Kinder Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 Hi all. I've got to preface this by saying I've never tried anything like this before and I'm completely incompetent at most things DIY / technical! In spite of this I've got a 97 Mexican Jazz that's battered and bruised and could do with tarting up. I quite fancy stripping it and leaving it natural and putting a black scratchplate on. I've got loads of questions so advice from anyone who's done this before would be really appreciated. Main questions / concerns are: - What's best to use to get the black paint off? I guess using a few different grains of sandpaper but is there any sort of gentle paint stripper to use first? - What would you use to finish it? - I'm planning on leaving the neck and headstock well alone. Is that wise? Thanks guys. I'm probably stupid to attempt this but I fancy a challenge and it will really annoy my wife. Any help would be great. Andy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wateroftyne Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 (edited) I can't really help you with your questions - I'm sure someone will be along soon who can - but chances are the bare wood is going to be pretty dull, maybe even ugly. Better have a plan 'b' - i.e. a solid finish colour preference, just in case... Edited February 3, 2011 by wateroftyne Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icastle Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 [quote name='Kinder' post='1113710' date='Feb 3 2011, 12:07 PM']- What's best to use to get the black paint off? I guess using a few different grains of sandpaper but is there any sort of gentle paint stripper to use first?[/quote] I don't think there's such a thing as gentle paint stripper.. Sandpaper might take a little while but it will give you the opportunity to smooth out any little dinks in the woodwork, something that paint stripper certainly can't do. [quote name='Kinder' post='1113710' date='Feb 3 2011, 12:07 PM']- I'm planning on leaving the neck and headstock well alone. Is that wise?[/quote] Absolutely. Lose the Fender logo off the top of the headstock and your bass becomes just another 'no name copy'. The neck is probably already natural finished anyway so I'd say that sanding it down is just creating work for no return! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerry_B Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 In my experience varnish stripper does a better job than paint stripper. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LawrenceH Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 I had this issue last year when stripping a Mexi jazz. If it is a Mexican bass then the finish will be polyester (not polyurethane) over a thin clear sealer coat. This is thick, hard and chemically very resistant. Sanding through would take ages and probably require such a coarse grain that you risk going through and digging into the wood. Too much like hard work for me! The way I did it, and would definitely do again, was to use my wife's hairdryer on its hottest setting as a gentle heat gun. This softened the outer poly layer and seemed to start to melt the inner sealer layer. Once I'd worked into the paint with a chisel (I'd suggest you could just start chipping away around a screw hole) I was then able to use one of those paint scraper things a bit like a spatula and lift off the paint in patches as I heated it. Managed to avoid damaging the wood at all except where I tried chiseling initially before discovering this method. The advantage of the hair dryer was that it didn't get hot enough to scorch the wood unlike a proper heat gun would, but still softened the poly sufficiently to lift it off. Stripping this way took a couple of hours probably, left a clean finish on the bass and avoided nasty fumes I put it into a build diary here: [url="http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=110990"]http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=110990[/url] Hope that's helpful! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Vader Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 I take off the thick poly finishes in 2 stages, first using nitromors specialist (the orange one) and a wallpaper scraper to take off the clear and most of the colour coat. Then go at it with p60 sandpaper to scrape out the rest of it, and get through that poly sealer. Do it over a few days and you won't go insane with the pain of it. And then use ever increasing grades of sandpaper to get a nice smooth finish to the wood. Just done an epiphone SG like this, and I'm currently danish oiling it, working nicely. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
borisbrain Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 Hi Kinder, I recently stripped down a Mexican Jazz to put a leather skin on it: [url="http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=116468"]http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=116468[/url] This was a b*tch of a job to be honest, on just about every level. Sanding down the original was a horrific job, and took an eternity to just get past the varnish, let alone the paint. I can't begin to describe the feeling of misery that I had when I was halfway through the process, thinking that I'd completely bollocksed up a perfectly good guitar. However, now it's done, I'm pretty chuffed that I have something unique, although I still have to squint to overlook some of the imperfections... So, first piece of advice is: be absolutely sure you want to do it. Your guitar will be in pieces for a fair old while with exposed wiring, removed bridge, etc. Maybe a roadworn appearance isn't such a bad thing. Or maybe you could pay someone to do it... Second: consider chemicals before sanding. This is something I wish I had done, although how to practically achieve this would be a challenge. Or Lawrence H's idea sounds good. None of this has probably been very helpful to you, but I thought you'd like to hear of my experience. Whichever way you go, I hope you get the results you want. Stay groovy, BB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTUK Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 I agree that the bare wood is likely to be quite a let-down when you get to see it.... A friend of mine did this to his 62 P..I know, I know... and it looked terrible. I can't see them using better woods now...esp if they have earmarked it for a paint job at the factory But since you have this in your head as something you fancy doing, then good luck. You may well end up painting it again...and at least your sanding to bare will save you some money if you get someone else to paint it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kinder Posted February 3, 2011 Author Share Posted February 3, 2011 Thanks guys, that's great. Lawrence - your build diary is a great read and what an amazing result! It looks superb. I'm really not sure if I've got the patience to put the effort in that you did with all the primer and paint coats though, it sounds like a real labour of love. Do you think it would look crap if I stripped it down and then applied a finish to the natural wood? I actually quite like the look of yours when it was stripped-down in your first diary post. Dave - how many coats of oil are you giving yours? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Fudge Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 Wow, I've just had a look at that "leather" bass in this thread. I'm now wondering what could be done with artex? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Truckstop Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 I did this not even a month ago and the paintwork is ridiculously hard to breech. Nitro Mors had absolutely NO effect. You'd need to chisel the poly off best you can, and then take a sander to the wood to get the inevitable marks out! The wood on my Jazz is actually quite attractive and I'm glad I bothered. Truckstop Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kinder Posted February 3, 2011 Author Share Posted February 3, 2011 [quote name='borisbrain' post='1114018' date='Feb 3 2011, 03:46 PM']Hi Kinder, I recently stripped down a Mexican Jazz to put a leather skin on it: [url="http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=116468"]http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=116468[/url] This was a b*tch of a job to be honest, on just about every level. Sanding down the original was a horrific job, and took an eternity to just get past the varnish, let alone the paint. I can't begin to describe the feeling of misery that I had when I was halfway through the process, thinking that I'd completely bollocksed up a perfectly good guitar. However, now it's done, I'm pretty chuffed that I have something unique, although I still have to squint to overlook some of the imperfections... So, first piece of advice is: be absolutely sure you want to do it. Your guitar will be in pieces for a fair old while with exposed wiring, removed bridge, etc. Maybe a roadworn appearance isn't such a bad thing. Or maybe you could pay someone to do it... Second: consider chemicals before sanding. This is something I wish I had done, although how to practically achieve this would be a challenge. Or Lawrence H's idea sounds good. None of this has probably been very helpful to you, but I thought you'd like to hear of my experience. Whichever way you go, I hope you get the results you want. Stay groovy, BB[/quote] Jeez BB, I knew lefties were a bit weird but a leather bass is plain kinky! Would you go through the hassle again? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kinder Posted February 3, 2011 Author Share Posted February 3, 2011 [quote name='Truckstop' post='1114027' date='Feb 3 2011, 03:51 PM']I did this not even a month ago and the paintwork is ridiculously hard to breech. Nitro Mors had absolutely NO effect. You'd need to chisel the poly off best you can, and then take a sander to the wood to get the inevitable marks out! The wood on my Jazz is actually quite attractive and I'm glad I bothered. Truckstop[/quote] Truckstop - have you got any photos mate? What did you finish it with? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
borisbrain Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 [quote name='Kinder' post='1114036' date='Feb 3 2011, 03:56 PM']Jeez BB, I knew lefties were a bit weird but a leather bass is plain kinky! Would you go through the hassle again?[/quote] Yup, we're weird. TBH, I probably *would* do it again, but be better prepared and do a better job. It's not the sort of thing you generally get much chance to practice... Mr Fudge - if only I'd thought of that first!! Stay groovy all, BB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Vader Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 [quote name='Kinder' post='1114023' date='Feb 3 2011, 03:50 PM']Thanks guys, that's great. Lawrence - your build diary is a great read and what an amazing result! It looks superb. I'm really not sure if I've got the patience to put the effort in that you did with all the primer and paint coats though, it sounds like a real labour of love. Do you think it would look crap if I stripped it down and then applied a finish to the natural wood? I actually quite like the look of yours when it was stripped-down in your first diary post. Dave - how many coats of oil are you giving yours?[/quote] I did this to my P-bass (the one in my avatar) a couple of years ago as well. Took 3 coats, worked fine, comes off again fairly quick if you're sweaty, so needs to be topped up. There's some good advice on decent oil finishes on re-ranch. Oh, and Truckstop, if you use the right nitromors it works, has to be the specialist one, designed for poly finishes it is. Bloody marvellous stuff. check this thread for some of what I went through Kinder... [url="http://www.talkbass.com/forum/showthread.php?t=558473&highlight=sunn+mustang"]http://www.talkbass.com/forum/showthread.p...ht=sunn+mustang[/url] (yes I know it's THAT forum, I've changed...) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LawrenceH Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 [quote name='Kinder' post='1114023' date='Feb 3 2011, 03:50 PM']Thanks guys, that's great. Lawrence - your build diary is a great read and what an amazing result! It looks superb. I'm really not sure if I've got the patience to put the effort in that you did with all the primer and paint coats though, it sounds like a real labour of love. Do you think it would look crap if I stripped it down and then applied a finish to the natural wood? I actually quite like the look of yours when it was stripped-down in your first diary post.[/quote] Ta! I'd say the wood could look alright natural with a suitable shiny finish to maintain that wet look - mine certainly looked ok to me with the sealer coat. I think I had to do so many coats because I had a poor spraying technique partly due to the crappy nozzles on the Halfords cans, and also despite it being alder I really should have used a grain filler to get the finish truly flat before spraying. I'd definitely recommend that! Obviously depends what colours you're wanting but the opaque light blue really benefited from the primer first - it dries much quicker than the colour, and you'd need a ton to get it opaque. Also a word of warning, if you use the Halfords clear and spray too thick it takes AGES to fully dry and shrink down - mine is still a bit soft! For a natural finish I'd think about one of those brush-on varnishes, you can probably get them on thicker and it'll be easier to flat - in any case that matters less when you've got a texture like grain underneath it, it's the opaque finishes that show every imperfection. If I was doing a rattlecan job again then I'd probably go for the nitro cans. Using lots of filler, getting it all REALLY flat and sealed before priming will mean you need less coats and less work in the long run. Just pick a colour that doesn't show dust/pubes(!) unless you've got a dedicated workshop... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LawrenceH Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 Oh and definitely, several days of horrible nitromors fumes versus 2 hours with the hairdryer and scraper...not knocking anyone choosing to do the former but I'd say my way is definitely worth a try first. It's also very satisfying every time another great big chunky of shiny black peels off! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cat Burrito Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 I've stripped 2 Black Fenders; Now contradicting what others have said, Nitro Mors was the only thing I used. No chisel, no heat gun and no power tools. This is the thread to the last one I did and it contains lots of progress pictures [url="http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=111302&hl=stripping+body"]http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=...=stripping+body[/url] I'm happy to talk via PMs to anyone who wants any help or guidance but hope the thread offers some guidance. Most people think mine were professionally done which is a huge compliment as I'd not tried this a year ago. I loved the whole process and really bonded with the instruments doing it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LawrenceH Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 [quote name='BurritoBass' post='1114157' date='Feb 3 2011, 05:14 PM']Now contradicting what others have said, Nitro Mors was the only thing I used. No chisel, no heat gun and no power tools. This is the thread to the last one I did and it contains lots of progress pictures[/quote] The natural finish with cream dimarzios plus tort looks damn sweet! I'd bet that they were polyurethane finishes as opposed to polyester like on many (all?) of the MIMs though. My understanding is that the latter is more inert. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cat Burrito Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 [quote name='LawrenceH' post='1114165' date='Feb 3 2011, 05:19 PM']The natural finish with cream dimarzios plus tort looks damn sweet! I'd bet that they were polyurethane finishes as opposed to polyester like on many (all?) of the MIMs though. My understanding is that the latter is more inert.[/quote] They were a battle with a lot of patience. Both are 70s finishes that lasted all of about 5 seconds. The other danger with the MIMs and Squiers are that you never know what you are going to get. The Sunburst and black finishes are sometimes used to hide a multitude of sins. That 1979 has a better looking back than front on the wood grain but I was lucky with both Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kinder Posted February 3, 2011 Author Share Posted February 3, 2011 [quote name='BurritoBass' post='1114157' date='Feb 3 2011, 05:14 PM']I've stripped 2 Black Fenders; Now contradicting what others have said, Nitro Mors was the only thing I used. No chisel, no heat gun and no power tools. This is the thread to the last one I did and it contains lots of progress pictures [url="http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=111302&hl=stripping+body"]http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=...=stripping+body[/url] I'm happy to talk via PMs to anyone who wants any help or guidance but hope the thread offers some guidance. Most people think mine were professionally done which is a huge compliment as I'd not tried this a year ago. I loved the whole process and really bonded with the instruments doing it [/quote] Wow. They look amazing mate and it's convinced me to go for the stripped look rather than try painting it. As you say though, I won't know what the wood's like until I take the plunge but I really hope it'll be ok. Thanks to all of you, really useful advice and some great looking basses. If mine looks half as good as any of yours I'll be very happy. Andy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTUK Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 Gotta agree...they work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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