Phil Starr

Honestly stop worrying about impedance and speaker sizes, probably to least important things to worry about. Find a speaker you like the sound of first. Sound comes first second and third. If is isn't loud enough then buy a second identical speaker to get more of what you like. If you play small and medium sized venues then you only need to be as loud as the drummer and the PA will do the heavy lifting if you play bigger venues on occasions. Size isn't important If you are starting from scratch then a 2x10 or a 1x15 will be loud enough for most gigs but a good, high efficiency 12 will just about get there too. Anything bigger (4x10, 2x12) will be well capable but you don't want capable you want a good sound that suits your playing, and only you can judge that. So have some fun and start trying stuff, you wouldn't buy a car without a test drive.

Looks Like the Warnex and the Tuff Cab are very similar, Tuffcab is cheaper at the moment.

There are standard ways of describing and measuring power. This is both in the legal sense of governments drawing up regulations to allow us to make sense of what is being advertised (CE regulations refer to RMS and the US FTC 1974 of continuous measurements using sine waves are still in place.) There are also engineering standards for making measurements. Peak measurements should be measured with sine waves and simply double the continuous/rms power. Music power is meaningless. The only reason I keep posting on this is because essentially you are being cheated by false advertising claims and people who spread half understood information are effectively undermining the companies who are being honest with you. If you want to check you could start here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Audio_power

This too is true

I think we all know how it works, at the bottom end of the price range there have to be engineering compromises to make a product at that price point. Better materials and so on increase the price with performance for a while then you reach the point of diminishing returns where small improvements cost increasing amounts of money. That pretty much applies to most walks of life from restaurants to bass gear. It certainly isn't an iron rule, there are bargains and dogs at each price point usually. The Bugera Veyron amp is a real bargain IMO for example. Interestingly I can't find out if the BN and 'lightweight' means that this speaker has a Neo driver or what the cab actually weighs? If it has a normal ceramic (heavy) magnet 15 driver then the Bugera looks good value, if it has a genuine neo magnet it's a total bargain. Complete guess is that the horn is neo only. You've got a 5-600W 15+horn for just over £200 which Stew says sounds good and has been reliable for him. That's good value for money and there's nothing here to put you off a purchase The thing is though this isn't the way to choose a bass cab. There are other cabs at this price point from Warwick, TC and Peavey and more like the Fender Rumble coming in at less than £100 more. It's the sound that counts so you have to go out and try them and choose based on that. Only you can decide if the sound is actually better and how much you'd be prepared to pay for that. It's quite possible that the Bugera blows the others away at that price or that the reverse is true the only way to find out is to try as many as possible and decide if it's a match for what you want. Good luck, I hope you find something you like.

I have the same problem with my Little Mark Tube, seems no way round it, though £200 ish is still less than the prices people are selling them at on the marketplace here. I can't blame MB for the failure, I knocked my stack over with the MB on the top. I had a look inside and I even found a circuit diagram on Talk Bass but it isn't really user serviceable. I've bought the Peavey, it sounds better than the MB but I'll still get that repaired, I won't buy another unless I hear they are handling their repairs differently.

Sorry that wasn't meant to be personal. Hence the Smiley Competition only works if it is fair, I admit I do have a bit of a thing about deliberate lies and Music Tribe (Behringer and co) have a track record here. They aren't the only ones but they are in a fairly dominant position. Is it fair to pitch their 2000W speaker against someone else's 500W speaker when they actually handle the same power? Given that many musicians can't work out ohms, volts and watts I think not. The OP said "Its the wattage claims that obviously appeals but at the same time, puts me off if you know what I mean, here's what the newer model claims." It's the same rating your speaker has as it happens, Music Tribe/Music Group bought up Turbosound and went on producing their speakers so this may in fact be a similar driver to yours, I don't know that of course but I am confident it's a 5-600W speaker. Should I tell the Brig that. Most of my posts are on technical stuff, I'm a rubbish bass player but I used to teach Physics to 'A' level and to design and build speakers for a living so it's what I have to contribute. I try not to be too boring but I like to think I'm teaching someone to fish rather than just feeding them a fish. Anyway no offence meant on my part I enjoy your contributions

"we've all had enough of so called experts" as someone once said OK here's the thing, a single coil of wire trapped inside a speaker can only dissipate so much heat, in that Turbosound driver there is likely to be a 2.5-3" voice coil so that limits the speaker to around 500W. By their own figures the sensitivity is 97dB/W and the maximum output 124 dB, both quite believable figures. That implies the maximum amp gain is 124-97=27dB. Which means the speaker can handle 500W thermal. You see this all the time, 500W measured power handling (usually described as AES) 1000W 'program' 2000W 'peak' It's a 500W speaker for the sake of comparison to any other speaker and for a single driver it is quite loud 124db is more than enough for most people, anything over 120db will keep up with most drummers in a rock band, On their own website they describe it as a 600W speaker, which doesn't seem unreasonable.

Another good gig, although again with no chance for a soundcheck, Peavey minimax into a 1x12+horn of my own design, but a PA speaker so FRFR. Because there was no soundcheck I just started with everything flat. Nice punchy sound straight out of the tin. coincidentally gain on 12.00 and vol on 12.00 too. Three hour set with just a 10 min break and it played without drama and sounded nice and punchy, more like my old Hartke 3500 than my Mark Bass Tube. I hadn't had time to play with the controls as the amp had only been delivered that morning but yeah, nice warm punchy sound and not too coloured, I liked it. The fan is noisy though, not a problem at a gig of course.

Hi Al, the whole RMS thing comes from the maths behind AC voltage measurement. Produced by an alternator spinning round and round in a circle it produces electricity which traces out a circular pattern as a sine wave. Half of the wave is positive and half negative. The average voltage is zero and the actual voltage is changing all the time. To calculate the 'equivalent' DC voltage you square the peak voltage to make both halves of the cycle positive, then work out the mean average then find the square root to convert it back to volts. Root- Mean- Square. You can then use this figure to calculate power. You'll find pedants who will say correctly that there is no such thing as RMS power but really ???

Mine has just arrived, it is quite clearly rated at 44.7V RMS. Power is V2/R so that would be 500W into 4ohms and 250 into 8ohms. Of course There is lots of wriggle room about how that was measured but an RMS voltage is a measurable, verifiable thing so I kind of trust it to be reasonably accurate. Oh Luke has put that up quite impressed with the sounds available, simple tones and the switched sounds seem quite usable on a ten minute run through. It doesn't come across as well made as some. the Bugera has a much nicer build, but that may just be the case. Not as tidy as my MB Tube either and the chrome bezels on the sockets look a bit rough for example. It all works though and it's what is inside that counts and so far Peavey stuff has never let me down even in old age. Gigging with it tonight, I'll let you know

As far as I can tell they simply re-named their old BL15 as the Pulse range. https://celestion.com/category/10/Bass/size/26/15"Diameter/ If you have doubts then ask Dr Decibel their tech enquiry service which is excellent [email protected]

that Ashdown looks a snip at that price. I've been using an old Hartke Kickback 10 for years for this purpose but it's heavy for it's size and an awkward shape to carry. Recently I've been using an RCF ART310 mk 3 which works really well. I've just been plugging the bass straight in but it would also work well with a pre. I kind of like a combo though so I'm planning to build a lightweight cab where I can drop in a lightweight head and just go. I've just pulled the bullet on a Peavey from Thomann. and there is a decent choice of neo 12" drivers at around £100 at the moment. You are fairly handy so that might be a project for you.

Hope you have roadies. As to amps these are rated 400W max which probably means the two 18's are rated at 200W each, that's incredibly low by modern standards and I suspect a sign that these were made in times when the coil formers and glues were less heat resistant than today. If these are the vintage items I suspect they are then treat them with respect and keep the power down. I'd maybe treat them as if they were 200W into 4ohms if longevity is important. They are likely to be pretty loud anyway. I'd be looking to keep the vintage look going and maybe match them up with one of the Peavey Mk111 or Mk1V amps which I think were 300W into 4 ohms. If you can find them they are usually dirt cheap and they are pretty reliable and very fixable if they do break. If not I'd be looking to get a stereo PA amp of about 2-300W into 4 ohms. Having said that reports seem to be that the 10's sound good but the 18's are a lot woolly. Running them bi-amped would probably give you the best sound because you'd be able to balance the two better.. If you've got two of the speakers then there are some 4 channel amps around, Thomann do one in their own 'The Box' range.

Is it Jamerson? It doesn't sound like him to me and all the credits are just to the Funk Brothers. The recording is '72 so after the move from Detroit.

Just a quick update, I've been having trouble getting my ZS10's to fit even with the memory foam buds. I have quite narrow ear canals and funny shaped ears, in fact I've never been able to get any in-ear headphones to fit and stay in and I use over ears at home. Anyway my Etymotic ER20 earplugs do stay in with the smallest triple flange tips fitted, so I ordered some of these triple flange things https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B06WP97FL3/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o02_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1 I used them in earnest for the first time last night at a gig. Tricky to get in but I got a great seal so the band noise was reduces right down to almost nothing, bass frequencies all preserved because of the seal and a really clear mix of the band at levels which were almost at normal conversation levels. The ZS10's didn't shift all night, at one point I thought they had moved as the band suddenly got very loud but I'd knocked the volume control up, my goodness how loud can those ZS10 headphones go! This is a game changer for me, I was never going to spend hundreds of pounds on customised IEM's until I knew I'd actually use them, this gives me a way in. Best £3 I've spent in a while.

I'm using a Zoom H4N recorder straight into ZS10's. The recorder is just really a convenient way of having a mic and built in headphone amp in a ready made package. I'm still experimenting and the recorder currently goes onto it's own stand, if I want a 'bit more me' for my vocals I just physically move it closer. I'm looking to get something that will mount directly onto my mic stand, the H4N is quite bulky for that. I'm going to upgrade the mixer at some time in the future so we can all have channels and the Zoom will become redundant but in the meantime I have a portable personal monitoring system I can carry in a pocket. I quite like the ambient mic part of this approach, I can hear everything going on onstage, including the stuff we don't want going over the PA and you don't lose contact with the room.

It's all true, bit down or just a bit bored and it's like meeting up with a bunch of mates for the craic. The only downside is wondering if I'd be a better player if I used the time to practice more

The only reason to do the gig is not to let the audience and the organisers down. It's a multi-band event so it's fairly unlikely they can't fill up the time. Would you ever want to perform with the singer? If so send him a polite note wishing them well but saying you don't blame him but you won't be working with the drummer again. If not, well they pushed you so you owe them nothing. Make sure you let the organisers know they sacked you just before the gig, inevitably if they back out they will blame you, you don't want your reputation dented. Leave it at that, I suspect the band is doomed, no plans and a desire to stop playing the stuff that gets them the bookings for originals by a drummer who can't keep time or control his emotions. That can only go one way Good luck with your new band. It hurts, I was sacked rather messily by a drummer who sped up in every song, lost the beat on most of the fills and who couldn't play triplets. I was gracious (ish) and to be fair he has passed a few gigs on to me and my new band.

I came back to this because I played at an open mic this w/e with a couple of older model 8" Alto's doing vocal duty and they sounded really very good. Mainly though because the fleshy human bits knew what they were doing and the Drummer was using rods rather than sticks. Even so remarkable performance from the little fellas. So I looked them up, so cheap! The thing is the TX208 only does 113dB, that's not loud. I used to use the old Yamaha Stagepas 300 as a vocal monitor (also113dB) and when the band got loud they were just beginning to struggle. The TX310 will go to 116dB and the TS308 will go to 126dB, if size is crucial but budget flexible. You'd notice an extra 3dB but an extra 13dB is a huge difference.

You are going to have to drop Seven Nation Army soon though

I have to go out for a gig I'll get back to you soon but am happy to make talk through any problems you come across.

You might find the RCF 310 would be ideal in that situation. I was using the Mk3 and I think you'd be fine but the Mk4 has full DSP and I imagine if you did push it too hard the limiting would cope quite gracefully. Any FRFR is going to give you more and clearer mids at ear level and that is what is going to help you most with monitoring.

That's interesting Someone is selling a couple of them on BC, I wondered about an upgrade, they quote greater efficiency and maximum output so they must be using different drivers, the horn driver is definitely different. I think EBS freak is right though, ultimately its still a 10" speaker and there are limits if you want to use a single 10 as the sole source of bass for a decent sized room. I'm more optimistic about the bass drivers in quality PA speakers than Stevie, I've been looking at the RCF drive units as possibles in my own bass designs and they are as well specced as anything else at the price and with proven reliability. The requirements of putting bass through PA speakers is exactly the same as going through bass speakers and the units we have been using in our bass cab designs are 'general purpose bass drivers chosen for their specs and not specific 'bass guitar' drivers. As to plastic cabs, well it depends upon the plastic cab, just as it does the wooden cab. The density of the material, elasticity and self damping properties as well as the design of the bracing will all be important. My cheap Wharfedale Titans rattle like hell with bass guitar, the RCF's weigh a lot for plastic as do our QSC's and they have no problems. I'd guess there is more plastic, it's mineral loaded and a lot more care is taken over bracing.

Light is like sound, on a log scale so there won't be half as much light again with 105W, but I am using the 70W lights. When you think that an 8W domestic led is rated as 100W equivalent then think of these as being rather like the old 500W floodlights, not really a domestic item. Obviously the 70W rating is with all the leds lit so a single colour won't be as bright but even so you really can't see much with one of these a few feet away shining straight at you.