Fujigen is also named after Mt. Fuji, but I thought I should check first as homophones abound in Japanese. But when I checked the original Fujigen site, they don't use Chinese characters for their company name, it's all in the Katakana alphabet. This is very interesting, as Katakana is usually used for foreign, usually English, loan words. But, certain people who have been seen to become "international" might have their names written in the "foreign" Katakana alphabet. An example being Yoko Ono. I'd guess that Fujigen writing their own company name in Katakana is a strong statement that they see themselves as an international company.

PS: I lived in Japan for four years. Being illiterate got stale REAL FAST, hence plenty of motivation for the reading and writing bit.

(Apologies if I went off track here)

Edited May 12, 2010 by Annoying Twit