flyfisher

Does the warning label really state 400V or is it 415V, and what sort of socket is it?

Yes, according to this: http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Endless_River, sharing bass duties with Bob Ezrin.

Book wise, Keef's autobiog is a good read.

[quote name='fretmeister' timestamp='1415352294' post='2599425'] But you don't buy a Ferrari just because it's a car. [/quote] I'd say that just about nails it. A bass is primarily a tool that allows the user to do a job of work. On that basis, the key question should probably be 'will it make me a better player?'. OTOH, as a piece of 'art' it could be valued on a completely different basis. I once knew someone who paid about £75k for a Holland & Holland shotgun. It was exquisitely made but it didn't make him shoot any better than a decent (and fitted) mass-produced shotgun.

[quote name='ambient' timestamp='1415323874' post='2599310'] Maybe I have too much respect for people and their music ? [/quote] Very probably (well, not 'too' much) - because you are passionate about music, you understand the creative process and you are rightly proud of your creations. And herein lies the thing about music. We can write a song, change it, add a bit, delete a bit, work on it for days, weeks, months, maybe have an idea rattling around for years, until we're finally happy with it, then go through the process of recording it and again adding/deleting/changing/tweaking it until we have faithfully replicated what was in our head, all the time investing huge amounts of intellectual and emotional energy and condensing it intop 3, 4, 5 minutes of this thing we call music. Then, when we are finally happy to release it to the world (perhaps in a live performance after more weeks of rehearsal with other musicians to hone the performance to perfection), most people will spend the 3,4,5 minutes listening to it and say 'yes, very nice' before moving on with their lives and never listening to it again. This music lark is a very asymmetric business and musician will inevitably have an inflated sense of the importance and worth of their creative output.

I can't really see the problem. The music was offered on a 'pay what you want' basis and only about 18% of people didn't want to pay anything. It's certainly not wrong to expect to be paid, but if that was important then why allow the buyer to decide the price? While there are no real rules on pricing such things, the convention that most people are used to is that the seller sets the price. The buyer may try to haggle that price down but they are unlikely to try haggling it up! How many of us have bought a CD and thought "wow- that's brilliant! - I must give them some more for it"? Isn't that the whole reason people advertise things for "£xxx ONO"? Price it high to avoid selling too low, but allow some flexibility in case the price really is too high for the available market. But if you start the pricing at £0 and allow people to choose to pay more if they want, then you can't be surprised if some will decide to take up the £0 offer.

Nearly two feet would be correct on the basis of the average number of feet per person being slightly less than two. OTOH, that would mean the majority of people turning up for the audition somewhat over-qualified in the feet department. Statistics eh?

[quote name='FinnDave' timestamp='1415190738' post='2597602'] Fair enough, but don't be too surprised if the local roofer refuses to drink with you down the local any more, or worse. [/quote] He'll probably be the guy in the corner drinking on his own then, judging by the popularity of DIY superstores But "or worse" sounds a bit sinister. Next you'll be advocating a closed shop, picket lines and shouting at 'scab' amateurs. Last I heard, there is no monopoly on playing music.

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1415202148' post='2597833'] On this side topic of playing pub/bar/club gigs for free. I'm sure nobody here is bringing a fully rehearsed band, sound and lighting and a crowd to a 4 hour gig free of charge. [/quote] That's a fair point. We usually play up to a 40-50 minute set if we're on with other bands or two 40-ish minute sets (one covers, one originals) if not - it all depends on the gig. We don't often use our full PA either and the last venue we played had their own sound guy as well as the PA and lighting. We couldn't play for four hours without a lot more effort and, frankly, I don't think any of us would want to commit the necessary time. Horses for courses.

[quote name='JTUK' timestamp='1415191551' post='2597622'] Quite... I don't love giging but am prepared to like it. What I might like is the sense that the band is worth the gig, and the fee and I enjoy being as good as we can be. I wouldn't want to do it otherwise... and I am leaving my current band as the new proposed line-up will damage the band's hard work and good reputation... IMO. Actually, that last bit is fact...not opinion. I might not love gigging enough to do it for free, but I do need to be proud of the band and then I'll be very committed... Otherwise, I'll just dep and do pick-up gigs.. Neither give me as much satifaction tho.. [/quote] That's an interesting angle, and I can totally see how the money could be a measure of worth or success, rather than being important in its own right. A bit like millionaire businessmen still working 60/70 hour weeks to continue to grow their already successful businesses - though I've never understood that either

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1415161427' post='2597329'] Good rational, the venue is generating income because your band is bringing in additional and new business and you/we deserve our piece of the pie. I take issue with the guys that say; [i]"I'm not in it for the money, I don't need the money I have a regular straight job"[/i] I say; [i]Cool, when you play a gig and you receive your cash give it to the guy in the band that needs it, remember you don't.[/i] [/quote] That's one perspective, certainly, but there are others. Money isn't everything. If I help out a neighbour by fixing their roof, should I take their money anyway and give it to a local roofer? If I refuse to take their money, should they give it to a local roofer? Music is a hobby for me, and for the others in the two bands I play with, and I don't aim to make money from it. Sure, venues might be making money when we play (though we also play private parties and have done a couple of weddings) but loads of venues make money out of people's hobbies - golf clubs, race tracks, etc - so why should playing music be any different? If you only want to play for money then fine, no problem, but it's not a law is it?

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1415130335' post='2597094'] You really have to understand that very few people get paid to do something they truly like doing. I remember some guy that worked in a retail store was telling me he loved his job. My response; [i]No You Don't[/i]. [/quote] Perhaps you simply could not understand why he would love such a job? Perhaps he would hate to play the same songs in the same bars for his whole life? Each to their own. For all the musicians on here who proclaim to love gigging, there seems to be few who will happily do so without being paid. Seems to me that it's what people do when they're NOT being paid that they really love.

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1415085387' post='2596418'] Now it's all about having fun. If it's not fun why do it. [/quote] I reckon that's the basic answer to the original question and, of course, different people have different ideas of what's fun. Ask 100 people, get 100 different answers.

[quote name='BetaFunk' timestamp='1414887256' post='2594474'] That depends on who you are and where in the world you live. [/quote] True, but this is a UK forum

[quote name='BetaFunk' timestamp='1414887544' post='2594476'] Is that talking from personal experience? If you were then it's always nice to share experiences with a fellow ration book holder. [/quote] No, not personal experience, I was born a few years after WW2 rationing ended - and am very pleased about that as it's looking as if my generation is possibly the most fortunate in human history. Obviously that's a general statement and there will always be exceptions, but I think the general level of wealth and privilege of the 'baby boomers' is well documented.

It's not in such a sh*tty state as it was when Mr Daltry was growing up just after WW2.

[quote name='EssentialTension' timestamp='1414799781' post='2593573'] I started answering but gave up quite quickly due to spelling mistakes, questions that made unwarranted assumptions, no relevant answer for me, personal questions, overlapping of categories, incorrect use of more than and less than symbols, etc etc. Sorry. [/quote] Ditto

[quote name='xilddx' timestamp='1414713207' post='2592697'] For me music has always been about escape. There's great big place for political music, and I like a lot of it. Some of the protest musicians even know what the f*** they are talking about. But I love the escape trajectory I get from music. Music should not just be about angst, it should also be about celebration. [/quote] Yep, that's the wonderful thing about music - it can be all things to all people. Personally, I'm drawn more to the fun and celebratory side of it, rather than Leonard Cohen type music-to-cut-your-wrists-to dirges, but each to their own.

[quote name='Happy Jack' timestamp='1414662675' post='2591874'] And you'd probably blow the handles off. [/quote] You're only supposed to blow the bloody doors off!

I think the 'more on this story' link was pretty much spot on . . . . http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/oct/28/old-musicians-kids-the-who-roger-daltrey-one-direction-generation

Reminds me of that story about Brian Clough, a huge Frank Sinatra fan, who managed to arrange a meeting with with him while in the US and then would often re-tell the story along the lines of ". . . . Frank Sinatra met me once . . . "

[quote name='CamdenRob' timestamp='1414507104' post='2589978'] I think it's a little bit of that... also several venues I've played should really just give up on the live music. Played The Finsbury a few weeks back up at manor park and it was a huge pub litrally heaving with 20 somethings, hundreds of them. Decent stage, decent sound but when the music started a partition wall was drawn across from the stage area and the rest of the pub... not to keep the noise out of the music area but to keep the music out of the main pub... the kids simply didn't want the music, they had come out for a chat with their mates. [/quote] That's amazing - not sure to laugh of cry about that one! How dispiriting for the bands concerned. I've never heard of anything like that before and it evokes memories of a teenage me playing a new record to my musically disinterested parents and getting a 'yes, very nice, now please turn it down' response

[quote name='CamdenRob' timestamp='1414496398' post='2589780'] Of the gigs we've played at regular music venues the younger folk generally have absolutely zero interest in live music. [/quote] I wonder if that's because they no longer get into the habit of going to live gigs? The decline of record sales and the rise in concert ticket prices might be a big factor in this. I admit to going to fewer ticketed gigs these days, partly because I've seen many of the bands I like 'first time around' but mainly because I refuse to pay £100 for a ticket. In the late 80s/ early 90s, I went to loads of Clapton's Royal Albert Hall concerts and paid about £25 a ticket for front stalls, mostly within five rows of the stage. I saw he has recently announced tickets for some upcoming RAH concerts but the tickets 'start' at £95, which means being up in the 'gods'. Even allowing for inflation, I reckon that's taking the pi$$.

Fair point, among those 'dingy dive' goers, but the question is why are such places in decline these days compared to places like Ministry of Sound?

[quote name='discreet' timestamp='1414409377' post='2588934'] Absolutely - but I've always thought brown to be a bit lower-class. [/quote] Surely you mean beige?