joescartwright Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 I’ve got a few P basses, all of them have dead spots centring around C/D on the G string that drive me a little bit insane! I’ve read a bit about it which come to the general conclusion that it’s almost inherent in the design that there is a lack of resonance in this region and you can minimise it by adding weights... I was just wondering why it would be the case that playing the same pitches on the other strings wouldn’t experience the same resonance issues? I've found the problem to be far more pronounced with flats than rounds which got me wondering how much of an influence the strings have. If anyone has any insight I’d be very interested to hear it! Cheers, Joe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ikay Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 The attached doc gives a useful scientific explanation of dead spots and is worth a read. They occur where resonant frequencies in particular parts of the neck happen to coincide with exactly the same position as a fretted note of the same frequency. Read on to become demystified in this much misunderstood topic! Dead_Spots_Bass_English.pdf 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joescartwright Posted October 3, 2020 Author Share Posted October 3, 2020 Wow! That was more in depth than I had anticipated!!! Thanks for the info. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hooky_lowdown Posted October 3, 2020 Share Posted October 3, 2020 I've owned dozens of P basses, all have had flats, various price points, various weights, only one had a dead spot. I'm pretty sure it's not inherent to P basses?!? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joescartwright Posted October 3, 2020 Author Share Posted October 3, 2020 From what I’ve read a dead spot around the 5th fret on the G string comes up over and over and again. Particularly with Fender basses and other basses with similar construction. I’ve also read several stories of Leo Fender stating it was an issue and then suggesting adding weight to the neck. Wether or not that’s actually correct I’m not sure though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joescartwright Posted October 3, 2020 Author Share Posted October 3, 2020 Although after reading the document posted above it would seem that it’s an inherent part of any solid body instrument to some degree or another. I can’t imagine making a neck that is equally resonant for all frequencies out of wood would be an easy feat! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andyjr1515 Posted October 4, 2020 Share Posted October 4, 2020 Interesting article @ikay I had always assumed it was related to the node pattern of the string and not so much the neck. I have never tried it, but I wonder, assuming the article is an accurate assessment of what is going on, if a judicious tweak to the truss rod could make a difference. I would have thought that would make a tangible difference to the vibration characteristics of the neck and, if I read the article correctly, presumably you only need to move that node a teeny bit away from the fret. And the other thing I've never tried is detuning a semitone. If the paper is right, then that should completely change the node positions... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woodinblack Posted October 4, 2020 Share Posted October 4, 2020 I always thought that the multiple laminate neck was there specifically to eliminate resonances and temperature effects, whereas the P neck being a solid chunk of tree had one pure resonance. I have never noticed a dead spot on a P, but only really had one I played (which had a stripe on the back). However, I have always seen reports of dead spots on certain areas, so it seems unlikely it is nothing (whether you get it or notice it yourself). I would also assume the 'never change my strings and have half a pound of cheese under the block' brigade would never notice it anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hellzero Posted October 4, 2020 Share Posted October 4, 2020 (edited) And then come those stating that what makes the sound of an electric instrument are the pickups (and preamp). I'm saying it loud for more than 30 years : an electric bass (or guitar) is before all an acoustic instrument. If it doesn't sound unplugged, it will not sound plugged... You can try this to add mass to your headstock and move the frequency resonance just enough to suppress the dead spot : https://m.thomann.de/gb/fat_finger_guitar_chrome.htm Christophe LEDUC once told me, a very long time ago, that all instruments have a dead spot, even a Steinway piano or full graphite instruments, but the work of the luthier is to "hide" that dead spot. That said, he is an architect before being a luthier, knowing all these facts... Edited October 4, 2020 by Hellzero Spelling Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ikay Posted October 4, 2020 Share Posted October 4, 2020 (edited) 11 hours ago, Andyjr1515 said: ...if a judicious tweak to the truss rod could make a difference. I would have thought that would make a tangible difference to the vibration characteristics of the neck and, if I read the article correctly, presumably you only need to move that node a teeny bit away from the fret. And the other thing I've never tried is detuning a semitone. If the paper is right, then that should completely change the node positions... Yes to both the above. A small tweak on the trussrod (one way or the other) will shift the resonance slightly, whether enough to make it go away will depend case by case. Detuning by a semitone will dramatically shift any coincident resonances. You will lose the old dead spots but might find some new ones! 10 hours ago, Hellzero said: Christophe LEDUC once told me, a very long time ago, that all instruments have a dead spot, even a Steinway piano or full graphite instruments, but the work of the luthier is to "hide" that dead spot. I think this is exactly right. I had a Zon with a noticeable dead spot, higher up the neck than usual due to the stiffness of the neck but it was definitely there. Variations in harmonic content and decay characteristics of individual notes will usually be found on any instrument if you listen hard enough. Edited October 4, 2020 by ikay Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baloney Balderdash Posted October 7, 2020 Share Posted October 7, 2020 (edited) The cure to this is getting a short scale bass. Short scale basses will very rarely have any dead spots. Adding weight to the headstock does actually work, but rather than eliminating the issue it most often just move it to somewhere else on the neck. Edited October 7, 2020 by Baloney Balderdash Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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