The IEM (in ear monitors) Bible thread - a guide to help every musician

[Wombat]

Cool, TY. With the Zoom lt 12 you can plug straight into the desk if you are wired - I have a long trs for small gigs but use my nux transmitter if I’m not standing next to the mixer.

[dave_bass5]

13 minutes ago, Wombat said:

Cool, TY. With the Zoom lt 12 you can plug straight into the desk if you are wired - I have a long trs for small gigs but use my nux transmitter if I’m not standing next to the mixer.

Those are headphone outs, so will already have an amp built in to them. Most mixers dont have those and just use standard passive outs. I sometimes do the same with the headphone out on my XR18, straight in to my IEMS using a long stereo TSR extension cable. 

[Al Krow]

1 hour ago, dave_bass5 said:

Those are headphone outs, so will already have an amp built in to them. Most mixers dont have those and just use standard passive outs. I sometimes do the same with the headphone out on my XR18, straight in to my IEMS using a long stereo TSR extension cable. 

 

It's certainly a very straightforward option to set personalised monitor out levels on the A&H CQ desks - so I'm not quite sure about your point that most mixers don't have preamps built in or if I've misunderstood what you're saying?

[Wombat]

12 minutes ago, Al Krow said:

 

It's certainly a very straightforward option to set personalised monitor out levels on the A&H CQ desks - so I'm not quite sure about your point that most mixers don't have preamps built in or if I've misunderstood what you're saying?

Soz, I’ve recently been thinking about upgrading to a CQ18 so some of the comments here ‘perked my interest’ as I can’t seem to find one in a shop I can actually look at! Yes, I am interested if I can ‘just plug my trs in the monitor out’ but from what you say I will need some sort of amplifier. It’s not a problem as I can just use my iems all the time or pick up one of those little Beringher things. Just getting my mind round the differences to the lt12. I guess that’s a ‘dark horse’ for actually having the built in preamps. I got that on a recommendation because it has 5 sends and didn’t realise at the time but it’s been a cracking little mixer for the sort of gigs we do.

[Al Krow]

27 minutes ago, Wombat said:

Soz, I’ve recently been thinking about upgrading to a CQ18 so some of the comments here ‘perked my interest’ as I can’t seem to find one in a shop I can actually look at! Yes, I am interested if I can ‘just plug my trs in the monitor out’ but from what you say I will need some sort of amplifier. It’s not a problem as I can just use my iems all the time or pick up one of those little Beringher things. Just getting my mind round the differences to the lt12. I guess that’s a ‘dark horse’ for actually having the built in preamps. I got that on a recommendation because it has 5 sends and didn’t realise at the time but it’s been a cracking little mixer for the sort of gigs we do.

 

Hi, you absolutely can plug your IEM directly into the CQ18 with nothing in between! You don't need a separate amplifier if you are going wired, and wireless units all come with built in amplifiers to enable them to transmit wirelessly.

 

In my band two of the band members use wired IEMs straight into the desk and two of us use wireless (Xvive U4s).

 

In terms of tailoring the individual IEM mixes, this can be done:

a) on the desk itself;

b) via the CQ app on each band member's phone, so they can adjust as they go along.

 

In terms of setting the overall IEM volume levels, this can also be done:

a) on the desk itself; 

b) via the CQ app on each band member's phone, so they can adjust as they go along;

c) the wireless Xvive U4s have an additional volume control on the receiver (which clips onto our belts / garments).

 

We had a Soundcraft MTK12 before - a very decent mid-range analogue desk. 

 

The A&H CQ18T is a very substantial step up in its capabilities:

- being able to tailor IEM mixes IMO makes a MASSIVE difference to how well band mates adjust to and are happy to accept IEMs vs stage monitors/amplifiers; 

- then add on the ability to set and store EQ / mix / FoH settings for different line-ups and venues, which you couldn't even dream of doing with an analogue desk; plus

- better quality pre-amps that have my singers remarking on the difference on what they're hearing,

 

and I've not even started on the additional fx and other capabilities that the desk has! So I guess it's easy to see why the CQ18T has been the best piece of PA equipment that we've bought for the band in some while!

 

Hope that all helps?

 

Edited 10 hours ago by Al Krow

[Wombat]

Thanks, that's great. I do sound (if that's not obvious) and after about 2 years 'the lads' have finally realised I can tweak their individual mixes - even though I've said this at almost every gig 😂.

This is leading to requests to tweak between almost every song so the 'main attraction' is the fact I can install the app on their phones and let them get on with it! 

I've been in a band with an xr18 in the past and loved it, but was always worried that you couldn't tweak things on the desk. The CQ18 seems to address this and gives 'the best of both worlds'.

[dave_bass5]

59 minutes ago, Al Krow said:

 

It's certainly a very straightforward option to set personalised monitor out levels on the A&H CQ desks - so I'm not quite sure about your point that most mixers don't have preamps built in or if I've misunderstood what you're saying?

I was talking about the headphone outs, not channels or inputs. 
Headphone outputs have amps built in to them, otherwise you won’t hear much. Normal Aux sends and just passive outputs that you can’t expect to plug headphones in to and hear anything.  In fact i didnt say preamp, i said amp. 
My reply was to the comment about using a zoom LT 12 (IIR you had one?). That has 6 headphone outs so there is no need for any extra amps if you don’t want to use them, so you can plug headphones or IEM’s directly in to it.  

Hopefully that clears things up 

Edited 10 hours ago by dave_bass5

[Al Krow]

2 minutes ago, Wombat said:

Thanks, that's great. I do sound (if that's not obvious) and after about 2 years 'the lads' have finally realised I can tweak their individual mixes - even though I've said this at almost every gig 😂.

This is leading to requests to tweak between almost every song so the 'main attraction' is the fact I can install the app on their phones and let them get on with it! 

I've been in a band with an xr18 in the past and loved it, but was always worried that you couldn't tweak things on the desk. The CQ18 seems to address this and gives 'the best of both worlds'.

 

100%

[Al Krow]

5 minutes ago, dave_bass5 said:

I was talking about the headphone outs, not channels or inputs. 
Headphone outputs have amps built in to them, otherwise you won’t hear much. Normal Aux sends and just passive outputs that you can’t expect to plug headphones in to and hear anything.  
My reply was to the comment about using a zoom LT 12 (IIR you had one?). That has 6 headphone outs so there is no need for any extra amps if you don’t want to use them, so you can plug headphones or IEM’s directly in to it.  

 

"Normal Aux sends and just passive outputs that you can’t expect to plug headphones in to and hear anything."

 

That's where I'm getting confused: there's nothing stopping anyone plugging their wired/passive IEMs directly into the monitor outs on the A&H CQ desk. Its built in preamps provide plenty of headroom, and I'm assuming the A&H CQ desk is not unusual in having preamps?

 

Edited 10 hours ago by Al Krow

[dave_bass5]

6 minutes ago, Wombat said:

Thanks, that's great. I do sound (if that's not obvious) and after about 2 years 'the lads' have finally realised I can tweak their individual mixes - even though I've said this at almost every gig 😂.

This is leading to requests to tweak between almost every song so the 'main attraction' is the fact I can install the app on their phones and let them get on with it! 

I've been in a band with an xr18 in the past and loved it, but was always worried that you couldn't tweak things on the desk. The CQ18 seems to address this and gives 'the best of both worlds'.

Im in the same boat. Because i have the ‘master’ iPad sitting on my keyboard i get asked to do all the IEM tweaks etc, even though they have all downloaded Mixing staton etc. Its a pain as i will have my IEM’s in so cant really judge (or hear) what others want. I do get it though, its easier for mew as i have an always on connected device, but it still hasnt sunk in that they really need to be doing this at soundchecks first. 

[Wombat]

Soundcheck? You mean where they sort their hair and practice the poses they want to pull?

[dave_bass5]

13 minutes ago, Wombat said:

Soundcheck? You mean where they sort their hair and practice the poses they want to pull?

No, i mean when they then decide to start plugging things in and tune up etc,  you know, an hour after arriving and having a chat etc, or walk off to go to the toilet. 

[Woodinblack]

1 hour ago, Wombat said:

This is leading to requests to tweak between almost every song so the 'main attraction' is the fact I can install the app on their phones and let them get on with it! 

I've been in a band with an xr18 in the past and loved it, but was always worried that you couldn't tweak things on the desk. 

 

You can tweak things on the XR18 - not sure why that would be different? You can put mixing station in a 'AUX only' mode, so they can only affect their own mix.

[Wombat]

I was meaning that the xr18 doesn't have any actual knobs or a screen that comes on when you power it up. I know too many people who say they've 'lost connection' for whatever reason or ended up cobbling a wired connection together for it.

Doesn't seem to be the same issues with the CQ18.

[Woodinblack]

3 minutes ago, Wombat said:

I was meaning that the xr18 doesn't have any actual knobs or a screen that comes on when you power it up. I know too many people who say they've 'lost connection' for whatever reason or ended up cobbling a wired connection together for it.

 

I have never actually lost connection (without using the internal network and a U4 aside) and I am not sure on the term 'cobbling' really matches connecting a standard ethernet connection, but ok! Yes, the CQ18 has a screen and hardware controls that are handy for setup, although I wouldn't really want to rely on that during a gig so wireless issues would presumably be the same. I would assume you could also connect to the CQ18 with an ethernet connection (at least I would hope you could), so you could use a hardware surface, which honestly always beats a table if you happen to also be gigging!

[dave_bass5]

2 hours ago, Al Krow said:

 

"Normal Aux sends and just passive outputs that you can’t expect to plug headphones in to and hear anything."

 

That's where I'm getting confused: there's nothing stopping anyone plugging their wired/passive IEMs directly into the monitor outs on the A&H CQ desk. Its built in preamps provide plenty of headroom, and I'm assuming the A&H CQ desk is not unusual in having preamps?

 

I have no idea about your mixer, but when i googled it i got this. 

 

You should not plug headphones directly into the aux outs of an Allen & Heath CQ18T mixer. The aux outputs are line-level, balanced mono TRS jacks, designed to send signals to other audio gear (like an in-ear monitor transmitter or a dedicated headphone amplifier). They do not provide sufficient power or the correct impedance for headphones, and doing so can result in low volume, poor sound quality, and potentially damage the output stage of the mixer or your headphones

 

This just explains what i was trying to say. If you have found otherwise then fair enough. 

[Linus27]

14 hours ago, Phil Starr said:

I don't have one of these but there seems to be a simpler way which gives you better control. The Rolls has a built in DI splitter for the instrument. 

 

Plug your bass into the jack 'inst in' Your mic into 'mic in'

Use the 'mic out' to send to the PA 

Use 'left out' to send your bass to the PA, 'right out' to send to your bass amp if you have one.

Ask foir a FOH mix without bass to feed into your 'line input'

 

You now have complete control of the mix in your in-ears and the PA is getting a clean feed of your bass and mic. The feed from the bass is isolated through a transformer and there are ground lifts on both feeds to the PA should you need to kill any hum

 

p

 

Cheers Phil, that's super helpful 👍

[SimonK]

2 hours ago, dave_bass5 said:

I have no idea about your mixer, but when i googled it i got this. 

 

You should not plug headphones directly into the aux outs of an Allen & Heath CQ18T mixer. The aux outputs are line-level, balanced mono TRS jacks, designed to send signals to other audio gear (like an in-ear monitor transmitter or a dedicated headphone amplifier). They do not provide sufficient power or the correct impedance for headphones, and doing so can result in low volume, poor sound quality, and potentially damage the output stage of the mixer or your headphones

 

This just explains what i was trying to say. If you have found otherwise then fair enough. 

 

Might be worth noting that "standard" IEM systems are designed to plug into aux outs from desks in the same way as you would a powered wedge, hence having a xlr input, but I've noticed some of the cheaper IEMS are essentially just wireless headphones, given away by having a stereo jack input. I suspect these latter units might need a headphone amp to work.

[Woodinblack]

37 minutes ago, SimonK said:

but I've noticed some of the cheaper IEMS are essentially just wireless headphones, given away by having a stereo jack input. I suspect these latter units might need a headphone amp to work.

 

The MS-20 has a 3.5mm stereo jack and it is about as cheap as you can get, but it is fine connected to the aux out.

[dave_bass5]

1 hour ago, SimonK said:

 

Might be worth noting that "standard" IEM systems are designed to plug into aux outs from desks in the same way as you would a powered wedge, hence having a xlr input, but I've noticed some of the cheaper IEMS are essentially just wireless headphones, given away by having a stereo jack input. I suspect these latter units might need a headphone amp to work.

To be clear, when ive used the term IEM above, im talking about the earpiece's only, not a system that would amplify the signal. Genuinely cant see how a line level signal can power the earpiece's or headphones, but if people say they can i cant argue with that. 

Edited 4 hours ago by dave_bass5

[Muppet]

2 hours ago, SimonK said:

 

Might be worth noting that "standard" IEM systems are designed to plug into aux outs from desks in the same way as you would a powered wedge, hence having a xlr input, but I've noticed some of the cheaper IEMS are essentially just wireless headphones, given away by having a stereo jack input. I suspect these latter units might need a headphone amp to work.

I’ve got one of these sorts as a back up system. I connect the transmitter to the desk using a 3.5mm to XLR cable and it works just fine. The same way as you’d connect a more expensive system.