fretmeister Posted February 14, 2015 Share Posted February 14, 2015 Has anyone ripped the guts out of a ray5 and replaced the pickup & preamp with something else? Like a set of Nordy Big Singles and modern higher output preamp? To make a JazzRay? I love the playability of my Ray5, but tonally my Sandberg TM5 leaves it for dead. What have you lot done? (Obviously I'll put this on the EBMM forum as well at some point! ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stingrayPete1977 Posted February 14, 2015 Share Posted February 14, 2015 Is it ceramic or Alnico, tbh honest I tried a TM5 in PMT when I was Jazz shopping and found it like a Stingray with a flat battery and a weak pickup Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fretmeister Posted February 14, 2015 Author Share Posted February 14, 2015 Interesting! My TM5 output is massive compared to my ray. No idea which pickup is the ray, it's a 2005 if that helps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stingrayPete1977 Posted February 14, 2015 Share Posted February 14, 2015 (edited) That will be Ceramic then, I like my Ceramic one but some people prefer the Alnico for that classic Ray tone, interestingly some people find the output too hot to handle on the ceramic basses and just too in your face, I wonder if there is an issue with it? Also and this is a biggy, the ceramic one on its own can sound a bit odd but in a live band mix it is crazy good, series with the mids boosted and basically you are going to be heard in any band mix! I love my 2 eq Alnico equipped Classic5 but it can be more difficult to get to cut through a pair of Les Pauls at full belt Edited February 14, 2015 by stingrayPete1977 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fretmeister Posted February 14, 2015 Author Share Posted February 14, 2015 Nordstrand will make me a 17.5mm spacing Big Single. One of them at the neck and a Nordy Bigman at the bridge.... I can hear the "other forum" exploding already! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stingrayPete1977 Posted February 14, 2015 Share Posted February 14, 2015 Ha, I dont go on there, my 2007 fretless has a 2004 fretted neck and my classic5 has a john east preamp, my 2010 is stock other than straplocks whichvthey probably dislike too, lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pinball Posted February 14, 2015 Share Posted February 14, 2015 (edited) [quote name='fretmeister' timestamp='1423947360' post='2690829'] Has anyone ripped the guts out of a ray5 and replaced the pickup & preamp with something else? Like a set of Nordy Big Singles and modern higher output preamp? To make a JazzRay? I love the playability of my Ray5, but tonally my Sandberg TM5 leaves it for dead. What have you lot done? (Obviously I'll put this on the EBMM forum as well at some point! ) [/quote] That's interesting as its almost the opposite to what I found. I loved playing my Sandberg TM4 at home but could never find a sound that I was 100% happy with in the band. I spent weeks fiddling with switches and nobs on the guitar and amp getting nowhere. I then traded for a Panther and then that for an Umbo before giving up on Jazzes totally. On the other hand my Stingray continues to the spot live but has less options than a TM4/5. I now consider it as "my tone" and wouldn't change it. The SR5 also works better than anything else I have had with my pedals. I guess it all depends on your own preference and music style. I can't really advise on other options as I have't tried any. [quote name='stingrayPete1977' timestamp='1423949379' post='2690862'] That will be Ceramic then, I like my Ceramic one but some people prefer the Alnico for that classic Ray tone, interestingly some people find the output too hot to handle on the ceramic basses and just too in your face, I wonder if there is an issue with it? Also and this is a biggy, the ceramic one on its own can sound a bit odd but in a live band mix it is crazy good, series with the mids boosted and basically you are going to be heard in any band mix! I love my 2 eq Alnico equipped Classic5 but it can be more difficult to get to cut through a pair of Les Pauls at full belt [/quote] Mines ceramic, I use it with the EQ flat most of the time and sometimes give the bass a tiny boost if playing finger style. The actual volume output is low compared to other basses I've had but it cuts through brilliantly. Edited February 16, 2015 by Pinball Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
obbm Posted February 14, 2015 Share Posted February 14, 2015 [quote name='fretmeister' timestamp='1423947360' post='2690829'] Has anyone ripped the guts out of a ray5 and replaced the pickup & preamp with something else? Like a set of Nordy Big Singles and modern higher output preamp? To make a JazzRay? I love the playability of my Ray5, but tonally my Sandberg TM5 leaves it for dead. What have you lot done? (Obviously I'll put this on the EBMM forum as well at some point! ) [/quote] Quite the opposite. When I bought my SR5 it had a Bartolini pre-amp and a Aguilar OBP-3 pre-amp. I didn't like the tone and have restored it to a stock EB pre-amp but a Nordstrand MM5.3 pick-up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stingrayPete1977 Posted February 15, 2015 Share Posted February 15, 2015 Funny old world eh? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drTStingray Posted February 15, 2015 Share Posted February 15, 2015 [quote name='fretmeister' timestamp='1423951436' post='2690898'] I can hear the "other forum" exploding already! [/quote] You mean Talkbass?! I can't see the EBMM forum having much of a view although no doubt some may think you have taken leave of your senses and should sell the Ray and buy a bass you actually like?? It's your bass, your choice though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stingrayPete1977 Posted February 15, 2015 Share Posted February 15, 2015 It's easier to adapt the 10% of a bass you like 90% of than find one that is 100% what you want off the hook though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drTStingray Posted February 15, 2015 Share Posted February 15, 2015 (edited) [quote name='stingrayPete1977' timestamp='1424032933' post='2691854'] It's easier to adapt the 10% of a bass you like 90% of than find one that is 100% what you want off the hook though. [/quote] I guess so - I think I've ended up adapting the 10% to various basses myself rather than modding them. Edited February 15, 2015 by drTStingray Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fretmeister Posted February 16, 2015 Author Share Posted February 16, 2015 [quote name='drTStingray' timestamp='1424032299' post='2691842'] You mean Talkbass?! I can't see the EBMM forum having much of a view although no doubt some may think you have taken leave of your senses and should sell the Ray and buy a bass you actually like?? It's your bass, your choice though. [/quote] You on the staff at EBMM? I do 'actually' like it. I love the easy playability and I've managed to get a nice lightweight one as well. Considering the positives of the instrument I reckon the "missing" 10% is far more likely to be the missing "15%" or more on another bass, even if it was another Ray - assuming I could find another one as light. All production line basses are a compromise based on the lowest common denominator most likely to generate a sale at a particular price point. However the relatively recent introduction of the HS and HH model 'Ray shows that EBMM realised there was a market for something different - it's just that they don't want the punters doing it themselves for some reason. I'd happily try installing a EBMM Single coil at the neck position on my Ray, but EBMM won't sell the parts. Even Ricky will sell parts! EBMM seem to be the only maker that insist that their stock instruments are absolutely perfect. They are the Apple of the guitar world (I like Apple too - but improvements or options are also obvious there) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcnach Posted February 21, 2015 Share Posted February 21, 2015 [quote name='stingrayPete1977' timestamp='1424032933' post='2691854'] It's easier to adapt the 10% of a bass you like 90% of than find one that is 100% what you want off the hook though. [/quote] well said Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rodney72a Posted February 22, 2015 Share Posted February 22, 2015 (edited) I have yet to see an EBMM bass that has benefited from 'upgrading' its pickup or preamp. But if spending money on devaluing your instrument is your thing, go for it... (At least keep the original parts.) Edited February 22, 2015 by rodney72a Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stingrayPete1977 Posted February 22, 2015 Share Posted February 22, 2015 None of mine are for sale, it saves me having to keep writing out price tags to hang on them, then having to redo them to suit other peoples opinions I would rather own a bass worth £50 when I am dead because I have used it for endless gigs and modded the hell out of it than leave it alone and it live in it's case for thirtyyears or more just so my widow can say "ooh look its a Dargie Delight with the hang tags in place, I am so glad glad he did not 'upgrade' it" Buying modern mass produced instruments is not the way to look after your money, my Classic 5 has an East preamp but I have the stock one and the soldering skills of a ninja but it has a long way to go to even get back to what it cost new never mind make me a few quid for my retirement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcnach Posted February 22, 2015 Share Posted February 22, 2015 [quote name='rodney72a' timestamp='1424564264' post='2697899'] I have yet to see an EBMM bass that has benefited from 'upgrading' its pickup or preamp. But if spending money on devaluing your instrument is your thing, go for it... (At least keep the original parts.) [/quote] , , and then some more! define devaluing... I have a 2002 Stingray, 2EQ, beautiful natural/maple. It's been my main bass for a few years, except the last period since October 2014 that i've been playing the Precision on my avatar mostly. But the Stingray is *my* bass, the one I'd save from a fire, the one that if I'm not sure what I'm going to need... I'll pick before any other bass. But I guess I've devalued it, OMG. I felt the 2EQ wasn't doing it for me. It works better on my USA SUB that has the pickup wired in series (stock! it came like that!) which has a more pronounced midrange. On the Stingray, I found the treble getting too shrill too quickly. I put a 3-band John East on it, with the midsweep module. Awesome. Even in 2EQ mode if feels the low end is a bit tighter and the treble has a more sensible operation, and then the mid module is just perfect, so versatile and easy to use. I can't give a rat's ass whether someone thinks I devalued a precious EBMM instrument by swapping the preamp, because the truth (and yes, I hold the truth, since it's my bass and it has to satisfy me ) is it sounds better and turned a bass that fels fantastic but didn't have the sound to match into a wonderful wonderful thing. If you're not horrified enough... I also recently had the neck lacquered. Yup. Because I like the feel of a lacquered neck, and it's a lot easier to maintain looking nice. "Oh, the horror!" Well, you're entitled to your opinion, but I'm entitled to think it's rubbish. Seriously, what do people care whether others modify their instruments to their taste? Especially when we talk of certain brands, like EBMM... it's just ridiculous the level of offense some seem to get at seeing others enjoying their instruments in a non-stock form. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbonepete Posted February 22, 2015 Share Posted February 22, 2015 [quote name='rodney72a' timestamp='1424564264' post='2697899'] I have yet to see an EBMM bass that has benefited from 'upgrading' its pickup or preamp. But if spending money on devaluing your instrument is your thing, go for it... (At least keep the original parts.) [/quote] Hmm, I see nothing factual about this post. I cant see the difference in a lot of things, but that just highlights my inability to see the difference, NOT that there may/may not be a difference! If I chose to do something to one of my basses that I paid for with money that I earned Then that's for me to decide, and also it's my choice whether or not to keep the original parts. To get back on thread though, Jimmi Clarke of this parish, (and youtube) has extensively changed the "innards" on his Stingray, and has a lengthy youtube video explaining whats been done, and sound samples to illustrate the changes made. By the shear amount of aftermarket MM pups from lots of different manufacturers serves to illustrate that many people can see the benefit of "upgrading" the stingray bass. Fretmeister, Jimmi's video is well worth a watch, he's a great guy and a top player too, Ooops, I nearly forgot the IMHO bit, as it's only my opinion, and may not contain any facts Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xilddx Posted February 22, 2015 Share Posted February 22, 2015 [quote name='tbonepete' timestamp='1424610164' post='2698206'] Hmm, I see nothing factual about this post. I cant see the difference in a lot of things, but that just highlights my inability to see the difference, NOT that there may/may not be a difference! If I chose to do something to one of my basses that I paid for with money that I earned Then that's for me to decide, and also it's my choice whether or not to keep the original parts. To get back on thread though, Jimmi Clarke of this parish, (and youtube) has extensively changed the "innards" on his Stingray, and has a lengthy youtube video explaining whats been done, and sound samples to illustrate the changes made. By the shear amount of aftermarket MM pups from lots of different manufacturers serves to illustrate that many people can see the benefit of "upgrading" the stingray bass. Fretmeister, Jimmi's video is well worth a watch, he's a great guy and a top player too, Ooops, I nearly forgot the IMHO bit, as it's only my opinion, and may not contain any facts [/quote] This one? Love the sound of both pickups on. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tS-tpgPFUpI Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pinball Posted February 22, 2015 Share Posted February 22, 2015 [quote name='xilddx' timestamp='1424611308' post='2698220'] This one? Love the sound of both pickups on. [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tS-tpgPFUpI[/media] [/quote] Great sounds, nothing I would want to swap the sound of my SR5 for though. I must be pretty boring as I just use two tone variations-one with everything flat and the other finger style with a touch more on the bass That would drive me crazy going though the various options < boring fart Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drTStingray Posted February 22, 2015 Share Posted February 22, 2015 [quote name='fretmeister' timestamp='1424080446' post='2692216'] You on the staff at EBMM? I do 'actually' like it. I love the easy playability and I've managed to get a nice lightweight one as well. Considering the positives of the instrument I reckon the "missing" 10% is far more likely to be the missing "15%" or more on another bass, even if it was another Ray - assuming I could find another one as light. All production line basses are a compromise based on the lowest common denominator most likely to generate a sale at a particular price point. However the relatively recent introduction of the HS and HH model 'Ray shows that EBMM realised there was a market for something different - it's just that they don't want the punters doing it themselves for some reason. I'd happily try installing a EBMM Single coil at the neck position on my Ray, but EBMM won't sell the parts. Even Ricky will sell parts! EBMM seem to be the only maker that insist that their stock instruments are absolutely perfect. They are the Apple of the guitar world (I like Apple too - but improvements or options are also obvious there) [/quote] No I'm not - just a fan particularly of Stingray 5s. My 2003 SR5 cost £995 brand new - although not worth more than its new cost, it would probably fetch not too much shy of that value. I'm with Rodney 72a - I have a number of Musicman basses - the two pick up variants add a number of sonic dimensions but I tend to use two or three stock settings with them. However recorded there are lots of possibilities - eg try soloing the piezo pick up if fitted, on a Musicman. I did precisely this for a sub E hip hop line on my Bongo - now that is very different!!!! The reason there are lots of aftermarket options for the Stingray (though not as much as for Jazzes and Precisions) is the market for upgrading copies - indeed the East can be had with a control plate but it doesn't fit an MM - it fits an OLP. There's nothing wrong with changing the electronics on an SR etc but you will lower the resale value (and John East v stock 2 band apart) probably not make much difference. I use my 2 bands regularly and apart from upping the low mid on the Mark Bass a little, have all the control I want in my fingers, where I pluck the strings, how hard I pluck the strings and the onboard EQ. I would certainly not modify them - I would buy a different bass if I wanted something different. There are a reasonable number of HS and HH SR5s on the resale market - you're better off buying a used factory version IMHO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fretmeister Posted February 22, 2015 Author Share Posted February 22, 2015 [quote name='rodney72a' timestamp='1424564264' post='2697899'] I have yet to see an EBMM bass that has benefited from 'upgrading' its pickup or preamp. (Snip) [/quote] I can't tell. Are you saying it's the finest instrument in the universe incapable of being bettered? Or are you saying that you can't polish a turd? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcnach Posted February 22, 2015 Share Posted February 22, 2015 [quote name='fretmeister' timestamp='1424628679' post='2698491'] I can't tell. Are you saying it's the finest instrument in the universe incapable of being bettered? Or are you saying that you can't polish a turd? [/quote] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drTStingray Posted February 22, 2015 Share Posted February 22, 2015 [quote name='fretmeister' timestamp='1424628679' post='2698491'] I can't tell. Are you saying it's the finest instrument in the universe incapable of being bettered? Or are you saying that you can't polish a turd? [/quote] Depends on your viewpoint. They did a great design job with that bass and the standard electronics do the job extremely well. It most certainly ain't a turd!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xilddx Posted February 22, 2015 Share Posted February 22, 2015 [quote name='fretmeister' timestamp='1424628679' post='2698491'] I can't tell. Are you saying it's the finest instrument in the universe incapable of being bettered? Or are you saying that you can't polish a turd? [/quote] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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