Soledad

Just for the sake of sharing experience - what I've tried, what might work, what doesn't etc... I mentioned above about practicing without looking at the fingerboard - nothing to do with any md54 'rite of passage' but it's a really interesting thing to do. We're making music and one sense that we don't really need is sight. If you just look away I think your attention to pitch accuracy is more acute. Also it forces you to concentrate more on what your left hand position feels like. I just think it's worth a try (and a bit of tenacity). I do wonder if the main reason I look at the fingerboard is habit - that's how I learned from the very start cos I had to. I also stir my coffee clockwise - at least some of all this is just deep-rooted habit. Re vibrato and slides I said forget them - I don't mean for all time, it's just I think that developing fingering for pitch accuracy is more important early on - the artistic use of slides and vibrato can be added later 'to taste' as it says in the cookery books. This is a good thread (in the main) for us fretless pretenders (haha) - just wanting to share some things I have tried.

Nice to hear of a Twin valve user ! I'm hoping to get mine back soon (from a mate). There are a lot of variables here, but the first thing I think is perceived volume is frequency-dependent and the mid-range apopears to us to be loudest. The basic sum is diaphragm (cone area): pi. r . sqd (can't find the symbols on my Mac) - so the area of a 12" is approx 700 cm sqd (each). A 15" is about 950cm sqd. So for a given diaphragm amplitude the 2 x 12 will beat a 1 x 15 by a good way. The 212 will sound louder anyway as it's punch is at a higher frequency than the 15" (probably, again all the other variables will affect this). I'd expect a 212 and a 210 to be really good with a Twin Valve. I've had a few Trace combos wiith 15" in, and the speaker is the limiting bit by a way. I once hooked a 410 onto it and it was really loud but I wasn't sure the onboard 15 was contributing very much - i think the Hartke 10s were more efficient so doing all the heavy lifting. The easy thing would be borrow a decent (efficient) 212 and disconnect the onboard 15, run the 210 and 212 and see what happens - my guess is loud and ample bottom end. IIRC the Twin valve has only one speaker output so you may have to faff a little to connect the 2 cabs but there should be a way. I suppose they both need to be 8ohm too. Love the Twin Valve - not many around and they were way more expensive than the GP7 combos at the time, but what a sound !!

Just researching here...According to G&L site M2000 : NECK PROFILE: G&L 1 5/8" Medium C with 9 1/2" radius Any owner of an M2000 able to confirm this please? I have a hunch I may acquire one someday next few months and I like the 1 5/8, I'm no fan of the 1 1/2 (it's just that I grew up with an old P 1 3/4).

Totally agree. Midway through my bass life I broke off to study and play flamenco - for difficulty I would personally mark that 5* (out of 5) - the great players were born into flamenco families and started when they were 6. We have kids at school given a violin or 'cello to learn - they aren't scared of the fingerboard. OK it may not be pretty at first but where did all the orchestral standard strings players start? So, regarding fretless there's sound advice here to check your fretted L/H technique for precision (pardon pun), forget slides and vibrato - work on accuracy. And one of my favourites - look away, turn off the lights, play blind. It does come. Playing on pitch doesn't make you a great musician, but the great musicians have had to put the work in to make the sounds they hear in their heads. There's no magic or particular gift - it's just graft. (all IMHO of course).

Has anyone done a passive bypass pull mod - I mean (on the M) swap out the vol for a Warwick-style volume pull and send the pup signals just through volume and pan so you get a passive 'raw' output?? Wonder if it can be done, partly because I fancy an M2000 if one comes up somewhere, some time (I'm not chasing the one on eBay btw, just so we all know).

I guess that is a harsh truth, but it doesn't mean you can't be. I don't think Jaco or Pino were born with some enhanced motor skills us normals just don't have. There was a time when those guys couldn't play. I've found some good tips and insights here - it's a hill to climb and there isn't a top (I think Andy Summers said approximately that once). My cup's half full and I enjoy the climb.

I've been getting confused about L and M. On the 2000 the M seems to have the 5 pot EQ, the L 3 pot plus 3 switches. Is the M discontinued? No sign in retail that I can find, or on G&L site. The L has active / passive switch, the M is active only. Is this right?

Totally agree, if the Tribute 2000 could just have a passive pull on the vol that would be great - not one of those fiddly little switches. I think Warwicks have the passive pull, and my Mayones does, really tidy and quick. One reason I'm less keen on the US 2000s is the row of switches. I really like the M2000 all over but in particular the EQ looks very tidy / logical. There's one on the Bay at the moment - £113 but destined to rise a good bit I reckon. Wonder how many of us have snipes on that one

Pardon, que ?? I plan to run my Precision absolutely stock, but i'm interested. Been listening for what may be a bump in the high-bass (almost low mid) as per chart above, around 600Hz, 4dB which is quite significant. Although I don't know if the response curve above is P specific or just a generic low-pass cct. generally I have always just turned both full clock and sorted what I need at the amp. Maybe I need a valve head...

There's a lot of good advice and tips here - I've played fretless off and on for many years and it took me a while to figure out why I was often a tads sharp. Placing the centreline of my fingetip 'correctly' is a little sharp because my finger is a lot thicker than fretwire ! So slightly back and all is good. Personally I really dislike lined fingerboards - tried one once and it just put me off and caused the problem above. I have sometimes played/practiced in dark rooms - I really recommend that because it forces me to listen to pitch rather than look at it, and I think it helps develop muscle memory - the holy grail even on fretted but essential on fretless. One other thing maybe - find a fretless you like and stick with it. How it sits against you, neck profile etc all inform your muscle memory. Switch basses and some errors creep in. OK- you adjust and fix them but feeling at one with your chosen bass does help a lot I think.

That's mad ! Good I mean, but way outside my styles of playing. I'll start really slow... My Mac can't read the download default file - where do I find the pdf?

Good vid, thank you. Distinctly different from slap so interesting. Need to look closer again and will give it a try. Really good track to demo it on too !!

It's this thread in particular that prompted me to hunt dowm my Twin Valve combo - amazingly not too hard. I got it new, gave it to Mike, he got divorced so it's in store in Cheshire. Never been gigged. Hopefully it's coming back to me. May need a 210 to go with it. I do remember it sounding the VFDB Looks good too, all metally on the front, tasty.If I get it back i'll post pics.

Thanks ikay - so it is just a simple low-pass. Running at T10 all the time is not really affecting the lows, except that hump on T0 at around 500-600 is odd, looks to be about 4dB. I guess that's just some kind of circuit phenomenon and may vary from one circuit to another.- but I'll have a listen for it. But generally I'm OK doing as ever before, 10 and 10, eq at amp. Notice you're Horsham - just picked up a '97 P from Horsham on Sunday

Sorry if this is covered elsewhere but on a stock passive old-school Fender Precision, I always assumed the tone pot just cut top as you roll back counter-clock. I regarded it as a treble cut control having no effect on L/F. Is that right? It's just that I am messing with a TC BH250, having been used to old school heads (Hiwatt through Traces) and I find I'm spending too much time twiddling knobs looking for the sound- so back to basics and get to know what is actually doing what. In all my Precision years I always turned both pots full 'on' and did any eq at the amp. [note to self] maybe grab myself another Trace head, but that's a story

Really like the GP7 - plenty loud enough for normal work these days surely (days of massive backlines gone?) and I always reckoned the road to volume was more or better cabs anyway. The 7 band is really good - the frequencies are just right I think and I wouldn't need more. Like the 12 too of course, like them all really. Never tried a 110 but surely you'd need at least a couple? Would look fab, 2 of them with a 7 on the top. This thread is reminding me to try and get my old Twin Valve back - see if the guy I gave it to (yep, and it was truly mint) still has it.

I'm sure mine sat flush, but never removed them in all those years. Rick's Fine will know - personally I'd like them sitting flat but you could always compress them on so the indents form in the maple? Stunning work here. Reminds me again I shouldn't have sold my 64, but there you go.

wouldn't happen to be honey burst would it, rosewood neck, hailing from somewhere around Preston... I'd really like to get my hands on one, saw a review on YT and was impressed. Just hear good words about the Tribute 2000. Another accident waiting to happen I suppose !! p.s. agree a passive pull would be nice, but I do like the logical EQ, unlike all the switches on the M2000.

Just found this thread so sorry if I repeat anything (it's a long 'un). Right up my street this is. My long-term P was a Feb '64 (L16277) so I know them well. The machines are flush, not recessed. I guess the wood may compress a little (although maple is hard stuff). I'm sure this is covered elsewhere, but is the neck to '64 width / profile? Re ageing, I agree with your early comments regarding 'relics' - My 64 was gigged / played a very lot and I came nowhere near wearing off the paint at the top (right arm area) yet I see relics where it's down to bare wood. Mine was Lake Placid blue, and now resides with the bloke from Status Quo. Ageing the s-plate may be fun. They turn a weird yellow hint of grey / green colour. It's quite subtle but held next to a new white one it's very noticeable - I guess it's UV, pollutants in the venues - surely not . May be hard to simulate but could try UV lamps?? Also they end up not flat, have a slight kind of unflattness over time, and the edges become slightly rounded/softened. The clay markers on the neck are important - someone here will know what to use to get that and they go nice n mucky. Obviously the finger rest in the correct (lower) location - or at least the holes in plate where it would have been (I took mine off). And the holes for the ashtray and pup cover. Remember the strap button on back of head, spaghetti logo. The neck varnish / laquer will need to be aged / yellowed. IIRC the tuners were nickel plated, distinctly different to chrome and nicer, plus they go dull where you don't touch them (i.e. tune up). sorry to ramble on and excuse any points already covered - I'll follow your very fine mission with interest. p.s. the laquer on the neck on mine was thin (from new I'm sure though I bought it later). I did wear through the back where my thumb rests. I'd say keep laquer on neck (including head) quite thin. Far as I know it's the 90s MIJ ones that have a thick laquer but certainly my 64 was so thin you could see the thickness of the logo transfer edge... if you follow.

I did wonder - even unplayed I reckon strings loose the top a little just through oxidation (or something sciency). But there was next to nothing in it for me, and I end up imagining I can hear differences. Applause for a '71 P holding its own against an expensive contemporary take on the original. Thanks again Sibob - informative and good fun. and I have some Precision news to share - I'll be along soon

something for the weekend?