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[quote name='leadubblebass' timestamp='1362613409' post='2002340'] For me Its the fact it can be all comsuming -you can spend hours praticeing, rehursing gigs etc, and somehow you allways feel you could do more Have not really been on the road for 6 years now but with fuel heading towards £150 per ltr I do see how life on the road can pay! Ability wise I feel I have been stuck in a rut for years -how do you move on from that? Even more time spent playing? [/quote] Be bloody thankful you have a passion that you're involved with. A great many people were never even given the opportunity to find out what their passions and natural aptitudes are

[quote name='Earbrass' timestamp='1362613055' post='2002334'] As opposed to all that music created specifically to be hated by everybody. [/quote] You neglect the aspect of people who compose and play and perform purely for their own fulfilment, vanity, need, etc. There are countless successful musicians who are compelled to to this, but have little real self confidence and are troubled people, I would say a high proportion are. Like comics, actors, artists ..

You know, I'm not sure what the f*** people want anymore. There are people slagging off Def Leppard on here as pop pap, they were NWOBH who evolved instead of the knuckle dragging Saxon. Look at the slagging U2 get, they were amazing when they broke, they evolved as well and get slagged off as being sell-out pop. Van Halen were always pop, just like the Clash.

[quote name='peteb' timestamp='1362612555' post='2002322'] I take your point but I am not sure in songwriting terms that they are all the same. I don't think that the way that Dave Grohl approaches writing a song for the Foo Fighters is necessarily the same as the guy who writes Beyonce's material... [/quote] Should they be?

That's a very sad loss to music.

[quote name='steve-soar' timestamp='1362610902' post='2002279'] A pop song is a popular song in the charts, or, a pop song written by someone/people, who want that statment to be popular. Pop is U2, Beethoveen, Beatles, M, Radiohead, Steely Dan, Black Sabbath, Rennie And Renatta, Wings, Piolet, etc, etc, etc, ... [/quote] I think some people forget this, or haven't even considered it. They think pop is crap and unconsciously exclude music that they think isn't crap from the pop genre.

[quote name='iceonaboy' timestamp='1362602877' post='2002092'] See maybe we are talking about different styles cos I really like that and wouldn't class it as pop, at least not in the same sentence as one direction or olly murs [/quote] Pop is not just X Factor you know. Foo Fighters is pop, Ellie Goulding is pop, Beyonce is pop ..

[quote name='discreet' timestamp='1362602937' post='2002094'] Band name competition winner. [/quote] Pump The Dead Camel edges it for me Has a better ring to it

[quote name='iceonaboy' timestamp='1362602160' post='2002072'] Get a Q7 mate, great for yer gear ! [/quote] I would rather fellate a rotting llama than be seen driving an Audi

[quote name='Phil Starr' timestamp='1362601804' post='2002059'] I'm happy with my sound coming out of the PA but I use a Hartke kickback10 as my monitor, it's small, portable and points at my ears, Something like this means it isn't hit and miss as you have your own monitor. [/quote] Agreed, hence my 'need' for a power amp and Midget. However, there's no chance I'll be carting that about on London transport I'm happy to take my chances with the house monitors.

I don't have an amp or cab. I have a POD X3 LIVE that goes direct to the FoH desk. On stage I rely on whatever monitors are available (not always a big bass sound, but fine really), and if there's an amp with a power amp send / return I'll sling another POD output into the return for a bit of controllable stage pumping bass power. It's sometimes a bit hit and miss at unfamiliar venues with weak monitors, but as long as I can hear myself I'm alright. Most of the time it's fine and I can rest assured the FoH gets my same big old bass tones at every venue or studio. The only addition I would like would be a titchy but powerful power amp and a small cab like a Barefaced Midget.

[quote name='skankdelvar' timestamp='1362596247' post='2001945'] Well, you only have to see what happens when established artists give people what they [i]don't[/i] want. Think of all the bands who sold crillions then decided to have a 'change in direction'. Ten minutes later, they're flipping burgers or posting about 'projects'. One of the best examples is Garth Brooks - sold 100 million albums of pop-country then decided to adopt the fictional persona of 'Chris Gaines - an emotionally-conflicted rocker'. So GB released a 'rawk' album under the Gaines name and confused the arse off his market. Released one more album in his own right, which pretty much tanked and after a troubled few years has contracted himself to a 5-year Las Vegas casino gig. Career = Toast. And if there's any further doubt, consider the potential fan reaction here to Victor Wooten releasing a solo accordion album of 1950's German ballads and warbling away on 'Oh Mein Papa'. While various BC-ers would be spewing their ring, way yonder over on AccordionChat they'd be hailing the rise of a new star and talking about revivals and sh*t. Yes it is a very perceptive post. And objective too. I understand that we all carry our own baggage where stuff like money and art is concerned. But it's the same 12 f***ing notes we all use, so it can't be the music that pisses us off. Our objection is not to pop music but to the people who make it and the purpose to which it's put. Saw my mate Vincent Van Gogh in a dream last night. He'd used the crillions of cash from the most recent sale of his work to have an ear transplant and he was driving around in a pimped Aston with Keira Knightley in the shotgun seat. Happy as Larry he was, and his pictures looked just the same as they ever did. [color=#FFFFFF].[/color] [/quote] I had a good few s at this!

That is a dot and bound neck, not many of those around. Is it my eyes or the lighting or does the body look too thin to be a Fender?

[quote name='Dingus' timestamp='1362582568' post='2001667'] Let me put my cards on the table and say that I love a lot of commercial pop music , and that I enjoy listening to it and enjoy playing it myself in a band situation . I think that a good record is a good record and a good song is a good song , and the artistry which goes into a good pop record is just as valid as that which goes into the most esoteric non - commercial music . I feel that way because it has become increasingly apparent to me over the years that the deliniation between so called serious rock music and commercial pop music is largely an illusion anyway - all music for sale is equally a product , and the means and manner of production are not the defining factors when considering the worth of the final product . Does it make music worthless if it is manufactured by industry professionals of one kind or another rather than by individuals who are creating folk art as part of a cottage industry ? I don't think so . Both are means to a final ends . The great Motown recordings from the 1960s and 70s that are now rightly revered as great works of art were widely dismissed at the time by "serious " music commentators as formulaic and trite pop songs made by a cynically - run hit record production line . Similaly , bands like ABBA , who time has shown to be musical craftsmen equal to any , were rubbished as being throwaway pop artists without real merit . Only time can decide what has lasting worth . , and real quality is recognised sooner or later . Compare the Motown records or ABBA with a lot of the work of the Progressive rock artists of the same era and then judge which was "serious " music . [/quote] Spot on.

[quote name='iceonaboy' timestamp='1362582335' post='2001662'] . I hear what you are saying but I certainly am not ignorant . I know a f*** of a lot about music and I still hate mass produced pop. That music is not good in my book. I give many types of music the benefit because I realise that people have different tastes. Don't misunderstand me, there is still a lot of good music in the charts, but the twee Xfactor puss, is just throw away , forget tomorrow dross! [/quote] So how much of the pop field is occupied by 'X Factor dross'? Why do you concentrate on the small percentage of crap, like you get in ALL genres, instead of the good? You are fuelling your own prejudice.

[quote name='iceonaboy' timestamp='1362580915' post='2001631'] So why is it that I hate pop music? I cannot stand that mass produced drivel that emanates from the radio when you unfortunately stumble on radio 1 . I'm not saying I hate every song in the charts, but, as a whole, the genre is abhorrent to me. I consider myself as having a very wide taste in music from very heavy metal, through reggae to classical, but can't stand pop sh*te. I can't put my finger on it, but its real. I don't like pop music and I consider myself to be ruled by music. It consumes my life. It's all I do! [/quote] It's just your perception. It's when people say pop music is worthless drivel that I start feeling irked. Like it's inferior music with no soul. It simply is not true for the most part. It's prejudice and ignorance and a misplaced sense of 'worthiness'. There are of course manufactured bands for financial exploitation purposes, but even the Spice Girls had some cracking songs. Music is music. How do you feel about Alain Caron?

[quote name='skankdelvar' timestamp='1362578079' post='2001551'] We often talk about the hit record-buying public as if it were a homogeneous mass which indiscriminately gobbles up every chart-oriented offering as it falls off the end of the conveyor belt. Quite clearly, this is not the case. Lots of different people buy music for lots of different reasons. The market for music is sub-divided into larger and smaller groups with different tastes and with different motivations for buying the records they do. For example the average Bieber-buyer is probably about 8 years old and buys the music because their unformed minds are as dazzled by the pubescent prodigy as earlier generations were by Mickey Mouse or books about ponies. By contrast, pheremone-squirting, beardless young men rally to the stormy clash of Rawk Thunder while fat pale, girls sob into their frilly pillowcases to a soundtrack of wistful, warbly singer-songwriters touting small-bodied acoustic guitars. See, what we're talking about here is Function. Specifically, that music delivers a user-specific spiritual or emotional outcome. It's an outcome that derives not only from listening to the music but also to the sense of community that surrounds certain artists or genres. When you buy the record, you buy entry to the club. As a convenient bonus, once you're in you can exclude others (see vid below) Of course, this is more easily discernible in the very young, for they are engaged in assembling their identities from the dressing-up box that our consumer society leaves in the playroom. But the 'purchase > appreciation > community > identity' thing never quite goes away, as proved by the middle-aged tantrums that propel BC's evergreen Jaco / Beatles / Commerce vs Art threads. So, whether one is Justin Bieber or Uli John Roth - what's the formula for a hit record? Identify a discrete market, establish where their little heads are at, ask them what they want and give it to them at so many pence per download. [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MQ_eBTkB-rs[/media] [/quote] Great post Skank, and you are dead right. But I still think the variables are significant, and pop music production formulae mentioned in a previous post are still largely hit and miss. Do you think 'asking them and giving them what they want' works though? Do they know what they want? I doubt I could have told anyone what I wanted from music when I was a nipper, probably couldn't even now. Am I being a bit of a romantic thinking all music has some unquantifiable indefinable magic?

[quote name='chris_b' timestamp='1362575847' post='2001508'] Apart from the one guy who posted earlier, does anyone here actually know anyone who has written or is still writing hit songs, or have we just got 7 pages of fanciful guesswork? [/quote] I know and play with a couple of people who have in the past, not massive hits, but they got on ToTP and sold a bunch of records. Toy Dolls and Furniture / Transglobal Underground.

[quote name='Earbrass' timestamp='1362575009' post='2001494'] Without wishing to get into an unseemly semantic hair-splitting debate, I think you did: [/quote] Oh, it wasn't a demand, just a rail against what I see as a common misperception.

[quote name='thisnameistaken' timestamp='1362573903' post='2001462'] Well with pickups you're typically looking at a high impedance signal from passive electronics and a low impedance signal from actives, and yeah it can make a big difference. With some circuits actives just make them sound bad - nasal and unpleasant and weak. With others you don't get the same level of control over the gain as you do with a passive signal. I guess this is why active electronics are less popular among guitarists than they are among bass players. Actually I don't think I know any guitarists who use actives. [/quote] Thanks mate, understood.

Firstly, battery cages are for egg production, not meat Who told you you ought to respect pop music, or any music for that matter?

[quote name='Earbrass' timestamp='1362572258' post='2001431'] Do Bernard Matthews Turkey Twizzlers get the respect from chefs that they deserve? Creating a commercially successful product that reaches a mass market undoubtedly requires skills that most of us don't possess - many try and only a few succeed. But we should understand that those are not necessarily the same skills required to create a quality product. Most people with a love of cooking are not trying to emulate the success of the mass producers, they are engaged in an entirely different project for entirely different reasons, and to tell them they should have more "respect" for the creators of successful mass-market food products would be just plain silly. It's no different with music. The public are in general no more discerning when it comes to consuming entertainment products than they are with food or anything else. Is the Sun a better newspaper than the Independent because it sells more copies? Producing a paper like the Sun takes a lot of skill - these people are very good at what they do and it would be wrong to suppose that anyone could emulate them and achieve similar success. But that doesn't make it great journalism, or mean that people who are interested in quality writing should respect it or try to emulate it. It the field of creative endeavour, it's a great mistake to confuse commercial success with artistic success. Neither is easy, neither is something that just anyone can achieve, but they are different things. [/quote] I LIKE IT! However, do you think there are ethical problems with mass market music production? I don't. Can anyone say with any real integrity that Destiny's Child are more or less worthy than Weather Report?

[quote name='thisnameistaken' timestamp='1362568837' post='2001365'] [b]If he's using distortion then a passive bass is probably the way to go. A lot of dirt pedals are designed to work with the impedance of a passive pickup at their input, and don't sound so good with actives.[/b] OP: If you're using a Muff on bass with two distorted guitars you're going to struggle to hear yourself. There's no real solution to this - you're all using distortion so you're all treading on eachothers' toes, your sound is swallowed up in the sound of the guitars and the person who can hear themselves is the person who is loudest. To get more grunt out of your 'clean' sound you could try wiring your pickups in series (ideally fitting a series/parallel switch so you can swap between the two), this will give you a beefier, louder sound and it's an easy modification to make. As for your distorted sound, a Muff might never work very well with distorted guitars, you may be better off looking at an overdrive pedal instead. Any Tubescreamer clone would probably be suitable so maybe get a cheap one first (Digitech Bad Monkey is a good candidate) and see how that works out for you. [/quote] That sort of makes sense to me but aren't there loats of variables with pups and electronics anyway? Would an active bass really mess up the sounds from the dist pedal to an annoying or negative degree?

[quote name='Beer of the Bass' timestamp='1362567923' post='2001350'] The Big Muff has inherently mid-scooped EQ and I think the Terror Bass does also (though I've not seen the schematic). I wonder if the combination of the two is leaving a big hole in your sound? There is a simple mod to lessen the mid-scoop on a Big Muff by changing capacitors in the tone stack, which might be worth looking into before you change anything else. [/quote] Christ, why not just get a POD or something? All that cash and faff for one sound when a digital multi-effects/amp&cab modeling board makes the world of sound one's oyster.

[quote name='chris_b' timestamp='1362566345' post='2001315'] I've no idea what "downtuned stoner rock" is, but here goes: [/quote] It is downtuned rock music made by stoners, so they can't normally distinguish between mountain-levelling low end and a bluebottle trapped in a sash window anyway