bassjim

Its a long one so sit down and get comfy................. Pretty much every room = different eq for me. Also empty room at soundcheck will need something different to when there is an audience in it. Also volume of other band members and their eq in relation to where they are positioned ect ect. For example, this just gone weekend I was playing a 30th birtday party in a club that had a nice raised stage area but the rest of the main room was wooden floor and flat walls. If I boosted the lows on the amp..... (bass = passive with tone full up or just shy of full up. Pick ups from back to both to front depending on tune being played)..... with the room empty = boominess = dont boost the lows. Once the room filled with people = now safe to boost the lows cause they are soaking it up. Floor empties = more adjustment and so on. Mids and highs = change on the fly for same reasons as above. Also if the drummer gets suddenly over enthusiastic or maybe the gitard enevitably turns up, this will/could destroy a great tone because what was perfect at the previous volume has now changed. I may well turn up to compensate or wait till end of that number and wave to the offender, smile and point to the ground whilst mouthing "you are f***ing loud." and hope there is enough respect to turn it down. Or turn up and be louder. If you are standing almost on top of the amp what sounds right here is different to just a few feet away. You dont always get a few feet if its cramped for space so if someone says ..turn it up/down this could seem wrong from where you are standing so maybe go with that advise if you trust who is telling you this. All in all for most venues I havent played in before, if its a difficult room it could be tweaking as we go along. If its a known difficult venue, I know in advance its going to be a tweak night and just get over it. If its a good bass player friendly room, minimal eqing required, and the audience stays pretty much where they are...eg: packed pub it will be a good one. For my money its a case of know your gear, know your bass and know what you can expect to get out of it which also comes from experience of gigging a lot,like most weekends at least..... which may not help in the short term as this is not an easy one size fits all fix. How to use the gear effectively in all situations is as much the learning process of actually playing it I think because if you cant translate what you want to say live when ever possible no one will ever appreciate what you are putting into it. If its all going through a PA....rules have changed and now you need to........... you get the idea! Theres' soundcheck volume and then theres' mid gig volume. All band members are having their own personal issues with volume and tone along the way so sometimes its constantly evolving and sometimes its great from start to finish. EQing.........bass tone.......all a bit of a nightmare really.. All the above from personal experience over 30 years gigging. It works for me personally so if any of it helps......

local pub landlady to me: "loved to have your band on here but we only pay £150.00-£200.00 for a band. its all we can afford". what a load of old sh*t. Brewery pays £300.00 and I know cause we play at another venue owned by the same brewery. guess whos' pocketing the difference then!!??!!. Obviously told her we wont want a gig there any time soon (its a shithole anyway) Getting paid direct is a good thing when it comes to these types. Unless you are doing two a week every week and this is how you get paid ie: invoice first then lolly later, i cant see the IR chasing you down for £50-£70.00 each that you earn maybe 4 times a year at a few venues. When all venues pay like this then ok get the books out but at this point we are in a position to join arms and demand fair pay. Also you can start claiming back money for fuel, strings, equipment, braodband so you can use UTube to learn stuff ect ect.... Until such a time though its brass in the pocket, bangers and mash, mooolah or what ever the saying is....

feel your pain. on two seperate occasions i had a sax player turn up on a covers gig (different player on each) and both suffered from an inability to shut up. i was depping myself on both gigs and had to wonder what muppet though these guys were a good idea. in another band with full time horn section the sax player constantly wondered off into a corner with his back to us and constantly fiddled about inbetween actual horn section parts. (he was a really nice guy though, and it only irritated me so I had to just let it go). trouble with sax players in a band is that they "have to" contribute to every thing or feel left out. hand over a tamborine and wood block or maybe give him a conga to keep him occupied till theres something worth doing. simply shoot the guitarist though. its the kindest thing you can do there.

[quote name='kevvo66' timestamp='1457421190' post='2998230'] Thanks people ,i,m already in a band ,but fancy a change really I know a lot of muscians but the good ones are all spoken for and the others are like our current guiterist a bit of a dick [/quote] story of my life

[quote name='EmmettC' timestamp='1457442810' post='2998583'] If someone in my band did that they would get fired. [/quote] t'was in an older band where all involved were so badly behaved at all times that some punters thought it was part of an act. We even got booked cause they had either been to a previous do as a guest or heard on the grapevine what we were like. funny thing was, it wasnt an act at all... Very serious band these days though....much ,more professional .......if a bit boring.......dem da breaks ect.......but yeah ,in my current regular band this would all be a very big telling off and that

i fink.... a good gig is a good gig. I've played functions that have been really great and some where the band are a bit of aural wall paper. got paid the same amount regardless of the venue and audience having said that its the same with pubs and clubs! Worst case senario: I think some functions can be less of a good vibe for the band because if its a wedding, most guests came for the wedding as a whole and not just to see the band. Also the venue may hold 200 but they could only afford to have 50/only have 50 friends? Half of that 50 are the oldies and small children which leave by 10 pm along with the odd parent leaving an audience of 20 ish. Atmosphere is now pretty dead but dont worry ,you didnt organize it so just put your best foot forward and continue to play your best regardless. Sometimes early in the evening,the band are a welcome distraction for the guests so they dont have to keep talking to each other any more. Usually with this sort of crowd its the last folks still standing 2 tunes from the end, that are now suitably pissed enough to get into it and want you to go on all night. All the other guests went home about 10ish. Or...............its great crowd up for it all night in which case ...great! either way you (should) get paid top dollar and every gig you do is another bit of experience. Once I had the brides father come up to the band and said: "do you think you could turn it down a bit?" to which the drummer replied very loudly from behind me: "do you think you could f*** off?" yes. it happened.......... more stories like that by the bucket...........

I always have a spare EBS Riedmar under the car seat in case and usually have a 2 cab set up.(2x10 plus a 1 x 12) if the venue is too small for 2 cabs then the 1x12 stays in the car or if i find its too loud with both cabs I unplug the 1 X12..... and thats me covered every which way......unless my car is stolen with the back up in it whilst playing first set...

I think every thing sounds really loud when you sound check in an empty room. its almost like " shhhhh! that sounds really loud.this and thats too loud!" Of course it isnt but you just get that perception. what we do in a simular/most situations is always start with hot rods(super light weight drum sticks for any one that doesnt already know) on the drums and keep the back line right down, especially if the audience dont look too friendly. after a couple of tunes if they look like they are responding in a good way we go up a notch or too. if they stay on side, get the sticks out and go up a bit more.and so on. sometimes we get to sticks and some one from the audience goes " I am a complete idiot. I have come out to see a band/attending a do where there is a band but am unable to have a conversation with my friends. please can you turn it down". in which case back down to hot rod volume. If the room is really boomy then loud on any level is going to kill it so we may even stay with hot rods all night. Drummer might hate it but it could be the difference between successful and an unsuccessful night with repeat bookings. Not every gig will be like it so they (drummer) should suck it up like we do when its a S++t bass sound room) Ditto other band members with lack of volume control. (easier said than done but ....) this way we can always hear each other and most importantly the vocals from the off. If no sound check was available, this is how we do it most of the time if thats of any help to man or beast anyway!

ha ha!!......so my conclusions now are............ if any idividual that has problems hearing themselves, which in turn results in a volume problem on stage of any kind, ie:they regularly turn themselves up too much to the point its an ongoing concern, would do well to use them. Any individual that has concerns over hearing lost can still get "ear defenders" approx £200.00 a pop or opt for IEM. That idividual would have to be responsible for obtaining all the lar dee dah bits n bobs that go with them that make it work and maintaining them. As its not a unanimous decision in my band to all have them, any one using them still needs to bring an amp/monitor so that the rest of the band can still hear them on stage. If the whole band are to use them then ideally, in order for it to work as efficiently as a competent band that dont use them, (for average pub gig) you need something of the top end of the market PA system. Would that be a fair "overall" and "general" understanding?

thanks for all your comments so far............... lets say i went ok then lets give em a go............ how do I plug my bass into this whole thing and what happens if say the guitarist suddenly is too loud or a patch from the keys player then comes in out the blue but is really tinny. can you find yourself drowned out by the drummer cause you happen to be trapped next to him/her with no room to escape? what if the bass sounds s++t through the PA? I got a singer in the past to get them as an addition to his monitor cause he was struggling as a singer more than anything, but turned up without his usual monitor which was obviously a disaster. I'm starting to think these on a pub level are ok providing you use them alongside backline. which in turn makes me think whats the point? still not seen anything here so far that convinces me that IEMs are a one size fits all solution. my feeling is to say to the band: if you think you will play better for having them then go for it on the basis you keep the back line and I could tell you when I need that up or down. for a drummer they would be great but this is the drummers problem so he can shell out for them plus a mixer,plus drum mics and thats him done. for a vocalist,providing there is a stage monitor/s, they would make sence,on the basis the vocalist is a good one and doesnt start singing without any gusto cause they think every one can hear them like they can. I really cant be swayed towards them so perhaps untill i have tried them out for myself I shouldnt be so judgmental.......now then,,where did i leave that £500.00 IEM fund laying about......

ok............ no electronic kitis going to be used. gigs pay between £250.00- £400.00 between 5. I think its obvious I'm really against it. I think its ridiculous. every thing we already have is working fine . I think the real issue is one of em could do with being a better musician and the other one could do with not being so lazy and one needs to sort himself out with personal monitor or shut up about it.. its a couple of extra boxes to take to a gig that sound absolutley fine 95% of the time, verses lets all get into mucking about with gizmos. at the moment without a sound man we get a good balance out front but this nonsence threatens to f**k it all up IMO. who out there can honestly say this was a good move, plays mostly pubs n' clubs, uses their own bands PA and now uses them cause they feel its a better sound on and off stage?

[quote name='colgraff' timestamp='1457021276' post='2994553'] The singer/guitarist and drummer (e-kit) go through the PA. I use my rig because the PA is a bit small to do bass justice but when that is upgraded we will not have any backline. [/quote] does this mean....the bass gear you now dont need to take to a gig will be replaced by bigger PA stuff you now need to take to the gig? sorry if that looks like I'm trying to be argumentative BTW!!!!

hi 6feet7 no it isnt Kit. our drummer is a cool guy. uses hot rods without complaint. is a very skilled drummer. very modest cause hes always doubting himself which is ridiculos causes hes great,but definatley not a loud git. can be if required though.

thanks colgraff..................so are you saying you never take any backline to a gig?

general rule of thumb for me (with the odd exception): Function= sh*t gig but good lolly Pub= sh*t lolly but good gig

sometimes it hurts.................... current band argument: band plays funk soul disco covers. we do not have a sound man nor do we need to start paying one any time soon. we play 90% pubs and clubs most weekends Arguments for : (from other band members mostly. the ones that want to use them) 1.we should all use IEM because that will solve the problem with you telling me the guitars too loud. 2.I wouldnt have to drag my 1 x 12 guitar amp to every gig. 3.i cant hear my drums very well and i can never hear the vocals properly 4. if we all use them i dont need to bring my monitor (keyboards) and we wont have the problem with the guitarist being so loud 5. the mix will be perfect out front. 6. when we play that small pub in the back of beyond twice a year where there really isnt anywhere to spread the backline out IEM are the solution. 7. im fed up with along with all the other gear I drag to the gigs I have to bring one extra item (that will be the guitar amp/keys monitor) arguments against: 1. i have high end light weight gear that|I have personally invested thousands in (never mind all those amps and cabs in the past in my ever on going quest for tonal perfection) which gets me the bestest bass sound ever most gigs,even the bastard rooms are doable, and i have no problem moving it all the way from the car to the venue playing area. 2. i can hear every one including me perfectly 3. no one is telling us it all sounds wrong 4. singers can hear no problem with current monitor set up. 5. drummer will now need to invest not only in the IEM gear but learn how to use it. 6. have you learnt the new tunes yet or are you still banging on about IEM? 7.although undoughtedly there must be someone out there using IEMs I to date have yet to see any bands in pubs using them. 8. if we use a dep, is it now on the basis they have a good set of IEMs? 9. i did about 12 dep gigs last year. not one of them asked me if I had my own set of IEMs 10. our singers (we rotate a pool of em) will all be asked to invest at their own expence or use cheap ones that are provided...by the band?) 11. i could go on................ any way......what say you lot? IEMs yes or no for a pub band?

went back to 4 string after 20 years using just a 5. So far bar maybe one or two cover tunes that needed the key changed dramatically[font=arial, sans-serif][size=4][b] due to singers not having the right range I havn't found myself really needing one. There is however [/b][/size][/font]definitely a need for them for some situations and some players just dont work with out them, but personally I prefer a 4. I down tune to D or Eb where applicable and this works for me. I can always find a work around plus I find I can "get around" on a 4 with a lot more ease. Ive played MusicMan, Bernie Goodfellow and Overwater 5 strings. All very good, do the job well but just find a 4 string is less hassle. PS the bold lettering is a typo error I cant seem to get rid of and not a rant of any kind!!!!

some songs take me as long as it takes to listen to em.These are the typical easy not a lot going on. If I was doing a dep gig and say something like Chaka Khan "Aint No Body " came up and I'd never played it before, and only a day or so to learn it amongst other things, I would come up with a "cheat" version. Not perfect but get awayable. However if I am keeping this tune then I will spend as long as it takes. As it happens this was a keeper tune and I have probably spent weeks and weeks,maybe months? analysing all the different permutations till I can honestly say "I own this tune". I could now play it with whom ever (typical covers band!) in E,Eb or D and fit in with what ever standard the band are at with it .ie:very bad,bad, good ,very good, f**k this band are awsum ect. I have already come up with various "get out of jail" plans depending on what the drummer does. To sum up : If it warrants it, in my personal opinion, a tune takes as long as I want to spend on it/ consider it worth it. Just because I can play off the cuff the notes in the right order doesnt mean I can play it. I can play it when I can convince all around me I can play it if that makes sence. Just my 2ps worth ! ..........

Ok folks bear in mind this applies to PUB and CLUB gigs only. Not great big stages and stadiums!!!! so.....used a pair of great EBS112 neos for years and years and years. No problem. Great sound. Quite happy. Actually very happy. Saw an EBS 2x 10 neo going for the right money. Got curious. Brought it. Decided to gig it for a few months and wait just in case its a new thing = new thrill before I draw a conclusion. Conclusion is yep defo prefer the old 10s. When I came in some 30 odd years ago although the cabs were obviously bigger,heavier and not as good as they are now, they were still 10s. Im sure the only thing I didnt like was the weight but when i was younger it was probably eaiser to convince my eyes before my ears........and so the move away from one issue , the size and weight, led me down some foggy path that went on for years and landed with the 112s before i ended up back here in 10s land. Headroom wise its pretty much on par with a pair of the 12s so if any thing I now need (on most pub gigs) just the one cab instead of two. Its staring me in the ears: The fact that the cab is in itself bigger it just has more of everything on offer without much effort from me and my eq. Its more versatile and every one in the band notices the difference and are as happy as i am with it. I know a lot of this is the bleedin obvious to some but I was wondering how many others out there have gone down the old pair of 112 route (cause its lighter, better this ,better that ect) only to arrive back at the original? Not a test of whos the best here, or a whats better 10s or 12s just a casual any one else found their way back to the good old "cab loaded with 10s" ?

nice

i was in total awe of MK as a lad. I dont spend gigs doing the slap thing these days but as a lad it was all the rage. he inspired me to start playing and here i am many years later having a MK moment at a gig some time this earlier this year. i love having a slap attack every now and then and the audiences that like a bit of the old soul funk disco stuff like it too. MK is great musician as well as a bass player IMO. https://www.facebook.com/innersoulcollective/videos/950957261609410/

its hard enough getting a band together/joining one thats productive on any level. although there are more fishes in the sea its not (usually) instant so i do really feel your pain. i put a thread up here a short while ago about a guitarist that has an awful tone/attitude and the gen feeling here from our bass comrades was to get rid. taking into account that some people are totally unapproachable and not easy to talk to and if he is like this then you wont win ever. its gonna be horrible for life. i have reached a compromise with my own situation regarding a guitarist thats not cutting it and it goes like this; i will keep looking around in the background for something else and in the meantime put up with it. if i find another band/guitarist by my self and find my self short of a singer,keys player or drummer i already know a couple of dudes i could ask nudge nudge wink wink and im sure they would be cool with "doing a couple of gigs here and there" and if it escalates into something more so be it. maybe at some point someone gets their feelings hurt but unless you have a lot of choice as to whom you get to play with you are a bit stuck. you can demand he listens and joins in for the greater good but maybe you cant cause the fact is he's a cock. maybe he would like to be better but simply isnt good enough but wont /cant admit it. trouble with bands is, unless very lucky , we all end up with some personality floating around we normally wouldnt put up with in the first place..... i feel your pain

hi. just seen this..... i had a 350. it was old and died. got a 360 but no matter what they say at ebs its different. the top end has changed. in fact I found it sounded different overall.these diffrences were the "improvments" they made which could well be what a lot of players out there want but to my ears these were horrible changes. i argued this a lot with them and they tried to fob me off with a replacment part that when fitted would make it just like the 350. it did nothing what so ever so I can asume this was some kind of a c**t test to see if i was talking out my arse. any way after a lot of email tennis they sent me "the last 350 in stock". if you dont need more power then i would suggest you see if you can try the 360 as you might prefer what you already have so may well save a few bob going with the pedal option. considering their pedals are the dogs you cant go wrong here! IMO