How To Be In a Band

[TimR]

[quote name='bassace' timestamp='1439568746' post='2844074']
Blimey, that's the downside of forums; everything is dissected and analysed to within an inch of its life. At school we got some guys together, formed a band and got some gigs. The weaker players fell by the wayside and we just got better. And it's how it works for me fifty years later. I just go out and play gigs, don't for a minute stop to think why I do it.
[/quote]

Then you're not one of the disillusioned people who are constantly between bands.

So the OP isn't really relevant to you.

If you did give it a second thought, why do you think you have managed to stay in working bands so long?

[bassace]

To be fair, Tim, I haven't been in the same band but a series of bands. In between I freelance and find that until recently, due to health issues, I would play with about a dozen bands in a year. Is it because I play DB, Jazz, or a mixture of both, plus the ability to read. Anyway I suppose I should consider myself fortunate and perhaps shouldn't have posted such an arrogant previous comment.

[ahpook]

[quote name='KingBollock' timestamp='1439528093' post='2843559']
For me, my personal wants/needs are so specific that they are a real problem, or so vague that they're useless.

The most important part is the music, there is no way I'd be interested in playing music I wasn't totally into.

Running a very close second/joint first is the people. I don't want to play with knob'eads. There's no fun in constant arguments and butting of egos.

If I could find both of those I wouldn't care if we never made any money, in fact I'd be quite prepared to lose money to enjoy it. As for gigs and recording and stuff, I don't really care. It'd be nice to have the extra stuff but getting together with some mates, having a laugh, writing tunes and playing them loudly would be enough for me.
[/quote]

Totally agree with you KB - I think a band should gig, so it is important that any band I'm in does at least aim to gig, but for me being in a band is about trying to create music you enjoy listening to and playing with nice people.

The questions the OP suggests are still valid, mind...but you'd need to think about whether you and your bandmates are artistically on the same wavelength.

Edited August 14, 2015 by ahpook

[blue]

[quote name='JTUK' timestamp='1439538665' post='2843600']

Sing from the same page...get the money sorted right up front and know what you all will work and commit to.[/quote]

Good point, a lot of guys would be hesitant to ask;

[i]"How do I get paid and when?" [/i]Which for guys like me who look at these opportunities as a paying job is very important.

Blue

[blue]

[quote name='CHW' timestamp='1439544169' post='2843678']
It's about the band priority.

If the band priority is to promote funkblackreggaemetal, I think you have to find members who are all committed to that cause, and therefore willing to play for free, for several years, to empty venues and to look to build a scene from scratch. Some scenes will build, and some will die a death, being in that band is about your commitment to the cause. A random member, looking to play a few gigs, earn a few quid and enjoy playing to full crowds is not going to last long in that band.

In my acoustic band, our priority is to play stuff that you wouldn't necessarily expect to hear, but that people know, arranged a bit differently. We are all on board with this, and there are few disagreements over whether something is working or not. If we added in a 4th person at any point, it would be really necessary that they bought into the band philosophy
[/quote]

What you outlined would be perfect for the young guy that has defined that he wants to be a part of an original band concept "funkblackreggaemetal" and to grow that idea. He also has defined that gigs and money are not an initial priority.

Blue

Edited August 14, 2015 by blue

[blue]

[quote name='Phil Starr' timestamp='1439545606' post='2843697']
I wonder if there's a difference between the USA and here. Accepting that the Venn diagram would show we have more in common than differences of course. Not many British musicians would say they were only in it for the money. There's a tendency over here to value the music highly, which seems strange sometimes if it's a covers band but then playing stuff you don't enjoy for a tiny rate per hour isn't very motivating. I also wonder if we Brits are just natures amateur enthusiasts.

Me, I love performing, I'd take a poorly paid gig or do a charity event for free if I could guarantee a large enthusiastic audience and I've no problem playing Mustang Sally if it's what the audience want.

So for me it has to be fun primarily, the music is part of that but good company is very important, or at least a positive and professional attitude. Gigging is a must, although start ups in gestation can be fun too, but at least you have to hit the open mic/jamming sessions right up front. My current band suits me fine, we're all pretty much interested primarily in giving the audience a good time, the guitarist is the only prima donna and we gig regularly and it's building up. We're playing rock covers and I wouldn't go to listen to a band doing our set in a million years but hey, it's fun to play and the audiences are usually up dancing from the first few songs.

Having said that the whole band have to take the music seriously, practice at home, rehearsal is for rehearsing and working on arrangements not learning the song. If I mess up then I'd go away and work hard on that bit and I'd expect others to do the same. I don't mind lowish skill levels so long as you're trying to improve and take it seriously, we all start somewhere but I'd rather work with people who have a positive attitude than a lazy talent.

My bands have always been more or less democratic, I'm often the bandleader in terms of organisation but I'm not the greatest musician and I don't sing so the musical side is pretty much shared. Not sure how I'd respond to the sort of band leader you describe Blue. On the one hand just having to think about bass might be fun but I can't handle doing things badly just because the boss says so especially in what for me is my social life.
[/quote]

Interesting points. Well I think having "fun" is a given. How ever we all define fun differently . For me , fun is working with good people to responsive crowds. It's also really "fun" getting paid to do something "fun", something most never experience.

As far as the band leader, she's 29 and while I started gigging in bands in 1966 she's a lot more current with band management than me and her decisions are usually good ones and good for the band.

Blue

[blue]

[quote name='bassace' timestamp='1439568746' post='2844074']
Blimey, that's the downside of forums; everything is dissected and analysed to within an inch of its life. At school we got some guys together, formed a band and got some gigs. The weaker players fell by the wayside and we just got better. And it's how it works for me fifty years later. I just go out and play gigs, don't for a minute stop to think why I do it.
[/quote]

So when you go out to play a gig and don't for a minute stop to think why your doing it, your cool when at the end of the night a band member says? :

[i]"Oh by the way, we all get paid but you don't, you didn't ask so we figured you didn't care about compensation."[/i]

Or you get to the gig, your 60 and the guys in the band are all 19 & 20 year olds. For some 60 year olds that's ok. For some, like me it's not and would be extremely awkward.

Blue

Edited August 14, 2015 by blue

[blue]

[quote name='bassace' timestamp='1439568746' post='2844074']
Blimey, that's the downside of forums; everything is dissected and analysed to within an inch of its life. At school we got some guys together, formed a band and got some gigs. The weaker players fell by the wayside and we just got better. And it's how it works for me fifty years later.[/quote]

Bassace, I'm 62 and started gigging in rock bands in 1966 an what you described is exactly how it worked back then.

However the difference is for me that no longer works for me. Number one I'm not in school and the band business and what we fit into as adults is completely different for me than it was 50 years ago. I mentioned my band leader is a 29 year old female and while I have been playing in bands longer than she has been alive, her experience is much more relevant and current than mine.

Blue

Edited August 14, 2015 by blue

[Bloc Riff Nut]

I suppose I'm lucky. I just want to play. As long as I'm playing with the band I'm happy. Only prerequisite is a good drummer, then I dont care if its rehearsal or a gig. Just locked in and playing the groove.

[blue]

[quote name='bassman7755' timestamp='1439567146' post='2844050']
I've never been involved with or ever heard of a UK pub ("bar" in US speak) band who are in it primarily for the money. From what Blue is saying it seems that US bar bands have more in common with function bands over here.

In any event I think Blue makes a good point that its important to decide what you want out of it and seek like minded people.
[/quote]

Yeah, it sounds like the ocean separating us makes a bit of a difference. Keep in mind, over here bar shows are traditionally 4 hours, 8-12 or 9-1. We also supply lights and sound.

Blue

Edited August 14, 2015 by blue

[blue]

[quote name='Bloc Riff Nut' timestamp='1439589867' post='2844299']
I suppose I'm lucky. I just want to play. As long as I'm playing with the band I'm happy. Only prerequisite is a good drummer, then I dont care if its rehearsal or a gig. Just locked in and playing the groove.
[/quote]

I use to feel the same way, when I was 16.

In some ways I miss those days. With 50 plus years invested in this I certainly require more than just being able to play in a band.

Blue

Edited August 14, 2015 by blue

[blue]

[quote name='Lozz196' timestamp='1439553330' post='2843822']
It`s ok being able to play, but there`s so much more that goes with that, and those are the bits that many often overlook.[/quote]

Agreed, just being able to play in most busy working bands is no longer enough. There are guys that can play their asses off, but are also massive cocks that wouldn't last long in any working band.

Blue

Edited August 14, 2015 by blue

[blue]

[quote name='Les' timestamp='1439547193' post='2843720']
Phil Starr and I were obviously separated at birth.

He's just written the post I was putting together in my head.

Les
[/quote]

Sorry about stealing your thunder Les. LOL

Blue

[blue]

[quote name='KingBollock' timestamp='1439528093' post='2843559'] For me, my personal wants/needs are so specific that they are a real problem, or so vague that they're useless. The most important part is the music, there is no way I'd be interested in playing music I wasn't totally into. Running a very close second/joint first is the people. I don't want to play with knob'eads. There's no fun in constant arguments and butting of egos. If I could find both of those I wouldn't care if we never made any money, in fact I'd be quite prepared to lose money to enjoy it. As for gigs and recording and stuff, I don't really care. It'd be nice to have the extra stuff but getting together with some mates, having a laugh, writing tunes and playing them loudly would be enough for me. [/quote]

At that point it's not really a band it's a guys basement social event. IMO

Blue

Edited August 14, 2015 by blue

[tauzero]

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1439507811' post='2843524']
I use to be concerned about those things, Now the only thing I might bring up would be "Why are bookings weak in December?" Song choice ,image those things don't concern me. I'm in a band to perform and make as much $$ as possible.
[/quote]

I was in a club band for those reasons. Now I'm not and I don't have to play "Red red f***ing whine" any more.

[blue]

[quote name='tauzero' timestamp='1439594787' post='2844338']
I was in a club band for those reasons. Now I'm not and I don't have to play "Red red f***ing whine" any more.
[/quote]

One thing that has kept me in this band is not being concerned over what songs we play. I'm paid to perform and entertain at certain level. What song's we play are of little consequence to me. Bad contracts and months with weak bookings are 2 of my primary concerns.

I think "How To Be In A Band" poses different issues depending on whether you do this for a living or if your a [i]" I have a day job "[/i] kind of chap.

Blue

[JTUK]

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1439588077' post='2844280']
Good point, a lot of guys would be hesitant to ask;

[i]"How do I get paid and when?" [/i]Which for guys like me who look at these opportunities as a paying job is very important.

Blue
[/quote]

Well, when they told me what the minimum was.... it pretty much ruled out pubs, but I think they'll bend to do good dates.
But since it is a start-up, bookers don't quite know what they are getting without a showcase, which is what pubs are.
But we aren't doing functions as such either, unless they book us for the party to do a max of two hours, but more typically, one set
of 70 minutes.

I've already let a couple of guys go...as they just wanted to jam whatever they already knew and the music was competent but didn't have
the vibe I was looking for...

[KingBollock]

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1439591634' post='2844319']


At that point it's not really a band it's a guys basement social event. IMO

Blue
[/quote]
I might agree with you if the music wasn't a priority. I'm not interested in just having a doss, the creation and playing of music is the most important part, and getting along with your band mates makes that process easier and more fun.

When I say I don't care about the other stuff, I mean that I am flexible. That's the stuff I am prepared to compromise on to fit a band that gets me the things that are more important to me.

[Marvin]

The people have got to be right, it's that simple. You've all got to be going in the same direction.

For me it's about playing music that I feel is of a good standard. It doesn't have to be material that I'd necessarily listen to at home, but that will interest an audience...and that means I turn down bands that want to do certain material. I recently turned down a band that presented a set list full of the usual suspects, stuff that would make me cringe if I had to play it in public. I left a new band because they wanted to add stuff like Alright Now etc. I've never learnt to play it and still refuse to.

Money, if I wanted to get regular paid gigs I wouldn't be looking at playing pubs, that's just a waste of time. Functions is where the money is. But then I'm not interested in making money to that degree, if someone is trying to make money out of my band playing then I expect my cut but otherwise it's not my motivation for playing. I wouldn't want to earn my living gigging, I'm sure my kids would hate it.

[blue]

[quote name='Marvin' timestamp='1439657910' post='2844768']
The people have got to be right, it's that simple. You've all got to be going in the same direction.

For me it's about playing music that I feel is of a good standard. It doesn't have to be material that I'd necessarily listen to at home, but that will interest an audience...and that means I turn down bands that want to do certain material. I recently turned down a band that presented a set list full of the usual suspects, stuff that would make me cringe if I had to play it in public. I left a new band because they wanted to add stuff like Alright Now etc. I've never learnt to play it and still refuse to.

Money, if I wanted to get regular paid gigs I wouldn't be looking at playing pubs, that's just a waste of time. Functions is where the money is. But then I'm not interested in making money to that degree, if someone is trying to make money out of my band playing then I expect my cut but otherwise it's not my motivation for playing. I wouldn't want to earn my living gigging, I'm sure my kids would hate it.
[/quote]

I think music or playing in bands is a side thing for most, flippant, if something comes up I'll do it or I like my traditional office job. For some of us, it's who we are and couldn't imagine doing anything else for a living.

It's not for everyone, it really has to be in your soul to do it for a living.

Blue

[cybertect]

[quote name='bassace' timestamp='1439568746' post='2844074']
Blimey, that's the downside of forums; everything is dissected and analysed to within an inch of its life. At school we got some guys together, formed a band and got some gigs. The weaker players fell by the wayside and we just got better. And it's how it works for me fifty years later. I just go out and play gigs, don't for a minute stop to think why I do it.
[/quote]

I'm still playing music with a mate from school nearly 35 years after we first started rehearsing in his living room. We've been in a variety of outfits together over the years and I switched from rhythm guitar to bass along the way.

Still pretty much the same formula - learn a few covers and write some of our own and go out and find some gigs.

[JTUK]

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1439660809' post='2844799']
I think music or playing in bands is a side thing for most, flippant, if something comes up I'll do it or I like my traditional office job. For some of us, it's who we are and couldn't imagine doing anything else for a living.

It's not for everyone, it really has to be in your soul to do it for a living.

Blue
[/quote]

It may well be the be-all and end-all for some and not others, but this garauntees nothing in itself.

I'll do it if I think it can be very good...my perception, but I know many many gifted 'amateurs' who would put more than a few
'professionals' that I know, to shame, so for me..it is all about how well it is done.,

The fact that some ppl do it full time means nothing... it just means they don't do anythng else... and I'd also wonder if they were 'legal' as well. but that is another can of worms..

[blue]

[quote name='JTUK' timestamp='1439661120' post='2844809']
It may well be the be-all and end-all for some and not others, but this garauntees nothing in itself.

I'll do it if I think it can be very good...my perception, but I know many many gifted 'amateurs' who would put more than a few
'professionals' that I know, to shame, so for me..it is all about how well it is done.,

The fact that some ppl do it full time means nothing... it just means they don't do anythng else... and I'd also wonder if they were 'legal' as well. but that is another can of worms..
[/quote]

Me, I don't know if I'm a professional or not, I've always thought that was something determined by others.

And playing full time for me means I don't do anything else, but it also means I can't do anything else. Playing electric bass guitar and singing is all I know how to do. I'm fine with that, makes life a lot less complicated.

Blue