Squier CV Jazz vs Fender Am.Std.Jazz

[fatback]

Thanks for all that info. Great.

Been gassing for a fretted 5 but haven't been able to justify big bucks to myself. Also, there's nowhere to try more upmarket basses where I live, so this gives me a real possibility.

fatback

[fatback]

You know, there might be a useful buying principle in there:

if you're buying cheaper basses, buy passive and something like the Sadowsky preamp, as the cheap electronics let down the cheap basses. Also, buy an outboard preamp, so you can use it with all your (cheap) basses.

I'm in the interesting position of starting all over in terms of owning basses, and I like the bargain hunting element in trying to find very playable cheap basses (succeeded with my fretless bb400s).

This thread has sent me Squier-hunting.

fatback

Edited November 20, 2009 by fatback

[gjones]

I agree with everything I've read. Those CV Jazzes are excellent for the money. I have a Geddy Lee, which is a great bass, that I bought after doing a lot of research on what was the best value Fender Jazz for your money (read zillions of reviews). But after watching the bass whisperer comparison on ebay went straight down to my local music shop (strangely enough reddog music in edinburgh) and tried the squier jazz out. Absolutely brilliant and sounds as good as the Geddy for 4 or 5 hundred less. If it was sunburst I would have bought it there and then. I recommend checking out the bass whisperer on ebay for a direct comparison (If you haven't already) [url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x6Cd98DH__U"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x6Cd98DH__U[/url]

[skywalker]

I had a 2005 American Standard and now I have a 2009 CV, to my cloth ears there is no discernable difference.

[Sibob]

I'm going to sit down and do a proper comparison like OTPJ did, but what I will say at this point is that my Am Standard sounds pretty different to my Squier CV. The Squier sounds fine, but the Am sounds more 'complete', there is a wider range of frequencies in the sound, more clarity across the two pickups, it sounds a LOT livelier than the Squier. So from that point of view, my Am standard sounds better!

BUT:
1 - It's subjective
2 - I would expect a better sounding bass from a more expensive bass

Si

[funkle]

Quick update, for those who are interested.

Tried several different types of strings on this bass over the last few months:
[list]
[*]DR Sunbeams 40 - 100 (NPS, Round core): Nice feel, supple, but very mid scooped on this instrument. Stopped having the prominent mids of a 60's Jazz. Slapped very well. Off they came. Too darned bright, even after a couple of weeks on the bass and playing it a lot.


[*]Fender 7250L 40 - 100 (NPS, Hex core): Great classic Jazz Bass sound. Excellent fingerstyle sound, great bridge PU sound. Don't slap so well as the round cores, but still more than adequate. E string gets a bit 'hollow' sounding around the 12th fret. Upper mids became a bit more prominent after a month. Cheap, cheerful, will suit a lot of people.


[*]Dean Markley NPS RoundCore (Rocco Prestia) strings 40 - 100 (NPS, Round Core): Similar to the DR Sunbeams. Very bright out of the box, though they calmed down some once they've been played for a few weeks a couple of hours a day. Slap well, great feel, but not really a 60's Jazz sound anymore. More 'modern Jazz', mainly due to the mid scoop that they seem to have.
[/list]
I loved the original D'Addario Nickel XL's that came on the bass (NPS, Hex core), but they were too big a gauge for me (45 - 105). As I only recently figured out that's what this bass came with, I have only just ordered a set of XL 40-100's to try. Will post an update over the next few weeks after I stck them on. High hopes!


In poking around the innards, I have noted that the bass is shielded with carbon paint. Nice touch, especially in this price range. Not sure if anyone pointed this out before.

I have also started making some mods. It's so cheap, why not? The bass now sports Hipshot Ultralite 1/2" tuners (a worthy upgrade - better than the standard tuners - £80), block inlay decals (£7, ebay), and chrome knobs (£4, ebay). Also, a good bit more 'mojo' from having carted it over the the US for music school, playing it all the time, and the little dents and bumps that go along with constant use.

It'll have a Graphtech piezo system in it in another couple of weeks too. And possibly an acrylic ramp. Just for the heck of it! It's my only bass, and so cheap, that I'm having a lot of fun playing around with it. When I think about it, most of the music of the 60's/70's/etc was made on Jazzes which were built about the same sort of quality as this one (no graphite stabilisers, Alnico pickups, etc), so I reckon if it was good enough for them, it's good enough for me.

I enjoy this instrument more and more! It's great 'stock', and inexpensive enough that I don't feel bad about modding it a bit more to suit my tastes.


Pete

Edited February 14, 2010 by funkle

[EssentialTension]

[quote name='funkle' post='744446' date='Feb 14 2010, 01:13 AM']I enjoy this instrument more and more! It's great 'stock', and inexpensive enough that I don't feel bad about modding it a bit more to suit my tastes.[/quote]

Mine is still wearing Pyramid Black Nylons but now also sports a pair of Wizard 64s - it's sounding good - and a white pearl pickguard.

I've been considering some Hipshot Lollipop tuners.

Edited February 14, 2010 by EssentialTension

[Sibob]

I maintain that, pickups aside, these basses are the best 'budget' instrument I've ever seen!
I've moved mine on now, but thats more to do with my love affair with my MIA Jazz, literally won't let me play anything else haha.
But the amount of people I've put onto the CV as a 'starter bass that will last forever' is immense!

Si

[funkle]

Point of information to raise.

If you have an '08 or prior CV (serial number starts with 08), which is stamped 'Crafted in China', then the body is not made of basswood, but of alder. Apparently, sometime in 2009, production was shifted from China to Indonesia, with a change in the specs, including a change from alder to basswood.

I had a friendly chat with someone here in Florida who works in the instrument manufacturing industry, and who works with the factory where these basses were made (in China). This particular factory uses the same wood supplier as the Fender Custom Shop, and in fact has much larger wood stocks than Fender. Wood choice and quality control is apparently top notch, and basses cost more to produce at this factory than others in Asia; hence Fender's move of production last year to Indonesia.

I handed my bass today over to Jeff Berlin's tech for the work I mentioned previously - right enough, he confirmed it was alder. Guess that explains the weight on mine - 9.5 lbs.

I'm not sure what the '09 CV models sound like. But if you can snag an '08 that says 'Crafted in China', then you're on to a well built bass with good wood quality. Pretty much exactly the same as what many bassists of yesteryear would have played on....

No wonder Fender shifted production, I'm sure they literally cannot afford to make a bass this good at this price point.

In passing, I note that OutToPlayJazz's CV was an 08/'China' model.

[funkle]

Another quick thing.

For mods to electronics, this bass is apparently pretty easy to work with. According to Jeff's tech, the routing of the electronics cavity is fairly generous compared to other jazzes, and there's a large route around the neck pickup which is continuous with the electronics cavity (hidden by the pickguard), so there's plenty of room.

Edited February 19, 2010 by funkle

[Sibob]

[quote name='funkle' post='750390' date='Feb 18 2010, 11:50 PM']Point of information to raise.

If you have an '08 or prior CV (serial number starts with 08), which is stamped 'Crafted in China', then the body is not made of basswood, but of alder. Apparently, sometime in 2009, production was shifted from China to Indonesia, with a change in the specs, including a change from alder to basswood.

I had a friendly chat with someone here in Florida who works in the instrument manufacturing industry, and who works with the factory where these basses were made (in China). This particular factory uses the same wood supplier as the Fender Custom Shop, and in fact has much larger wood stocks than Fender. Wood choice and quality control is apparently top notch, and basses cost more to produce at this factory than others in Asia; hence Fender's move of production last year to Indonesia.

I handed my bass today over to Jeff Berlin's tech for the work I mentioned previously - right enough, he confirmed it was alder. Guess that explains the weight on mine - 9.5 lbs.

I'm not sure what the '09 CV models sound like. But if you can snag an '08 that says 'Crafted in China', then you're on to a well built bass with good wood quality. Pretty much exactly the same as what many bassists of yesteryear would have played on....

No wonder Fender shifted production, I'm sure they literally cannot afford to make a bass this good at this price point.

In passing, I note that OutToPlayJazz's CV was an 08/'China' model.[/quote]

This is very interesting, the CV's seem to have been introduced around March '08, so nothing prior to that?!. I purchased my CV in the latter part of '09 absolutely new, and it was a Chinese made instrument.
I imagine if the original ones were made of Alder, Fender would have made a big song and dance about it!?

Si

[funkle]

[quote name='Sibob' post='750407' date='Feb 19 2010, 01:05 AM']This is very interesting, the CV's seem to have been introduced around March '08, so nothing prior to that?!. I purchased my CV in the latter part of '09 absolutely new, and it was a Chinese made instrument.
I imagine if the original ones were made of Alder, Fender would have made a big song and dance about it!?

Si[/quote]

No idea. My contact said Fender quietly changed the website in '09 to mark the change in specs. Me, I'm late to the party, I had no idea. Today was a total surprise.

I suspect Fender may have not wanted to make a song and dance about it - they'd be creating a line which would rival their own more expensive products. WHy buy a MIM Fender for more, when the CV will do the same (and better) for less? For the same reason, and to improve their own profitability, I assume they are going to ensure that future CV's are cheaper instruments to manufacture (although hopefully still great sounding).

[EssentialTension]

[quote name='funkle' post='750390' date='Feb 18 2010, 11:50 PM']Point of information to raise.

If you have an '08 or prior CV (serial number starts with 08), which is stamped 'Crafted in China', then the body is not made of basswood, but of alder. Apparently, sometime in 2009, production was shifted from China to Indonesia, with a change in the specs, including a change from alder to basswood.

I had a friendly chat with someone here in Florida who works in the instrument manufacturing industry, and who works with the factory where these basses were made (in China). This particular factory uses the same wood supplier as the Fender Custom Shop, and in fact has much larger wood stocks than Fender. Wood choice and quality control is apparently top notch, and basses cost more to produce at this factory than others in Asia; hence Fender's move of production last year to Indonesia.

I handed my bass today over to Jeff Berlin's tech for the work I mentioned previously - right enough, he confirmed it was alder. Guess that explains the weight on mine - 9.5 lbs.

I'm not sure what the '09 CV models sound like. But if you can snag an '08 that says 'Crafted in China', then you're on to a well built bass with good wood quality. Pretty much exactly the same as what many bassists of yesteryear would have played on....

No wonder Fender shifted production, I'm sure they literally cannot afford to make a bass this good at this price point.

In passing, I note that OutToPlayJazz's CV was an 08/'China' model.[/quote]
08/China here too so that's very interesting.

Is it the same story for the CV Precisions?

[Wil]

Great review, up to your usual high standard OTPJ! Having played recent Squire guitars from the vintage line, I can believe the quality too. They've really come on in leaps and bounds in recent years, the choice for budding bassists or those who don't want to spend a fortune has never been better it seems.

[EssentialTension]

[quote name='funkle' post='750390' date='Feb 18 2010, 11:50 PM']If you have an '08 or prior CV (serial number starts with 08), which is stamped 'Crafted in China', then the body is not made of basswood, but of alder. Apparently, sometime in 2009, production was shifted from China to Indonesia, with a change in the specs, including a change from alder to basswood.

I had a friendly chat with someone here in Florida who works in the instrument manufacturing industry, and who works with the factory where these basses were made (in China). This particular factory uses the same wood supplier as the Fender Custom Shop, and in fact has much larger wood stocks than Fender. Wood choice and quality control is apparently top notch, and basses cost more to produce at this factory than others in Asia; hence Fender's move of production last year to Indonesia.[/quote]
I don't mean to doubt any of this as such but could you clarify. Is this a rumour with some evidence to back it up or is definite truth, as they say?

[funkle]

[quote name='EssentialTension' post='758368' date='Feb 26 2010, 05:44 PM']I don't mean to doubt any of this as such but could you clarify. Is this a rumour with some evidence to back it up or is definite truth, as they say?[/quote]

Definite truth. The person whom I know is next week visiting the factory in China where the Squier CV's were made, before production was shifted to Indonesia. I spoke again to them today - to paraphrase: if the Squier CV has 'Crafted in China' on it, it was made in this (very good) factory, and it will be alder. Some of the 09's may be alder too, but only if they say they were 'Crafted in China'. Otherwise, they're made in Indonesia, and hence are basswood.

Edited February 27, 2010 by funkle

[Sibob]

This is a quote from another thread relating to the new new new Fiesta Red Classic Vibe Precision:

"[i]Well that is an easy one, I did ask the gentleman on the phone when I was ordering mine, what does it say on the back of the headstock and he confirmed that it's the same as the other 3 Classic Vibe's i.e. "Crafted in China". in fact except for the colour there are no differences in quality and parts. It's exactly the same as the Sonic Blue Precision.[/i]"

I'm genuinely interested to know what your 'friend in the know' thinks of this

Si

[funkle]

[quote name='Sibob' post='769762' date='Mar 9 2010, 10:24 PM']This is a quote from another thread relating to the new new new Fiesta Red Classic Vibe Precision:

"[i]Well that is an easy one, I did ask the gentleman on the phone when I was ordering mine, what does it say on the back of the headstock and he confirmed that it's the same as the other 3 Classic Vibe's i.e. "Crafted in China". in fact except for the colour there are no differences in quality and parts. It's exactly the same as the Sonic Blue Precision.[/i]"

I'm genuinely interested to know what your 'friend in the know' thinks of this

Si[/quote]

No problem. I'm not quite clear here though - What's the question you want answered?

[Sibob]

New CV's are seemingly Chinese made........not indonesian!
What are his thoughts on his previous information suggesting the contrary:
[quote]hence Fender's move of production last year to Indonesia.[/quote]

Si

[funkle]

[quote name='Sibob' post='769909' date='Mar 10 2010, 12:19 AM']New CV's are seemingly Chinese made........not indonesian!
What are his thoughts on his previous information suggesting the contrary:


Si[/quote]

Ah. Apologies. Not sure - this person is visiting the relevant factory in China now. They were confident that production had been moved from this factory to Indonesia, and that it had already happened for the CV Squiers. The other possibility, which I am sticking in here on my own supposition, is that production could alternatively have been moved from one Chinese factory to another. Wait and see, I guess! The labels on the back of the headstock will eventually tell.

[EssentialTension]

Last week I asked at the Fender forum about this China/Indonesia/alder/basswood issue but no responses at all so far.

[EssentialTension]

[quote name='funkle' post='769988' date='Mar 10 2010, 04:05 AM']The labels on the back of the headstock will eventually tell.[/quote]
That's the point really - the brand new 2010 fiesta red P bass is still crafted in China and presumably at the same factory

[Grand Wazoo]

I love all 3 of them, but if I was to nominate a favourite out of the 3 I would say the 51 Precision has the sweeter and mellower sound

Of course all 3 are fitted with Seymour Duncans and high quality pots, capacitors and wiring looms. The 51 precision wires were as thin as those found in old trnsistor radios, you could just cut them with your nails.

[daz]

Sigh! Another guitar to save up for! James Johnson Classic Vibe Squire

Edited March 14, 2010 by daz

[EssentialTension]

[quote name='funkle' post='769988' date='Mar 10 2010, 05:05 AM']Ah. Apologies. Not sure - this person is visiting the relevant factory in China now. They were confident that production had been moved from this factory to Indonesia, and that it had already happened for the CV Squiers. The other possibility, which I am sticking in here on my own supposition, is that production could alternatively have been moved from one Chinese factory to another. Wait and see, I guess! The labels on the back of the headstock will eventually tell.[/quote]
Any update on this?