Hazy Bass

Cheers everyone. Plenty of food for thought there. I've now got the timber cut to size & the holes cut for the driver & vent - just got to put it all together!

Thanks Phil - great article - makes a few things clearer than they were before. Interesting point about xmax measurements. I've always known different manufacturers have different approaches, but never worked out how to compare them. The Eminence specs frequently look better than Fane & Celestion - that's obviously one reason. The Beymas sound interesting - I've looked at them before, but not found anyone who's actually used them. My next project will be to replace my ageing Peavey PA cabs, so they may just fit the bill. I also picked up a copy of the Eminence designer software from eBay - it seems a bit more comprehensive than WinISD, whcih I had been using. Do you have any experience with it? cheers, Andy [quote name='Phil Starr' post='815756' date='Apr 23 2010, 08:42 AM']You've a lot of things to consider. Try reading this for a superficial skim of some of the technical issues. [url="http://www.ultimate-guitar.com/columns/gear_maintenance/choosing_speakers_to_drive_your_cabs.html"]http://www.ultimate-guitar.com/columns/gea..._your_cabs.html[/url] There are a few main issues with speakers for bass: Frequency Response: this divides into those speakers which are basically flat (some Eminence and Fane), which gives a DI into the PA type sound and those which have a midrange peak (like some Eminence and Celestion) which will give a more lively and punchy sound but more coloured and characterful. You will need to also consider the bass resonance which will define the bottom frequencies you can reach Celestions bass speakers for example go nowhere near bottom E and speakers that go really low are usually less efficient because of the heavier cones. at the top you need to go to at least 4000Hz unless you use a tweeter/horn and speakers that go to 10,000 Hz sound noticeably cleaner to my ears. Magnet size: a big magnet allows you to do two things well. It improves the control of the speaker cone or damping and it lets you have a combination of more speaker excursion and/or efficiency. It also allows you to use as smaller cab. Look at the figure for Qts to judge this, a Qts of around 0.4 is a useful figure to aim for. Above this means a smaller magnet and usually a bigger cab, below this means a bigger magnet but below 0.3 you are getting to a very tight bass which is not to everyones taste. Excursion: how far the cone will travel before the coil comes out of the magnet. Most speakers run out of puff at low frequencies and high power because the cone is asked to do too much and this varies from one speaker to the next. The critical figure is Xmax, the bigger the better. Beware, Eminence use a different way of measuring this from Fane and Celestion who are more conservative. Multiply their figures by 1.5 to roughly compare with Eminence. I've recently used Fane 15's and 10's in my designs and they are the bargain of the moment. They are of very similar quality to Eminence and look like they could be made next to each other. Eminence are the market leaders and their range is second to none. Celestion's look a little odd to me; their bass speakers have very high resonance figures (well above bottom E for their 10's) and Xmax is poor even allowing for their conservative rating system but some people swear by them. One speaker you might consider is the Beyma SM212. Their price has gone up in the UK because of the exchange rate (they are made in Spain) but I built two PA speakers using these and I use them for small gigs for bass. They are beautifully made, quite loud (98dB for 1W), quite light and sound gorgeous for bass. mine are in a 40l cab tuned to 40 hZ.[/quote]

Like quite a few other people on the forum, I'm currently building my own lightweight bass cab. I picked up an Eminence Deltalite 12" driver off eBay, which seems to fit the bill & I'm playing around with cab designs - small, lightweight, powerful & suitable for BG & EUB are the criteria (no real challenge then)! Should have it completed over the next couple of weekends. But it got me thinking about what drivers are used by some of the other manufacturers. My Schroeder Mini 12+ is fitted with a Fane Soveriegn 12-300 & sounds really sweet (the tweeter has been disconnected). And I'm thinking the Sovereign 12-500LF could be a good choice (if weight isn't an issue). I believe that EA & Hartke use their own proprietary drivers, and Aguilar & Bergantino use Eminence (but are these the same drivers that are available to us regular punters)? But what do other speaker cabs use? G-K, Eden, Ashdown, Trace, Barefaced, Mark Bass etc? In the end it comes down to personal preference, but I'd be interested in anyone else's thoughts/knowledge/experience. Cheers!

It also depends on the guitar. Different strings sound better or worse on different guitars. The only sure way to find out is to try different sets - although that can get expensive! A few years ago I experimented with several sets of flats on my Godin A4 (which I no longer have) the TI Jazz Flats had a great sound, but very low tension and felt almost too slack. Conversely, with the Rotosound Jazz Bass (Monel) flats the tension was so high they were virtually unplayable (probably could have been corrected with some adjustment of the truss)... however the TIs on my Status electro felt completely different - seemed to be much higher tension for some reason. I now use the Status with the original Status brand black nylon flats, which sound great, and incidentally are exceptionally good value at £16.95 a set (last time I bought any) - about half the price of the TIs. Try the BC 'for sales' & ebay - you might find some cheap sets to try out! FWIW on both the Godin & the Status I ended up with the strings they were originally supplied with - they just sounded best! Hope this helps.

Oliver bought my Bass Pod Live from me - very smooth deal - prompt payment & great communication. Thanks!

.... mind you, I would like to try it next to a Barefaced Compact at some point!

I haven't tried acoustic upright, but I've recently started out on the EUB route with a Clifton mini-upright, which although shorter scale than standard has a very authentic DB sound ... I'm using it with an EA iAmp micro 300 through a Schroeder mini 12+ cab (tweeter disabled) ... and the sound is superb - deep, warm, open & natural. I've read elsewhere that the Schroeder is supposed to have a big mid-hump, but I haven't noticed it with my set-up ... maybe just due to the combination of instruments & amp I'm putting through it.

Sold pete a set of strings after seeing his wanted ad. Very friendly & smooth deal - paid immediately, even paid a bit extra to cover paypal fees! Highly recommended. cheers, Andy

I haven't tried Endsleigh - sounds like an excellent deal. Will look next time. I've had Musicguard on & off for over 10 years - I think they were one of the few available at that time. Always been really good. Public liability is included & it covers in-car, out of the home - pretty well all possibilities. I only had to claim once - way back in the beginning. My harmonica player had his van stolen (not while at a gig or anything) with all his kit in it (& pretty well all his worldly possessions!) - amazing how much a bag full of harmonicas adds up to, plus amps, mics, cables etc. They paid up immediately - no questions. In fact as far as I remember their main concern was to make sure we had claimed enough! Cheers, Andy

Only just come across this section otherwise I'd have posted sooner. Done a couple of deals with Eubassix over the last few weeks ... first for an EA Micro 300 head + accessories and later for a Schroeder Mini 12 cab. Both times a complete pleasure to deal with. Quoted prices were very reasonable & always included delivery. He also offered to throw in a free speaker cable (good quality too). Both items were received within a couple of days, very well packaged & in fantastic condition (appeared never to have been used). Thoroughly recommended. Cheers!

[quote name='phil.i.stein' post='734354' date='Feb 3 2010, 06:52 PM']i take this to mean that your band was either really really good or just-plain-weird , so spill the beans, who, what and when ? oh and welcome !![/quote] We certainly thought we were really really good, but I suspect we weren't really quite as good as we thought! Not particularly weird either, but we had a kind of post-punk angry-young-man energy which probably appealed to Mr Peel, a couple of good demos & a bit of attitude ... managed to get a few support gigs with some of the second division mod bands at the time (The Purple Hearts, The Chords ...) I think we probably got about as far as we were worth (unfortunately) !

... introducing myself that is ... Been browsing the forum for a little while & finally found time to join a couple of weeks ago ... and it's only taken another couple of weeks to get round to this ... Been playing bass & guitar in various bands since I was at school in the (late) 1970s, but for the last few years it's been almost exclusively bass. Nearest claim to fame was having a couple of my songs played by John Peel on Radio 1 in the early 80s ... sadly that was the closest I came ... Now living in Horsham after moving out from London & gigging mostly around West Sussex. Current kit is: Status Electro (mark 1) Steinberger Spirit (for spare & practice & taking on holiday etc. - and also so my 10 year old son doesn't trash the Status!) EA iAmp Micro 300 (bought through this forum last week) Bass Pod XT Live (soon to be unloaded - watch the ads) Running the EA as a pre-amp through the PA at the moment (sounds awesome), but looking for a suitable cab. Also about to take the plunge into EUB territory - which is what got me started on browsing this forum. It was going to be an NS designs NXT, but I've also just been offered a Clifton Mini Upright ... twice the price but very tempting! Now I just need to make a decision ... ... will keep you posted. Cheers, Andy

[quote name='Hector' post='730709' date='Jan 31 2010, 04:02 PM']So, I had pretty much the most upsetting experience of my life last night. Was playing with a swing band for a black tie ball out of town, and the ball's organisers offered to take my bass over with their keyboard and amps. "Sure" I thought, "What could possibly go wrong?". BIG. MISTAKE. Opened my case up to take out my bass for sound check only to find that the fingerboard was no longer attached to the rest of the bass! Maybe I'm silly, but I held my head up high and played through the soundcheck/gig on a borrowed electric bass and when the first opportunity came, retired to a quiet room on my own and wept. I mean, I got that bass when I was 18 and have been through all sorts of gigs over the years. I completely babied her, she was the most important thing I own Has anyone had an experience like this before? Is it an easy sort of damage to fix, and will my bass ever feel like she used to?[/quote] You could try Mo Clifton in Blackheath (www.cliftonbasses.co.uk). Apart from building superb electric basses he repairs electric & acoustic instruments, including DBs. The other day he showed me a DB NECK which had been split in two - he'd repaired it & the join was virtually invisible! He's not doing as much work these days as he used to, but if he's available you couldn't do much better. Good luck - Andy

[quote name='lapolpora' post='718654' date='Jan 20 2010, 01:31 AM']I find myself lusting after an electro acoustic fretless and I've been looking out for a Godin or a Status Electro. Is there anyone here who has knowledge of them both and could help me make up my mind? I'm after a bass that can do a good upright bass tone for big band playing, but could also do a good meaty baby-bass tone for salsa and latin music. Any suggestions/opinions gratefully received. Cheers![/quote] Just come across this post (I only joined the forum last week) ... I have had both in their fretted versions. I play in a largely acoustic based band & wanted a bass with a more acoustic sound than a regular electric bass, but I never liked any of the acoustic bass guitars I tried. I came across a fretless Godin A4 a few years ago in Andertons in Guildford & loved it, but needed a fretted bass for practically purposes so ordered a fretted one untried. It was a great instrument, with a warm round tone which could give an approximation of an upright bass tone (bearing in mind it is still a guitar & not a DB!) with a bit of tweaking on the EQ. The biggest drawback I found was its weight - I found it quite heavy generally & also farily head-heavy so not the best balance. After a couple of hours I could seriously feel it. After a couple of years with it I came across a Status Electro mark I (just a piezo pickup, unlike the later versions) - again in Andertons & on both occasions I wasn't even looking for a bass! This one was second hand & fretted ... and about half the weight & better balanced so I bought it & sold the Godin. The sound is still fairly acoustic-ish, but with a bit more definition, clarity & punch than the Godin, which suits me better ... the tonal range is not as wide as the Godin, but I don't need it to be. I can also play all night without feeling it & it looks stunning - better than the later versions I think as there is no pickup cluttering up the top! I haven't seen or heard a fretless Status, but from what you've described I would think the Godin is more likely to give you the sound you're after ... but I would recommend finding both if possible & trying them for yourself. Hope this helps ...