ChWillie Posted February 2, 2023 Share Posted February 2, 2023 (edited) This is not a self-pity party. I write a column for a local news outlet, and I've just written an article for Saturday's paper about a hero of mine whose name I never knew but whom I saw playing [30 years ago] through the pain of arthritis, and I'm doing my best to remember his example and heroic determination as I battle arthritis now. I went to the surgeon last week. To paraphrase: "There are so many things going on in your thumb, thumb joint, wrist, and tendons, that it would take four operations to repair them, and even then, you'd have minimal results. Rheumatoid and osteo arthritis, tears in the cartilage, thumb bone destruction at the joint, very little cartilage there, benign cysts on your wrist. If you have the surgeries, you'll really be no better off and you'll likely have less movement and more pain." I was gutted at first--I thought modern medicine could fix my hand(s) and have me back to playing like I could a few years ago. How ignorant was I? Since his diagnosis, I've felt so frustrated, trying to play decently but the hands not cooperating. And then I had a talk with myself: I'll never have the ability to get back where I was, so I have to accept what I've got and learn to play differently, to have different goals as a player and writer. This morning, I sat down with my Ric 330 and Les Paul for a bit of writing, then turned my attention to my Jack Casady bass (it's my latest, and I just love it). I can't use a plectrum anymore, and even using my fingers, I can only play in 10 minute increments before I'm aching. I will never be able to play full sets live again. Maybe a song or two at an open mic. I've found some thumb exercises that help. I hold the basal joint of my thumb, then stretch my thumb to my lower palm. Doing this 10 times makes playing with my thumb less painful. Have you had the same experience? If so, what do you do that has been helpful to you? And just because we can post pics, here's my Jack Casady on the bass tree. Edited February 2, 2023 by ChWillie 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neepheid Posted February 2, 2023 Share Posted February 2, 2023 Yay for your positive attitude (and the Jack Casady), but boo to your situation. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGreek Posted February 2, 2023 Share Posted February 2, 2023 I suffer with arthritis - so much so that I had to cut back on the amount I practiced over the winter. There's a whole thread on potential "cures" but the consensus was live with it while you can, it's inevitable that you will have to give up playing at some point. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2pods Posted February 2, 2023 Share Posted February 2, 2023 Same. Fibromyalgia, Rheumatoid Arthritis, CFS, and all that goes with it. It's getting for 18 years since my last band, and I'm still dreaming about gigs we played/wanted to play every night. I just do what I can, when I can. My calluses are gone. Not enough playing. A lot of the time I'm just too tired to concentrate. (Must be all them nocturnal gigs, eh ? ) As I got worse, I stopped being able to get out and about and haven't seen anyone from any band I've played with for years. Basschat helps a lot, but there's no substitute for a good gig. Keep at it as long as you can, but don't overdo it. Take care. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BassBunny Posted February 2, 2023 Share Posted February 2, 2023 I'm suffering with painful finger joints due to arthritis so know what you are going. My Mother suffered really badly in later life so it has come as no surprise. I've taken Turmeric for years and it does seem to help. I also use Flexiseq if it's really bad. Not cheap, but does seem to work and recommended by the British Arthritis Society. The major change, that had been a game changer, is moving to 32" scale bass. I couldn't believe a bass that's only 2" shorter in scale could make such a difference, but it has. I've sold all my standard scale basses but finding 32" scale 5ers is proving difficult. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChWillie Posted February 2, 2023 Author Share Posted February 2, 2023 I'm sorry to hear that you all suffer too, but I'm happy that at least we understand each other's situation. I am lucky in that my chording hand is okay. Well, I will probably have to give up with playing with a pick or fingers, but I will find a way to play, even if I have to strap some prosthetic device to my hand. I've just ordered some Black Mountain Picks that look interesting. I wish you all the best in dealing with the problem and the pain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trueno Posted February 2, 2023 Share Posted February 2, 2023 Try using a Powerball gyroscope exerciser. You can get them from Amazon at all price points, but you don’t need the screen or flashing lights. I got a basic Powerball for about £35. It worked for my wrist injury… it may or may not work for you. Takes a bit of getting used to… first couple of times it just dies on you. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheLowDown Posted February 2, 2023 Share Posted February 2, 2023 (edited) While we don't know how to reverse arthritis, we can make it more manageable such as with our diet. Because arthritis is an inflammatory disease, avoid inflammatory foods and increase intake of anti-inflammatory foods. Edited February 2, 2023 by TheLowDown 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChWillie Posted February 2, 2023 Author Share Posted February 2, 2023 Yes, my biggest sins are sweets and carbs. I was much better before I got back to those things. I'm glad you've reminded me. I feel much better when I cut back radically on those. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DTB Posted February 2, 2023 Share Posted February 2, 2023 1 hour ago, 2pods said: Same. Fibromyalgia, Rheumatoid Arthritis, CFS, and all that goes with it. It's getting for 18 years since my last band, and I'm still dreaming about gigs we played/wanted to play every night. I just do what I can, when I can. My calluses are gone. Not enough playing. A lot of the time I'm just too tired to concentrate. (Must be all them nocturnal gigs, eh ? ) As I got worse, I stopped being able to get out and about and haven't seen anyone from any band I've played with for years. Basschat helps a lot, but there's no substitute for a good gig. Keep at it as long as you can, but don't overdo it. Take care. This exactly. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DTB Posted February 2, 2023 Share Posted February 2, 2023 (edited) I have severe spinal arthritis and been on prescription drugs for over a decade to manage constant pain. Playing at home for my own enjoyment is all i do and certainly better than not playing at all. I miss gigging a lot. One thing that hasn’t changed is my enthusiasm and desire to play. Music is always on my mind, so when I’m able I’m straight in the studio to play. I have 3 days a week on my own because my wife works and I can’t care for my little son on my own, so those days I’m in the studio all the time even if I’m just sitting chilling watching music videos as I don’t go out as it causes me too much pain. I don’t know wtf I’d do if I didn’t have my little studio, just being amongst music stuff is nice and every time I close the door and lock myself in I say outloud I love it in here! my dad played until the day he died and I hope I manage to do the same. Edited February 2, 2023 by DTB 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChWillie Posted February 2, 2023 Author Share Posted February 2, 2023 Great way to see it, DTB. I'm sorry for your pain. I also miss gigging a lot. Fortunately, I can record--with the finished product, no one can tell that it takes so much cutting and pasting to make a whole song. The magic of technology, right? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gasman Posted February 2, 2023 Share Posted February 2, 2023 It's not a path for everyone, but I gambled on the fact that cortisone injections had helped me hugely with sports injuries back in the day; in November my left wrist was so painful that I had to take a break from my band (they found deps) and had X-rays - diagnosis was degenerative arteosclerosis, nothing to be done except take PKs and stop playing. I eventually browbeat my GP into letting me try the cortisone path - he was dubious, but gave me two injections in one session directly into the affected area. As a result, two weeks later (touch wood!) I had no symptoms at all and restarted gigging on NYE. Maybe I'm just lucky, but it is a possible way ahead if you're desperate - I certainly was. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChWillie Posted February 3, 2023 Author Share Posted February 3, 2023 I actually tried cortisone shots. They were ineffective. But thanks for the suggestion. I had hoped for at least a short time of relief. I’m lucky that it doesn’t hurt when my hand is at rest. I’m trying hard to see the good side of things. Otherwise, it’s misery and frustration, and I’m just not going to let that happen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DTB Posted February 3, 2023 Share Posted February 3, 2023 15 hours ago, BassBunny said: I'm suffering with painful finger joints due to arthritis so know what you are going. My Mother suffered really badly in later life so it has come as no surprise. I've taken Turmeric for years and it does seem to help. I also use Flexiseq if it's really bad. Not cheap, but does seem to work and recommended by the British Arthritis Society. The major change, that had been a game changer, is moving to 32" scale bass. I couldn't believe a bass that's only 2" shorter in scale could make such a difference, but it has. I've sold all my standard scale basses but finding 32" scale 5ers is proving difficult. If your normal scale length was a 5 string it was probably 35”? I know for certain that the stingray 5 is 34 not 35 as is the Yamaha East sig model. I think a 32 5 would be poor to play, maybe go 34 5 and play it on the good days or at least the not so bad days?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trueno Posted February 3, 2023 Share Posted February 3, 2023 As an experiment… put on a capo, say second fret… and tune the bass down. This might help to decide if a 30” scale might work for you. Or… keep one bass set up this way for a bit of relief when you need it. You may also consider getting an Ashbory bass… I see the Bass Centre in the UK are now selling cool-looking versions. Again, it might provide relief on bad days, as well as a different double-bassy tone. I’ve seen pro gigs with an Ashbory… the bass player used it in the first set for more acoustic-y bluesy stuff. I found a fretless was easier on my hands, done most of my serious gigs with one, with slightly lighter strings. The fact that you get no pain while resting is a real positive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DTB Posted February 3, 2023 Share Posted February 3, 2023 1 hour ago, Trueno said: As an experiment… put on a capo, say second fret… and tune the bass down. This might help to decide if a 30” scale might work for you. Or… keep one bass set up this way for a bit of relief when you need it. You may also consider getting an Ashbory bass… I see the Bass Centre in the UK are now selling cool-looking versions. Again, it might provide relief on bad days, as well as a different double-bassy tone. I’ve seen pro gigs with an Ashbory… the bass player used it in the first set for more acoustic-y bluesy stuff. I found a fretless was easier on my hands, done most of my serious gigs with one, with slightly lighter strings. The fact that you get no pain while resting is a real positive. Oh crikey yes fretless is an excellent idea. Mine is really easy to play with a super low action and I’ve used it on a couple of recordings and once it’s in the mix you really have to listen to hear its a fretless. Great idea Trueno. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trueno Posted February 3, 2023 Share Posted February 3, 2023 I played classic rock on my fretless… all the usual suspects plus AC/DC, Lizzie, Guns n Roses… no-one ever noticed the difference. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BassBunny Posted February 3, 2023 Share Posted February 3, 2023 2 hours ago, DTB said: If your normal scale length was a 5 string it was probably 35”? I know for certain that the stingray 5 is 34 not 35 as is the Yamaha East sig model. I think a 32 5 would be poor to play, maybe go 34 5 and play it on the good days or at least the not so bad days?? Nope, they were all 34" scale. I picked up an Ibanez Mezzo 5 string for a great price to test the theory and it really is a revelation. All my 34" scales have gone including two £3k ACG's. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chienmortbb Posted February 3, 2023 Share Posted February 3, 2023 (edited) I have had some relief using a practice glove. They are available via eBay and Amazon. It will not work miracles, but the extra warmth makes playing much easier. You can just see the white glove in the blurry pic from New Year's Eve 2022. Weirdly, only Amazon do a beige one, eBay have black or white. I have only had one comment at a gig, telling me I forgot to put the right-hand one on. I did not laugh. Edited February 3, 2023 by Chienmortbb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChWillie Posted February 3, 2023 Author Share Posted February 3, 2023 My fretting hand is good. It's my picking hand that has the problem. I'm a lefty, and it's my left hand that bothers me. Yesterday, I enjoyed the 20 minutes playing time I had. I was very careful to stretch first and to take a light approach. I can't grip a plectrum, so it was bare fingers/thumb playing, and even that is challenging. Still, I took it easy and had a good, if short, time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chienmortbb Posted February 3, 2023 Share Posted February 3, 2023 9 minutes ago, ChWillie said: My fretting hand is good. It's my picking hand that has the problem. I'm a lefty, and it's my left hand that bothers me. Yesterday, I enjoyed the 20 minutes playing time I had. I was very careful to stretch first and to take a light approach. I can't grip a plectrum, so it was bare fingers/thumb playing, and even that is challenging. Still, I took it easy and had a good, if short, time. Oh, sorry. Have you tried lighter gauge strings? It may help. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2pods Posted February 3, 2023 Share Posted February 3, 2023 A physio gave me this tip, which helps. Always run, or bathe your hands in hot water for a bit before playing 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGreek Posted February 3, 2023 Share Posted February 3, 2023 I was given an exercise regime for my hands by a physio at my GP. I didn't find that it helped but others might. I'll post it later. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGreek Posted February 3, 2023 Share Posted February 3, 2023 (edited) Not sure if you can get this to work without my password, by all means give it a go and let me know. https://patient-portal.physiotec.ca/?session=BbYnOUlWapbBFJq5uxwIz59KUYVOS55X8ukRSOXV DIFFICULTY Please exs - 3-5/week. Some pain and discomfort is expected. pace out the exs and build up gradually. START 1 Thumb abd./ext. stretch SETS:1 REPS:5 HOLD:20-30 secs … DIFFICULTY Hold your thumb in your hand with your fingers and deviate your wrist towards your little finger. VIDEO 2 Tendon gliding combo SETS:2-4 REPS:8-15 … DIFFICULTY Start with your hand and fingers straight and in line with your forearm. Without moving your wrist do the following movement and reset your fingers to the starting position between each: 1- flex the two last knuckles of your fingers 2- curl your fingers to form a fist (without the thumb) 3- flex your metacarpophalangeal joint only to form an angle of 90 degrees between your fingers and your hand 4- flex the fingers straight to form a 90 degree angle with the hand then flex between the first and second phalanx so the tip of your fingers come straight in the palm of the hand. Keep the second and third phalanx in a straight line. VIDEO 3 Fingers flexion, putty/ball SETS:2-4 REPS:8-15 … DIFFICULTY Bend your finger and press on the putty or a soft ball. VIDEO 4 MCP extension, elastic SETS:2-4 REPS:8-15 … DIFFICULTY Push on the elastic with your fingers to straighten them. VIDEO 5 Thumb Extension SETS:2-4 REPS:8-15 … DIFFICULTY Place an elastic band around your thumb and fingers. Pull thumb sideways against the elastic. VIDEO 6 Finger abduction w/ elastic SETS:2-4 REPS:8-15 … DIFFICULTY Lie on your back. Place an elastic around your fingers. Spread your fingers apart as much as you can. Hold for the recommended time. Relax your fingers. To progress, repeat with a thicker elastic around your fingers. VIDEO 7 Extensors stretching SETS:1 REPS:5 HOLD:20-30 secs … DIFFICULTY Place the arms at chest height with elbows bent and hands together. With the back of each hand touching each other, raise the wrists till a stretch is felt on top of the forearm. Hold the stretch. VIDEO 8 Wrist extension SETS:2-4 REPS:8-15 … DIFFICULTY Place your forearm along an armrest or table with your wrist hanging over the edge and palm facing down. With a weight in your hand, lift the hand towards the ceiling. Lower slowly and repeat. VIDEO 9 Wrist flexion SETS:2-4 REPS:8-15 … DIFFICULTY Place your forearm along an armrest or table with wrist hanging over the edge and palm facing up. With a weight in your hand, lift the hand towards the ceiling. Lower slowly and repeat. VIDEO 10 Fingers extension, putty SETS:2-4 REPS:8-15 … DIFFICULTY Open up your fingers against the putty. VIDEO 11 Thumb pinch w/ putty SETS:2-4 REPS:8-15 … DIFFICULTY Place the putty in your hand and flex the fingers slightly. Press the thumb in the putty against the index finger. Make sure not to push the thumb under the index. Reshape the putty and repeat. Hope that somebody gets some benefit from this. Edited February 3, 2023 by TheGreek 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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