Doddy

[quote name='bubinga5' post='899225' date='Jul 19 2010, 06:21 PM']i would say the single version is more pop while the album version is more jazz funk[/quote] I think I'd kind of agree with you there. Maybe that's one of the reason that I like it more,although at that time I wasn't listening to either Jazz or Funk. It just made me feel happier than listening to Oasis or Nirvana,which everyone else seemed to be doing at the time.

[quote name='Wil' post='899213' date='Jul 19 2010, 06:14 PM']You really don't need to know the rules in order to break them.[/quote] How can you break the rules if you don't know what those rules are to begin with? You don't have to learn what the rules are if you don't want(although I don't get why you wouldn't want to),but you are then not really in a position to break them either. Sure,you can play whatever you want,but often people who do this are just following the rules,albeit unknowingly. It may also have taken them longer to that point. If you understand the rules,it is far easier to move away from them and try new things.

[quote name='4000' post='899160' date='Jul 19 2010, 05:34 PM']Mr X could be musically more proficient than Stu (we'll never know), but personally I find the line in that track a bit waffly. It just sounds to me like he's loosely improvising around the changes in a fairly uninvolved way. I think Stu cuts to the chase much better and drives the song much better; in Bilbo's terms it's the difference between Ray Brown and Neils-Henning Orsted Pederson. To use that old chestnut, "cleverness is no substitute for true awareness".[/quote] I think that the 'looseness' of the album version gives it a cooler laid back vibe. Like I said earlier,that's the track that got me into Jamiroquai-I just really got into the groove of that track.I bought the album straight away(on tape from Our Price!!!) and played it to death,but that version of 'Space Cowboy' always stood out to me. This was about 18 months before I ever picked up a bass,so it wasn't the playing that attracted me.The whole vibe of the track just made me feel good. I've just stuck the album version on now,and it still does it for me more than any other Jamiroquai track.

Right,moving away from what seems to be the weekly Marcus Miller argument,and back on topic slightly........ It's been mentioned by a couple of people that when they play,they always sound like themselves. Now,obviously everyone has their own way of playing and sounding,but would you rather be in a situation where you can do your 'thing' with your own sound and let your voice be heard,or are you happy to adapt what you do into other situations?

[quote name='dr1' post='898824' date='Jul 19 2010, 12:28 PM']that's interesting. i'm not familiar with the history of his signature bass - i thought they started around 1998. thats 81/82. could it be it's his fender jazz which have been modified by sadowsky?[/quote] It's his '77 Jazz that his signature model was based on.

Sorry,but I don't get your point. "A major chord uses certain notes but this is not a rule". Yes it is. A major chord is made up of scale degrees 1,3,5- That's a rule. Like you said yourself ,changing notes gives you different chords,but a major chord is always built from the same intervals. So yes,there are rules. I'm all in favour of breaking the rules,but you can't break what you don't know. Yes,there are many great players who don't know any theory whatsoever,but there are an equal number who know exactly what they are doing.

[quote name='thisnameistaken' post='898230' date='Jul 18 2010, 05:51 PM']You're crazy. I know you have a big boner for Marcus Miller (and Doddy does too, even to the point of buying the same hat)[/quote] You've mentioned the hat thing a couple of times in the past,so I can only assume that it must really bother you,as once again it is totally irrelevant to the discussion.

[quote name='Pete Academy' post='898197' date='Jul 18 2010, 05:15 PM']How do you know they would sound ridiculous? I'd brt Marcus especially could comfortably fit in. You've labelled him a slap merchant without even listening to what else he did.[/quote] Good point.

There are very successful studio musicians who specialise in certain areas,so being a studio musician does not,in its self,make you versatile. The kind of players I'm talking about are the ones who can go and swing their ass off one day,and rock out the next. That's what guys like Nathan East,Will Lee,Alex Al etc do all the time. Sticking in this country, you have players like Steve Pearce,Paul Westwood and Trevor Barry who have successful careers doing just that. These are the kind of players that I'm talking about. These guys sound great in any situation that they find themselves,whether they like that style or not isn't the issue.They always give 100% and Make it sound and feel great. The big difference between Miller and Flea,for me,is that Miller paid his dues as a first call NY studio player doing 3 or 4 sessions a day before becoming the player he is now. Flea on the other hand made his name as a member of a very successful band,and as such,for most of his session work he is hired to do his thing and be 'Flea'.

[quote name='thisnameistaken' post='897976' date='Jul 18 2010, 12:28 PM']Law of averages.[/quote] In that case there are just as many good albums that these guys make. Let's be honest,even the best bands/artists,don't strike gold everytime. [quote name='thisnameistaken' post='898001' date='Jul 18 2010, 12:59 PM']Cheers but I don't like his sound or his solo stuff, and I was never a fan of Luther Vandross either tbh! I know he's a skilled player but I don't listen to songs because the bass player's good.[/quote] If I like a song or not,the bass player doesn't matter,but that doesn't make their contribution to the song any less significant. That Marcus discography wasn't even half the work that he has done,so it is highly likely that you will have heard him and not realised.It's the same with all of the great session players.They don't just do albums,they do loads of TV and movie soundtracks and jingle work too. Incidentally,I know that you are a big fan of Fishbone-well, Randy Jackson played on their version of 'Freddy's Dead'.

[quote name='thisnameistaken' post='897925' date='Jul 18 2010, 11:47 AM']I have heard of those players but beyond their most famous output I can't listen to them because I don't know what records they're on. If they've made a living doing this then presumably they're on hundreds of records? Most of them bad records?[/quote] Yes they are on hundreds of records,but why the assumption that most of them are bad?

I don't get how anyone could describe many great session players as having 'no feel' or being 'characterless'. If these guys had no feel and just went through the motions,then they would have a very short career. The reason that they continue to work is because they bring a great feel to the work that they do. As far as being 'characterless',again I have to disagree. You can still listen to albums of totally different genres and go 'Hey,that's Will Lee' or whoever. It could be from their tone or their note choices,but ever player has their own personality that comes through on the instrument-the guys who are working can adapt their 'voice' to the situation,rather than force it upon the music. As far as having a 'f***ing rock star to look up to',I didn't get into music that way. I grew up around great professional players that were doing everything from TV and radio to theatre work,so naturally these were the players that influenced me' since long before I started playing.

Don't worry about it. If you go into the exam thinking like that,you are more likely to screw up. If you know the material it will be fine.

It would be interesting to know what happened on the tour to make you feel like this.But until then,I'm going to offer a different answer from nearly everyone else. Maybe it would be for the best if you did sell some of your gear. If touring with your band was a dream,but in reality it made you feel low,then maybe music isn't for you. Maybe if you did sell your stuff you may get the urge to play again on a few years time and have more enthusiasm for it as a hobby. If you leave your gear lying around untouched,you may come to resent it.It's difficult for me to say because I have never felt like I have had enough of playing....Situations,yes,but never playing.

It's not disrespectful at all. No one is denying what the more specialist guys do.If they choose to stay within their chosen genre that's great. But then you have players who can do the job in a number of different genres,probably just as well as the guys who stay in one. Take a player like Randy Jackson(yes,the 'American Idol' guy). He's got a discography as long as your arm,ranging from Jazz and Fusion players like Herbie Hancock,Billy Cobham and Jean-Luc Ponty,through to Pop stars like Mariah Carey and Whitney Houston, via Rock Bands like Journey and Blue Oyster Cult. He's someone who sounds authentic in a number of situations,and who gets called for the gigs because he will get the job done quickly,and more importantly well.

[quote name='bubinga5' post='896933' date='Jul 16 2010, 10:19 PM']Doddy on a side Q...do you think Mr X worked out every fill? or round abouts the structure[/quote] I'd guess that he had the basic idea and then played around it,rather than working it all out before hand.

Ahhhhh....... The infamous Richard Bona lick. Here's an interesting thing about it........ [url="http://www.talkbass.com/forum/showthread.php?t=376795"]http://www.talkbass.com/forum/showthread.php?t=376795[/url]

For me,the album version wins every time. I think everything about it is better,from the bass to the vocal delivery and especially the break after the chorus,which although they are cool on the single,because this was the song that got me into Jamiroquai (and I listened to that album to death)the first time I heard the breaks on the single,later on,I was like "Huh?". So yeah.... Album version.

[quote name='Mickeyboro' post='896719' date='Jul 16 2010, 05:41 PM']PS: Anyone want a box set on t'cheap? [/quote] How cheap are we talking?

What kind of player would you like to be? Would you rather be a 'band guy' who does 'your thing', or would you rather be a more versatile player who can comfortably play in different situations? Personally,I much prefer versatility. I really like being able to play with a rock band one night and then do a jazz gig on upright the next. I've always tried to be as versatile as possible,so that I can handle pretty much any gig that is offered to me,whether it's an original band or a theatre show. The majority of the players that I really dig are these kind of players aswell. As much as I like players like Geddy and Claypool,I much prefer guys like Will Lee and Nathan East. Being a more stylistic player is cool,but I really think that I'd have way more trouble sustaining a career if I only did one thing,or played in one band.Plus I'd probably get really bored too.

So,basically it's recommending 'raking'. Even though I alternate fingers all the time,when it comes to descending strings at at speed,I find raking to be much more comfortable.I can keep a strict alternation between my two fingers,but I naturally tend to favour the raking technique. To be honest,I don't think it makes any difference which way you do it,as long as you can play what you are trying to achieve. Many players rake the strings when they are playing-I first saw it done by Jaco. Why do you have to 'relearn the basic modes' because of this? The notes aren't changing,only the way pick them. Try playing them as you normally would,without thinking about your plucking hand, and gradually increase the tempo. You may find that you are raking anyway, without realising it-that's what I did.

[quote name='Mr. Foxen' post='896129' date='Jul 15 2010, 11:59 PM']Were they brought out to compete with SWRs Goliath cabs?[/quote] Yes they were. David Nordschow designed the Goliath Cabs for SWR and later started 'Eden' with the intention of bettering what he did for them.

I don't think she was doing a particularly good job of 'holding down the groove'.

I've got to be honest,I had a similar reaction to the kid behind when he put the cushion over his head. Her bass playing was nasty.

Yeah I know that,but I still think it would be waaaaay more beneficial to write out the chords on a sheet of manuscript paper rather than on a chord box. I think that you would get a better knowledge of the notes within chords this way and would be able to transfer them all over the neck,rather than viewing the chord as a more restrictive 'shape',which is what chord boxes generally do.