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[quote name='thunderbird13' timestamp='1317717594' post='1393530'] yeah I've met a fair few people like this who musically are average but have somehow convinced themselves that they are going to make it and have left school gotten a crappy job while they play music at night. Fast forward 30 years and they're still doing the same thing. [/quote] Just do what makes you happy. There are thousands of rubbish original bands full of misguided kids but so what. Age shouldn't be a barrier and the profile of the music industry is very varied now - not like the top twenty culture that existed twenty years ago. Probably more chance of making it as an oldie now that ever.

Floggin the proverbial dead horse. In truth you probably know that anyway. Get out and find some more like minded souls..

I spent 3 years out there in the early 90s. No doubt its different now. No drugs. Theres plenty there but do not be tempted. I don't know you but if you are into a bit of spliff DO NOT do it out there. Ex pat clubs are fine in small doses but a little incestuous and can be a bit bitchy. Get a fishing rod. If you aint into fishing its a great place to start. I am guessing you'll have plenty of time in the day. Me and a drummer used to get a boat out to a little island and fish off of it. We pulled out some amazing specimens from the Arabian sea! Freaky. Learn a little bit of Arabic. Learn to haggle. Above all have a brilliant time.

I'd put it together and sell it as its less hassle. One sale and gone. If you sell the bits you'll have to deal with loads of comms questions and it might take time.

Also thought i should add that i like playing quietly

[quote name='dave_bass5' timestamp='1317386010' post='1390172'] My quote was based you your "Maybe thats where I differ from "most members here" comment. Im not questioning you have integrity, i just dont know why you think others dont have it. Now that you have elaborated on the walk out then i can understand that its not as unprofessional as it sounded, and was probably the right thing to do as long as the Landlord was in agreement. I dont think you had mentioned the landlord's reaction or opinion before (its along thread so sorry if you have). I think this thread has gone on far to long, ive lost track of whats been said. Im glad you cleared up the walking out issue though. [/quote] OK, last time and then i am off of this thread. It was the Monkcyman who said "I was merely making the point that for most members here, playing covers doesn`t involve any integrity or artistic feelings" Personally i would never aim to talk for others in such general terms but it was that comment which led to the response "Maybe thats where I differ from "most members here" comment. If the comment is true (and i don't believe it is) then i wouldn't want to be branded as someone who puts in minimal effort just becasue we are playing lowly covers. We always want to do the best for our clients. On this very rare occasion the best thing to do was pack up. Enough said.

I keep getting misquoted. It was someone else who said "I was merely making the point that for most members here, playing covers doesn`t involve any integrity". For my part i will always try and get the gig done. The one time it didn't happen was when we were told to finish the gig without the drummer. We didn't want to play a funk/soul set without drums cos we knew it would sound rubbish. Why is that so difficult to understand? So we talked about it and then told the manager that we weren't able to play our set without drums and suggested that we pack up and go. He, i think, was quite relieved as he was worried about loosing his licence due to complaints from neighbours to the council. There were no histrionics or handbags at dawn. It was all handled, dare i say, with integrity. No-one died. We still work in another of their establishments so they obviously weren't too upset.

[quote name='Monckyman' timestamp='1317336206' post='1389756'] Hmm, I can`t see where I suggested anyone strive to be crap. I was merely making the point that for most members here, playing covers doesn`t involve any integrity or artistic feelings. Everyone likes to believe they can do a good job of work and deserve the fee,if the person responsible for paying you stipulates a certain volume then in my opinion you have to work with that. It`s easy to say "tell them to stuff it " or " you must be desperate for gigs" if you have a good income from your "day" job. I also can`t see how saying how many gigs you get and how loud they are and you have standards etc helps clear anything up here. The question was simple, When the guy with the cash says please turn down do you do it or do you look for other work. No brainer. [/quote] For me there is integrity involved. Yes, even in a covers band. Maybe thats where I differ from "most members here" and yourself. I am maybe old fashioned but firmly believe that if we are going to do something we should do it as well as possible.

Lucky enough to see them at the Komedia club in Brighton last month. Great gig. One of my favs... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z6JiTwj-znw

We are lucky in so much as we have plenty of gigs into next year and lots in the pipeline. I am also a dep for a couple of other bands so am pretty busy playing-wise. That said, this is my main band of whom i am a proud long serving member (ooh err). There comes a point when your own integrity is more important than being told what and how to play by a wine bar manager. Its not that we didn't try to accomodate their wishes it was just that for us playing without drums in a funk soul band is not an option. They can always get a disco or duo etc.

Some of you must be desperate for gigs

Its just being practical. If they don't want the drummer to use his bass drum then they are effectively telling us what brushes we should use (excuse me if the analogy is getting complicated). At this point the talking from the audience is starting to drown out the singer. The customer stops being the customer when you say you don't want payment and leave so they haven't lost out. We lost out on an evening when we could have been doing something else. Its got nothing to do with egos or things getting thrown out of prams. Its more to do with five people agreeing that someone is being unreasonable and making a decision.

[quote name='ironside1966' timestamp='1317210281' post='1388054'] The way is look at is this, the landlord pays you to do a job just like you would pay someone to paint your house. you wouldn't expect them do what they want. you pay them to paint it how you want it. [/quote] Then he says i don't like you using those brushes and that your ladders are too shiny. I think that some of you do see the world in very black and white tones. Judge each case on its own merits.

[quote name='dave_bass5' timestamp='1317205901' post='1387965'] No because i go in the drummers car ;-) Seriously, we do have drummer problems, as in he is too loud sometimes, but if it came to it then yes, we would just get him to use brushes or just keep the bass drum going. We done two gigs (in 7 years) that this has happened. Its not ideal of course but its just one gig. you've made the effort to get there and set up, you might as well get paid for the effort. Then again, all our gigs are contracted so we have to do them. [/quote] Fair enough. We chose not to. We could hear the punters talking over the sound of the band. We'd lost any balance between instruments that we had. It was pointless. Noone was getting anything out of the gig except stress. Why bother? Lifes too short. We went and had a nice drinky in a more reasonable place. End of.

[quote name='dave_bass5' timestamp='1317205346' post='1387944'] We've had similar with social clubs. one club how loves us will pass on our details to another, as "we will go down a storm", only to find the second club dont like us. I guess its never clear cut but we would never leave a gig half played.Maybe thats just us though. [/quote] Would you do it without the drummer?

[quote name='dave_bass5' timestamp='1317202648' post='1387867'] No offence but should you have as well? I can understand that if its not working at sound check some people might pack up and go home (to be honest i think thats not a nice thing to do but thats just me) but its also partly the band's responsibility to at least survey the situation, either before taking the gig or before turning up, make a phone call or two if your worried. Walking away from a gig, one that people listening might be enjoying, just because you get the hump is a bit like throwing your toys out of the pram IMO. I [/quote] The irony is that the company has two wine bars and we still play in the other one. So the guy at this bar booked us because we did well in their other establishment and he knew exactly what we were like. Why would we suspect that there would be a problem? We don't advertise of actively seek gigs. They all come from recommendation. If someone books us we assume they do so because they might have an inkling about what they are doing. Noone is throwing their toys out of anything - sometimes in life things don't work out. We are a band and playing without a drummer wasn't an option. Get over it. Its was just a gig not life or death. I am glad that we took the decision and would do so again.

[quote name='dave_bass5' timestamp='1317199973' post='1387832'] A few people have suggested you walk if you dont like it, or dont feel you can accommodate. Do people actually do this? Would you really turn up, play say one set, get asked to turn down, realise you cant/wont and then just pack up in front of everyone and walk out without getting paid? [/quote] Yes - why not? Only happened once. In our case the only alternative was to play without drums as having done all we could to nullify the problem the bass drum was still the source of the "problem". The drummer was really under pressure through no fault of his own. He took all the anger and criticism from the management to heart. Our genre of music needs drums. The management showed a complete lack of understanding and were quite aggressive in their tone. This was a wine bar, not a music venue and they should have done their homework. We play all over town and they booked us knowing what we were - a five piece with drums. We discussed it at half-time and decided unanimously that we didn't need the gig, money or hassle and packed up and left. Whats so surprising?

[quote name='derrenleepoole' timestamp='1317138735' post='1387257'] A really interesting thread this. Surely if a venue/landlord hires a band, there is a certain level of expectation and understanding from both parties concerned about what makes good live music practice. There's only so much a band can do to play quietly if you're using acoustic drums for example. Even the quietest drummer in the world is restricted by simple physics: stick hits drums, drums make sound! I think if the request to play quiet was just too unreasonable, or more importantly 'unrealistic,' I would simply suggest politely to the landlord that the gig is cancelled, and walk away. [/quote] abso-bloody-lutely. In our case thats exactly what we did. The snare was less of a problem than the bass drum. The landlord just had no understanding of the whole thing so we figured after about 5 minutes that we were wasting our time - packed up and left. I believe that he was at fault for booking us.

Just be straight up. Say it like it is. Theres a plenty of fools in this business.

There seems to be a fundamental misunderstanding from certain posters here who think that everything is black and white.

[quote name='51m0n' timestamp='1317128148' post='1387063'] There are plenty of bands and only a few venues though..... [/quote] I guess it depends how desperate you are. There are loads of venues we wouldn't play as we wouldn't be suitable. We don't go after those gigs. By the same token someone in the "Leisure" industry should do a bit of research and ensure that the "Entertainment" they book is suitable for their establishement. As i said before. There is a limit to how far you can turn down with acoustic drums.

[quote name='icastle' timestamp='1317124453' post='1386965'] Absolutely. Even the dumbest band should be able to tell the difference between Glastonbury and The Toad and Duck as they've obviously managed to get past the stage of miming with their sisters tennis racquet... [/quote] Or even the dumbest muppet should be able to tell the difference between Motorhead and Peters and Lee.

[quote name='51m0n' timestamp='1317121778' post='1386912'] The landlord knows exactly what he wants. [/quote] Hmm, too simplistic again. Lots of pubs have been bought by large companies that put in a manager or muppet type character to do basic tasks such as open and close on time. These muppets are under pressure to "hit target" and "increase revenue streams". In general they know absolutely nothing about the entertainment industry. So when they book a band with live drums and get complaints they point the finger at the band when actually they shouldn't have booked the band (who are doing what they normally do) in the first place.

[quote name='skankdelvar' timestamp='1317120490' post='1386882'] It is simply a matter of service delivery - one plays for the audience and for the person who's paying, not for oneself. Imagine you engaged a decorator to paint your walls magnolia and they turned up with a can of purple, whining that they know best and storming off in a huff when you ask them to stick to the brief. [/quote] Too simplistic. You make the assumption that the person who's paying, the landlord, knows what they are doing.