endorka

[quote name='kipperwig' post='795291' date='Apr 3 2010, 08:54 PM']Jennifer, what gear do you use? which pickup , preamp/amp , anything else?[/quote] I use a Realist pickup into an Eden WT330 amp, which is part of the cxc110 combo. I don't use an external preamp as the preamp on the Eden has a sufficiently high impedance for acoustic instrument pickups - one megaohm, I believe. I give a pre-EQ DI to the front of house from the DI socket on the back of the Eden. There are several keys to making this work in a loudish onstage environment; first is to elevate the speaker as close to ear level as possible. When I'm going through the front of house speakers I will use my own speaker in a monitoring capacity only. In this situation I roll off *tons* of bass on my speaker, so that only the mids and highs are coming through, which is enough to allow me to hear myself and get a reasonable fix on the intonation. Once the front of house speakers are enabled, they will supply sufficient bass frequencies onstage to fill in the sonic gaps. I never have any of my DB in my own monitor wedge. If anyone else has double bass in their monitor wedges, I also advise them to roll off the bass frequencies in a similar fashion; typically dump anything below 250Hz, and certainly below 120Hz. If they don't do this, all they will hear is a big whooommmpppfffff and no definition. Another problem I have come across is that often what people assume is feedback from the bass actually is not. Several other common causes of bass type feedback are; - the bass drum mic - the floor tom mic - acoustic guitar body - low guitar strings resonating - low notes on a keyboard feeding back through vocal mics. Of course, once one of these gets going, it will typically set off your double bass as well! Jennifer

[quote name='kipperwig' post='795037' date='Apr 3 2010, 01:23 PM']Wow, a beach ball! that sounds like a great idea, i think i'd be scared of knocking the soundpost. Anybody else tried this??? My soundpost has recently been set by a luthier. is the best position of the soundpost for acoustic tone, not necessarily the best position for amplifying?[/quote] In terms of any setup technique, the more efficient the instrument becomes at resonating, i.e. gets a louder acoustic tone, the more prone it is to feedback for exactly the same reason, i.e. increased resonance. Through constant setup tweeks on my DB I have direct experience of this. However, I can say that even though my DB is now working very efficiently acoustically, it still amplifies well through use of various techniques I mentioned earlier in this thread, loud enough to get a reasonable onstage volume with a disciplined rock band, for example. Whether it would be loud enough for a rockabilly or very loud rock band, I am not sure, and perhaps more aggressive feedback reducing techniques would be required. Jennifer

Interesting articles, especially the bit about double basses normally being tuned in fifths in France in the 19th Century. I wonder what prompted the change to the current system? Jennifer

Re: tuning in fifths - on the double bass, for people with ordinary sized hands, it is not possible to play a minor third interval without shifting. On a bass guitar it may be possible, but I'd say you'd need to be using 1 finger per fret technique all over the fingerboard to make it practical - cello type fingerings, in other words. Jennifer

One of the biggest feedback causing problems with amplifying a DB is that the sound coming from the speaker can get into the body of the DB, which of course causes feedback. A quick and cheap solution for this is to elevate the speaker cabinet way high - as in on a milk crate on top of a table high - to get the sound above the body of the double bass and into the audience. Being at this height also helps it get into your ears, so you should definitely be able to hear yourself more clearly. There will be people who express concern that elevating the cab from the floor will ruin the low frequency response. Ignore them. Another tip is to remove most of the bass frequencies from your speaker, which cause the "whoooommmmm" type feedback, and to rely on the front of house (if there) to supply the low end. Sending the DI pre-EQ should allow this. If there is no front of house you may have to settle for a compromise in terms of tone/volume. Jennifer

[quote name='warwickhunt' post='791026' date='Mar 30 2010, 08:04 PM']my main gigging bass of the last 3 years has been a SC. [/quote] For some reason this really works in terms of aesthetic balance for me, whereas many of the other singlecuts do not. I think it is because there is a general slope of the whole instrument towards the direction of the singlecut, so it seems consonant and in proportion. It seems to be part of the design, not something that was kludged on afterwards. Love the headstock design too - it reminds me of the NS Design EUBs :-) Beautiful instrument!

[quote name='uzzell' post='783489' date='Mar 23 2010, 02:36 PM']I play mostly classical, chord based bass and it suits perfectly. I have often wondered what the next step up would be like, ie maybe tune A D G C F for super high pitch playing. Is there such a string that could do this.[/quote] I had a six string bass tuned EADGCF for a while - the high F is incredible, with a 24 fret bass guitar the highest note is not that much lower than the highest note on a Fender Strat. Giggles all round when you use it on a solo and see the guitarist shaking their head in disbelief :-) I bought the high F as part of a set from Overwater. Jennifer

[quote name='skampino' post='784111' date='Mar 23 2010, 10:47 PM']Perhaps someone could advise how I should finger the opening riff of Billy Idol's 'White Wedding' using this postioning:[/quote] Hopefully the font won't mess up the alignments too much - fingerings in red below the tab, "-" means shift: G------------------ D---------------------- A-----5-7--9-9--7-5-- E-7-7-------------- ..[color="#FF0000"] 4 4 1-1 4 4 -4 1[/color] Jennifer

The Underpants Gnomes?

Music degrees vary in quality and opportunities offered, and very often rely on the student to "put in" to a return - it is not unusual to hear wildly different opinions of a music degree from different people who did that degree, even if they were studying in the same year. Personally I got a lot from my music degree; off the top of my head, contacts into musical theatre, exposure to a huge range of different musical genres, and the opportunity to gig in those; bucketloads of inspiration all round, and several years of tuition from a great double bass tutor and orchestration tutor. It also gave me the opportunity to join the university orchestra and play classical music for the first time. It was worth every penny and has certainly paid for itself. I'd say earning a relatively secure income is possible; certainly some musicians I know approach this asymptotically. Probably the most secure are those who teach regularly and perform in function bands with a busy diary booked often years in advance. If you take this approach it is possible to earn a very good living, but there are of course various levels of tradeoff between variety/income/security. Jennifer

That's the one :-) Jennifer

I wouldn't mess with the gain if you have it setup the way you like it - the purpose of gain is to match the output of the bass to the input of the preamp, which is not really your problem here. What may be your problem is that at lower volumes, the ear perceives less bass. Therefore you need to add some bass and/or low mids into your tone, either by increasing the low pass, or by increasing the lower frequencies on the graphic EQ. There is a name for this psychoacoustic phenomenon, but I can't remember it :-) Jennifer

[quote name='molan' post='777192' date='Mar 17 2010, 11:51 AM']My band has had a couple of requests to play a 'quieter' set prior to our main set at larger function gigs.[/quote] It's a great idea, and I can tell you that it definitely works! Would this be for playing during a meal and/or cocktails, or similar, where people will be talking to each other? If so, my considerable experience with this kind of gig is that the 'quieter' requirement should be taken really seriously. If you ruin anyone's conversation, even at the table right next to the band, they'll be unhappy. The key thing to watch out for is people leaning across the table or into each other to talk - if they are doing this then you are too loud. [quote]May not go totally unplugged but would definately try to use acoustic guitar and focus on our sax player more.[/quote] Again I urge caution - be wary of the "we're acoustic even though we are playing acoustic guitars into our 10kW PA" thing :-) You also definitely want to leave some dynamic range for when you play at the function later. Even unamplified, it is perfectly possible for unplugged acoustic guitar and saxophone (especially saxophone) to ruin conversations. Unless you are in a very large room, there should be no need to amplify the sax. Almost without exception, drums should be played with brushes. You can often get away with unamplified double bass, but acoustic bass guitar might (or might not) need some assistance. The problem is that if you amplify the acoustic bass guitar, everyone else wants amplified too... For this reason I almost always have the band go totally acoustic. Unless you are *really* disciplined with the sound, it *will* be too loud. It only takes one person to start the escalation in the volume arms race. [quote]We have both male and female vocals so can cover a fair range of material. To be honest I have a feeling this is likely to be very much in the background so won't be looking for big vocal masterclass kind of stuff.[/quote] Quite - indeed, I have found that some vocalists aren't appropriate for this kind of gig for several reasons. First of all is that many are too "needy" in terms of demanding audience attention, even subconsciously. It is far harder for a vocal to blend into the background than an instrument; by its very nature, a vocal often demands attention. Some singers can blend into the background, some cannot. It's not a fault as such, just the nature of the beast. Some songs are also "needy" - Georgia is one that springs to mind, for example. You're not really there to attract audience attention, just provide some ambience. Second, there will often be little or no applause or audience reaction during your performance of background music. This can really put off or wind up some musicians, especially singers, presumably since they are so used to fronting the band and directly receiving this kind of response. Not all musicians can perform well in the face of what they perceive as audience indifference. The good news is that it is not usually indifference, however. Your job is essentially that of a posh stereo, and if you do it well you'll often get a small crowd gathered round listening, and some people talk to you after the gig telling you how much they liked it. Jennifer

[quote name='FunkyFinger' post='776901' date='Mar 17 2010, 04:47 AM']Back when I first started playing if I needed to fret a note on a whatever string and if the next note was on a different string I would very often use a different finger. For example if my 3rd finger had just played an octave and i wanted a fifth next it would be my 2nd finger fretting it.[/quote] To me this matter is independent of the 1fpf/124 fingering debate. As in your example above, if you were going from C on the G string to G on the D string, then on bass guitar it is generally considered acceptable to use an adjacent finger, e.g 4 to 3, or to use the same finger, i.e. 4 to 4. Most people find that it is easier to get a legato (smooth) transition between the two notes going from 4 to 3, but it can also be done with practice from 4 to 4. Either is fine, but you would likely have intonation problems with the 4 to 3 fingering if you played fretless bass, and certainly on double bass the 4 to 4 method is encouraged, even when doing legato bowing. As others have said, barre approaches can also be used as can Billy Sheehan's "rockin' on the bar" (sp?) technique. Hope this helps! Jennifer

Cool :-) The neck really is quite excellent - someone broke the neck on mine at a gig (!), right at the headstock. Fortunately they knew a good luthier who was able to repair it, and he was really impressed with the design of the neck, thinking that the combination of thinness and strength was an incredible achievement. I bought this particular instrument because I liked the tone - all of the other 6 strings I tried back then had the "muso tone", whereas this one could get a far rockier tone if required. I ended up putting Rotosound flats on it and it sounds a bit like a P-Bass. Nice :-) I think I paid between 400 and 500 pounds for it, can't remember what the RRP was. How about you? Jennifer

I also have a similar Dean 6-string from around 1995/1996, picture below; It was my main bass for over a decade, great sound and great neck. I still have it, and indeed it does suffer from the bent bridge effect you've also noticed. It's been in the wars a bit since that photo was taken, but is still a great instrument. Model is "Dean DB96". Jennifer

String height issues aside, when playing pizz high in thumb position on the double bass, it is certainly not unusual to get a "pinging the elastic band" sound. If you pluck the strings substantially closer to the bridge when playing this high up the neck it can help a bit. Unfortunately it also means you'll get a fistful of rosin but hey... Bigbeatnut's suggestion about putting a shim between the "white plastic bit" and whatever is below it is a good one, and can be done quickly and non-destructively to see if an improvement is made. Jennifer

You'll definitely need rosin, without it the bow hair won't grip the string and will just gently swoosh across making no noise. It has to be specific double bass rosin, the rosin for other stringed instruments is different - I believe a stickier rosin is required to get the huge thick double bass strings moving. While I am also an advocate of the cheap and cheerful approach to music gear, I would advise caution with applying this too far to a double bass bow; learning to play arco takes a lot of time, patience and practice, and fighting against a bad bow will make learning a far more difficult and frustrating experience than it has to be. £30 is definitely on the nasty side of cheap - spending £100 will get you a considerably more pleasant arco experience. Jennifer

[quote name='butterfingersbeck' post='774438' date='Mar 14 2010, 04:52 PM'][list=1] [*]Should I get a 3/4-size bow to match my bass or doesn't it matter?[/quote] I don't think so - I've only played 3/4 sized double basses and always used a full size bow. One of my students has a smaller/lighter bow designed for smaller instruments, and it is not really the right thing. [quote][*]How do I hold the bow away from the bass while playing [i]pizzicato[/i]?[/quote] There are several approaches to this, fatgoogle has described one, but there are others. The method I use allows you to put your thumb against the side of the fingerboard allowing a more powerful pizz than the usual orchestral way. You can also use two fingers if necessary, and with practice you can flip between the arco/pizz positions very quickly. It is more easily observed than described, so here's one I prepared earlier :-) If you watch it in high resolution you can see what I'm doing with the bow quite well; [url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Na5ENYWKkQ"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Na5ENYWKkQ[/url] Jennifer

As Doddy says, it is rare to get a written bass part in treble clef. Some soloistic stuff for bass is written in treble and tenor clef, but again, this is very rarely called for. A situation where I have encountered treble clef is when the bass part has obviously been lost, and they've chucked a guitar part in the pad to substitute for it. They'll usually have chord symbols, so it's not really a problem, but it can be useful to be able to read treble clef for sections that are obviously unison parts or pedal notes. It shouldn't happen, but it does :-) PS: If you want to read "classical" music where the bass part has more rhythmic variation, then it is best to move forward through time to the Romantic or even 20th Century eras. Nielsen, Bartok et. al. will certainly deliver in this regard. Jennifer

The following links should help - they have fingerings for various scales using the Simandl method. [url="http://doublebassblog.org/downloads/1_octave_scales_with_fingerings.pdf"]http://doublebassblog.org/downloads/1_octa..._fingerings.pdf[/url] [url="http://doublebassblog.org/downloads/2_octave_scales_with_fingerings.pdf"]http://doublebassblog.org/downloads/2_octa..._fingerings.pdf[/url] The "-" sign means a shift, which you can do, or in many cases replace with a pivot on the thumb for the bass guitar. Jennifer

I love to read posts like this - I've found that one of the great things about playing music is that you really do get back what you put in, but multiplied. I try to pass this onto my students, and it's great to hear another example of it working in practice. Sure, people have varying degrees of inbuilt talent, but the only way to really nail something is with some graft. Also so true about the practice really coming out when your musicianship is liberated by playing with good musicians. Inspiring stuff. Jennifer

Awesome. Is that flatwounds on it? Jennifer

[quote name='thisnameistaken' post='758820' date='Feb 27 2010, 03:31 AM']I've tried that but I don't know if it's my bass or my strings (hybrids) but it sounds well boomy when I play like that. So yeah I'm playing with my fingertips and tugging quite hard I think judging by the blisters I'm getting on my index finger. At least I can switch to the side of my fingers when it starts to hurt. [/quote] Interesting - does this boominess manifest itself even when the instrument is unamplified? Jennifer

I used a six string exclusively for a decade, until I started playing double bass, after which the four string thing suddenly seemed to make more sense. I now have four, five and six string basses, and if the music does not require the extra strings, I'll use the four. The reason? While there are some benefits to basses with extra strings, there are also some costs; 1) They are trickier to play. Sure, it can be overcome with practice, but you'll need to do more practice. Also, there are some techniques such as slapping, that are *always* easier on a four string. Sure you can slap on a six, but when you get back to the four, it just seems so simple in comparison. 2) As others have mentioned, weight. This doesn't bother me, but it bothers some. There is also the issue of neck dive, which ERBs are more prone to. This can be reduced with good instrument design, a decent strap, lightweight tuners, but caveat emptor. 3) The big deal for me is that when you add an extra string, a design decision has to be made, and that is: should the strings be closer together, or should the neck be wider. When you get onto 6 strings, this becomes very significant; there are basses out there with very narrow string spacing, which can have problems - see point 1) re: slapping. I am also not convinced that narrow string spacing is great for playing rock or similar, when you really want to go for it. My preference for string spacing is that of a standard P-bass, but if you were to apply this to a 6-string it would end up with a very wide neck, which affects playability. I'm certainly not against ERBs, but some other points from my experience spring to mind; - The low B is useless for jazz. The high C is great for jazz soloing, but a double bass is better. - The low B can be useful, but I don't really need it that often. A Hipshot D-tuner covers a lot of these cases anyway. - A lot of people think they want the low notes on the B-string, but only because they don't realise how low they really are due to poor amplification that does not reproduce the fundamental frequencies of bass instruments properly. A truly amplified E string is a thunderous thing. - There are orchestration rules that apply to the use of very low notes, and the circumstances that indicate their use occur rarely. If you don't adhere to these rules you run the risk of your bassline becoming "detached" from the rest of the song. While I can and do use extended range basses, I just find the simplicity and elegance of the four string more appealing :-) Jennifer