Bilbo

[quote name='mcgraham' post='333888' date='Nov 21 2008, 02:52 PM']They had a coffee table style Limited (Re)edition of it too. It had a coffee table stylee book, numerous CD's, associated bumf, AND what appeared to be a 'blue' vinyl LP still in its original sleeve/jacket. I assume these are being distributed with these packs as New Old Stick collector edition vinyls. Mark[/quote] This fella, I assume [url="http://www.amazon.co.uk/Miles-Davis-Kind-Anniversary-Collectors/dp/B001D08SK0/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&s=music&qid=1227279325&sr=8-2"]http://www.amazon.co.uk/Miles-Davis-Kind-A...9325&sr=8-2[/url] I have all of its constituent parts so have no need to buy it but, for a completist, it is good value (the Robert Herridge DVD has some lovely Davis/Gil Evans and some of the best video footage of Paul Chambers that is out there. The Kind Of Blue DVD with all the names on it got my back up because the only mention Chambers got was one reference to say that he was on it - nothing about the absolutely crucial contribution that he made to the integrity of the sextet's performances).

[quote name='mcgraham' post='333882' date='Nov 21 2008, 02:47 PM']Sorry Bilbo, I'm not meaning to put it down. I'm just not in the mood for it at the moment. Nothing wrong with the music, but right now it's not what I'm after, so I didn't get it. Simple as that really. I'll get it eventually don't worry Mark[/quote] I have bought it three times!!

[quote name='mcgraham' post='333848' date='Nov 21 2008, 02:09 PM']I was tempted to get Miles Davis - Kind of Blue, I wanted something with a groove, something with a pulse[/quote] And your problem is? I keep meaning to send you some more Latin stuff but my CD reader has been kernackered and I couldn't get the stuff MP3'd and fit for travel. I just got a new usb cd burner so I will have another try... As for me, this month's purchases are; Joshua Redman - Moodswing Lee Morgan - The Cooker Abbey Lincoln - That's Him Red Garland - Groovy (all three for my Paul Chambers research) Ohad Talmor - The Other Quartet - Sound Stains Stravinsky - Rite of Spring (upgrading from vinyl) Dave Grusin - West Side Story (replacing a lost gem)

Prejudice - an unfavourable opinion formed beforehand without knowledge, thought or reason. I am not arguing with the accuracy of the original post but I do regret the fact that bass solos as a phenonmenon are judged on the basis of the worst examples and not the best. The reality is that most people have never heard a bass solo so, when they hear one, they don't know what to do with it! Personally, my favourite definition is the bass solo is 'the bit you can't hear in the car'.

Rufus Reid - The Evolving Bassist - simply laid out, it will give you the stuff you need to make sense of the thing and then you can move in any direction you see fit.

Coull be one of a few things but I guess its to do with the settings you have in relation to MIDI in and MIDI out (the one that determines which device makes the noise - could be your internal soundcard, your VST instruments or an external module). I don't know what the different boxes are called tho' and am reluctant to confuse you. I am at work and don't have the manual handy to refer to for the correct terminology. Can anyone else help?.

Learn to read music, get loads of theory under your belt and learn to play some burning jazz solos. Then go to a local jam session and kick some a***.

I am often overawed at my capacity to disappoint myself It only ever comes together about once or twice a year. The rest of teh time, I am looking for the motherlode and winning nothing more than a pan of gravel....!

That's not an argument, its sarcasm, which is the lowest form of wit. I COMPLETELY agree with the arguments against jazz musicians and tired old versions of the standards. There is a growing list of standards that I won't play. I COMPLETELY agree that a lot of jazz musicians are inately conservative and think that anything recorded after my Dad was born is too 'modern'. I COMPLETELY agree that jazz musicians are their own worst enemy and often shoot themselves in the foot by what can only be called 'low production levels'. But this is no different to every other genre of music and doesn't change the fact that 'Mustang Sally' has become a parody if itself, as have 'Midnight Hour', 'Dock Of The Bay' and 'Superstition'. Pointing the slow unmoving finger of scorn at Jazz doesn't alter that in any way.

[quote name='steve-norris' post='328561' date='Nov 13 2008, 06:27 PM']Bilbo just shoot me please! Bilbo why do i like 'A kind of blue' ? is it not real jazz or is it some simplistic form that a mere mortal like myself understand?[/quote] You like the best selling and most influential jazz recording of all time? So what's the problem? (So what's the first track, as well! ) Its real, mate. You are a jazz fan. Deal with it.

Some people put notches on the handle of their guns when people cross them. I just get a carrot.

I was stood waiting for a bus this morning listening to Bill Stewart drumming and thinking about this thread. It occured to me that one of the things that is distinctly different in jazz than it is in most other forms of popular music is the use of implication over statement. This is, as always, not an absolute but I'll try and explain what I mean. What I am referring to is a range of things really. Firstly, the time pulse. With many performances, the momentum of a jazz performance is not created by repetition in one area of the music. In, say, Funk, the bass lines can be repetitive, or the drum part, or the rhythm guitar or, sometimes, all three. In jazz, it is less likely that the pulse is actually stated for any significant length of time by one instrument. Riffs are implied, not stated, they are toyed with not just repeated. Chords are changed and substituted each time they are played, Melodies are twisted and realigned with the pulse, harmonies altered and altered again. Improvisations can be thematic and use the core of a compositions themes as a launching pad but rarely are these themes actually stated outside of the head. In rock, Metal, Folk, Pop etc the bass often plays and plays around the root note and or chord tones. Jazz bass playing does do this but it also tends to provide more of a counterpoint, changing its emphasis note by note, phrase by phrase, bar by bar. So, when you are listening to jazz, you need to kind of put that pulse in for yourself, define the core harmonies, themes etc and keep these in mind so that you can hear what is going on. Take any jazz standard that you know the melody of (e.g. My Favourite Things) and then listen to the performance whilst keeping that melody going in your head. As the players take it away from the familiar theme, you will be able to hear a relationship between the tune you know and the solo. One of my favourite things to hear is when a drummer uses the rhythmic phrasing of a melody to construct his drum solo. What previously sounded random thrashing, suddenly sounds totally logical. Eventually, you will be able to do this having only heard the main themes once and then you will really get a sense of what it is all about. What it is not is randon noodling. You have no idea how much it irritates me when people mention random noodling in connection with jazz. I keep a list.

[quote name='The Funk' post='327808' date='Nov 12 2008, 06:03 PM']That song is so hard to play well. I've never played a good version - only train wrecks.[/quote] Its a 'less is more' tune. Just play the roots and let the harmonies speak for themselves. Give the notes space to breath.

[quote name='dangerboy' post='327668' date='Nov 12 2008, 02:59 PM']What if you like listening to some jazz, dislike listening to some other jazz, but find jazz musicians, fans and students almost universally tedious and self-regarding? Obviously that's not unique to jazz, but they really do write the manual from which other musical bores learn.[/quote] With respect, DB, and this isn' t particularly directed at you, I find it ironic that so many non-jazz musicians refer to us as tedious and self-regarding (or something of that nature) but then go and rave about musicians who write songs with what they consider to be really important messages about 'life' or 'the streets', who are millionaires who drive around in limos or flash cars, stay in hotels that the rest of us couldn't even work in never mind stay at, attend celebrity dos, appear on posters, badges and t-shirts and spend the remainder of their time generally being pampered by the endlessly sychophantic. Personally, give me a man or woman who just wants to play their instrument really well anytime.

Wayne and Jimmy Johnson (no relation) in the Wayne Johnson Trio. Allan Holdsworth and Jeff Berlin on 'Road Games' - the last decent thing JB did. John Scofield and Steve Swallow - play with the same guitarist for 30 years and see how good it sounds! Pat Metheny and Steve Rodby - Rodby is Metheny's nearly silent partner. His reticence is a perfect foil for the guitarist.

I wouldn't necessarily disagree with this assessment of 'Giant Steps' but it is not alone. A lot of music is composed using 'artificial' stimulae e.g. tone rows are an obvious example but there are loads of other ways music has been created. Kenny Wheeler sometimes writes things and them flips them over and makes a musical palindrome. Gil Goldstein talks in his book on Jazz composing about using a skyline, for example, to inform a sequence of notes. Barrington Pheulong used the Morse code for Morse when determining the themn for the tv programme and has admitted to doing things like using the name of the murderer to inform the sequence of notes that forms the incidental themes in odd episodes. Classical composers have used church bells and marching soldiers, birdsong and 1,000 other things. Blues musicians have used train whistles. Isn't the opening theme of 'Tubular Bells' something classical played backwards. You finds your inspiration where you finds it!

[quote name='ianrunci' post='327628' date='Nov 12 2008, 02:25 PM']Don't know why everyone slags off Mustang Sally, its a classic soul tune by a classic soul singer.[/quote] Because I hear it every time I leave the house. It stopped being boring a long time ago. Then it got irritating. Now its like fingernails on a blackboard. Don't anyone play it again, please. Ever.

[url="http://www.jazzstandards.com/compositions/index.htm"]http://www.jazzstandards.com/compositions/index.htm[/url] Useful resource for anyone looking to know a bit more about the standards that feature so heavily in jazz.

[quote name='Exile252' post='327249' date='Nov 12 2008, 03:13 AM']I was thinking, the only Jazz song I really enjoyed listening to was a Jazz cover of Smells Like Teen Spirit. They had the improvising sections, but they also had a base to which they were working from, and didn't go off on weird solo tangents like they were not listening to the rest of the band.[/quote] That sucked. Big time.

[quote name='Lfalex v1.1' post='326890' date='Nov 11 2008, 03:58 PM']Is there an unwitting plug by Tolkien for a cerain brand of US bass cabs and subwoofers in that there address? Do Hobbits play short-scale basses, then?[/quote] No - its a unwitting plug for Tolkien by a certain brand of US cabs and subwoofers. Hobbits didn't have electricty. The just played halfling double basses, called single basses.

[quote name='Wil' post='326774' date='Nov 11 2008, 02:23 PM']Yeah, I don't think he was ever truely down and out. I think he did sleep in a "spike" in England and work as a dishwasher in Paris due to changing circustances, though. Coincidently, Down and Out in Paris and London is my favourite book of all time [/quote] My second favourite after 'The Hobbit'

[quote name='Jebo1' post='326695' date='Nov 11 2008, 12:59 PM']You can teach someone to play a 12 bar walking line in a few minutes that would, with some improvisation, see them through your most general of jazz forms.[/quote] Minutes to learn and a lifetime to master - what's wrong with that? [quote]... if you think that a heroin addicted Charlie Parker was planning all those substitutions, or a drunk Django was playing freely whilst calculating the changes you're a fool![/quote] The difference between a heroin addict and a non-heroin addict is the need for heroin, not the ability to think. Parker was considered to be a highly intelligent man by many who knew him. His knowledge of harmony was very advanced but his ability to function in the conventional sense was poor. Like a lot of people with that kind of focus, they are actually quite dysfunctional - I have often wondered whether Charlie Parker had Asperger's or some other autistic condition. Geroge Orwell lived rough for some time before he wrote 1984 and Animal Farm. Aleister Crowley and William S. Burroughs both used H at one time or another. The world is full of creative, intelligent people who have got hooked. As for intelligent alcoholics, where do I start...???