nilorius Posted March 27 Share Posted March 27 As fx pedals are my weak side, i would ask a specialists. Would You put an envelope filter before or after compressor? Why? The next in a row is chorus. Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigwan Posted March 27 Share Posted March 27 Envelope filter responds to your attack, compressor shapes your attack. Envelope filter first for me, but try both ways and see what works best for you. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nilorius Posted March 27 Author Share Posted March 27 8 minutes ago, Bigwan said: Envelope filter responds to your attack, compressor shapes your attack. Envelope filter first for me, but try both ways and see what works best for you. Thanks. If envelope filter(MXR M82B) is before compressor(Boss BC-1X) - it looses some volume, i will try it after compressor and see what happens. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lidl e Posted March 27 Share Posted March 27 I would never think to put compressor after envelope. Why would you want to tame those peaks and valleys? Give the envelope a nice even tone from the comp, no? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Japhet Posted March 27 Share Posted March 27 29 minutes ago, lidl e said: I would never think to put compressor after envelope. Why would you want to tame those peaks and valleys? Give the envelope a nice even tone from the comp, no? If you put the compressor in front it takes out the dynamics that the envelope filter reacts to. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nilorius Posted March 27 Author Share Posted March 27 Keep on, it's getting interesting !!! 🤩 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lidl e Posted March 27 Share Posted March 27 (edited) 18 minutes ago, Japhet said: If you put the compressor in front it takes out the dynamics that the envelope filter reacts to. That is interesting! I was thinking more of my C4 which i suppose is a synth pedal, but i use it for envelope as well. I do get great response, but i suppose the fact that it is digital would make a difference? My old DOD FX25 absolutely responds to playing dynamics... I'll have to pull it off the board and do some testing before and after comp. Edited March 27 by lidl e Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nilorius Posted March 27 Author Share Posted March 27 (edited) 3 minutes ago, lidl e said: That is interesting! I was thinking more of my C4 which i suppose is a synth pedal, but i use it for envelope as well. I do get great response, but i suppose the fact that it is digital would make a difference? My old DOD FX25 absolutely responds to playing dynamics... I'll have to pull it off the board and do some testing before and after comp. I suppose my ef - MXR M82B is analog. Edited March 27 by nilorius Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigRedX Posted March 27 Share Posted March 27 What you really need is an envelope filter with two inputs - one for the signal that is being processed and one for the "trigger" signal. That way you can put the filter wherever you want in the signal chain and split off the trigger signal from elsewhere. Are there any devices like this? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nilorius Posted March 27 Author Share Posted March 27 14 minutes ago, BigRedX said: What you really need is an envelope filter with two inputs - one for the signal that is being processed and one for the "trigger" signal. That way you can put the filter wherever you want in the signal chain and split off the trigger signal from elsewhere. Are there any devices like this? 🤣 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Krow Posted March 27 Share Posted March 27 58 minutes ago, Japhet said: If you put the compressor in front it takes out the dynamics that the envelope filter reacts to. Agreed - which ties into the school of thought that says give the filter pedal the most complex input signal you can to filter i.e. pretty much at the end of the signal chain. In which case you would then put your compressor or limiter (to tame unwanted spikes) after it, if you're using one. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigRedX Posted March 27 Share Posted March 27 21 minutes ago, Al Krow said: Agreed - which ties into the school of thought that says give the filter pedal the most complex input signal you can to filter i.e. pretty much at the end of the signal chain. In which case you would then put your compressor or limiter (to tame unwanted spikes) after it, if you're using one. Ideally what you want to do is to be able to change the order of the pedals to suit the sound(s) you want to create. Now if only there was a device that did this.... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Krow Posted March 27 Share Posted March 27 1 hour ago, BigRedX said: Ideally what you want to do is to be able to change the order of the pedals to suit the sound(s) you want to create. Now if only there was a device that did this.... Haha there are several, right? eg Boss ES5? But personally I'm content in a live band mix to get something that works well. I appreciate for studio work you would likely want to get something more refined and honed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nilorius Posted March 27 Author Share Posted March 27 Hmm....I set ef as a first pedal before compresor and chorus, the sound was ok and ef responded very well on my playing quest. The only thing was, that compressor shut the ef a little bit down at volume. Then i tried to set ef after the compressor and ef start to sound a bit like a none responding to attack fx, but not eat the volume down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Krow Posted March 27 Share Posted March 27 2 hours ago, nilorius said: Hmm....I set ef as a first pedal before compresor and chorus, the sound was ok and ef responded very well on my playing quest. The only thing was, that compressor shut the ef a little bit down at volume. Then i tried to set ef after the compressor and ef start to sound a bit like a none responding to attack fx, but not eat the volume down. So how about using the filter on its own without the compressor at all? How does that sound? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nilorius Posted March 27 Author Share Posted March 27 9 minutes ago, Al Krow said: So how about using the filter on its own without the compressor at all? How does that sound? Good question, but the answer will be in a 3 days, couse i have to work. Maybe You are right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lidl e Posted March 27 Share Posted March 27 Im setting up this test in my kitchen right now. If i can get a good tone and something not too embarassing playing wise, i will post clips 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lidl e Posted March 27 Share Posted March 27 So messing around a bit, i am going to confidently say one of the three options, to me, sounds better. The options being pre-comp, post-comp and no comp. My playing is too sloppy to post, but let me try again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nilorius Posted March 31 Author Share Posted March 31 (edited) I just found the answer on my own question - filter pre or post compressor, but the the best filter on sound - compressor switched OFF. Thanks to all of Your tips. Edited March 31 by nilorius 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LukeFRC Posted March 31 Share Posted March 31 On 27/03/2024 at 16:03, BigRedX said: What you really need is an envelope filter with two inputs - one for the signal that is being processed and one for the "trigger" signal. That way you can put the filter wherever you want in the signal chain and split off the trigger signal from elsewhere. Are there any devices like this? Thinking your question wasn’t hypothetical … Source audio C4/spectrum chunk agent 00funk I think… lovetone meatbox … Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Krow Posted March 31 Share Posted March 31 1 hour ago, nilorius said: I just found the question on my own answer - filter pre or post compressor, but the the best filter on sound - compressor switched OFF. Thanks to all of Your tips. On 27/03/2024 at 23:36, lidl e said: So messing around a bit, i am going to confidently say one of the three options, to me, sounds better. The options being pre-comp, post-comp and no comp. My playing is too sloppy to post, but let me try again. @nilorius makes sense. Does that tie in with what you were finding @lidl e? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lidl e Posted March 31 Share Posted March 31 9 minutes ago, Al Krow said: @nilorius makes sense. Does that tie in with what you were finding @lidl e? It does! And i tried it again yo try and record, but im not happy with my playing. Pre compressor is awful.post is fine, but best response from none. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Krow Posted March 31 Share Posted March 31 (edited) Gents - conceptually that makes so much sense. A compressor is going to be great for evening your dynamics out should you want it to - but with a filter you want the freedom to be able to open it up with those peaks when you are digging in. Edited March 31 by Al Krow Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boodang Posted April 1 Share Posted April 1 Don’t forget you always put pedals in parallel. I use a EHX tri mixer pedal which allows for three switchable channels in parallel. One has my straight tone with a compressor, the second an envelope and third an octaver. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob Bisby Posted April 10 Share Posted April 10 (edited) I'd probably ditch the compressor if there's an envelope filter being used, compressors give you less dynamics unless it's got a clean blend on it, and envelope filters respond with dynamics so you won't hear that cut as much if there's a compressor in the chain. My opinion BTW Edited April 10 by Rob Bisby 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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