TimR

[quote name='stingrayPete1977' timestamp='1338803631' post='1679315'] So are all outdoor gigs off Tim? I have tickets for the Chillis at Knebworth in a couple of weeks! [/quote] Are they playing on grass at the end of a bunch of extension leads daisy chained from Knebworth House? Or On a purpose built stage rigged by pro electicians?

[quote name='flyfisher' timestamp='1338763521' post='1679099'] At which point the RCD will trip won't it? ..... [/quote] Hopefully. They have their limitations. Like most safety devices they reduce the risk, not eliminate it. They wont trip under all fault conditions. They are only designed to protect a %age of the population. Certain people like elderly, very young and ill people are still at risk. You don't know how much current for how long will kill YOU until YOU receive the shock. I'll stick to not mixing electrics and water. I've have some bad experiences. If you want to trust your life to a £10 piece of gear from Homebase - go ahead.

[quote name='Count Bassy' timestamp='1338754781' post='1678957'] Only if something is faulty in the first place [/quote] Extension leads go faulty really quickly when you pour water on them.

In my last band, it depended on who booked the gig as to was the optimist. If the drummer booked the gig it would go ahead come hell or high water, if someone else booked it he would be happy to cancel if there was a football match on. It's not a great deal of fun playing to an empty field. At a local village gig last year we waited an hour for the weather to clear before going on. Typically people waited at home until it cleared so people were arriving throughout our set. The evening was cracking for all the other bands though, even if they all had to drop a couple of songs from their sets to fit in. I once played a gig in a gazebo in a garden where we moved the gazebo to face the house and everyone stood by windows inside the house to watch. Was quite funny playing to the people upstairs. The big problem is you can't play on grass, you'll get electrocuted. If you've got flooring down it's risky but better.

Thanks for that mate. Bookmarked and joined.

[quote name='Marvin' timestamp='1338567548' post='1676569'] These philistines are simply mocking what they ain't got. They simply aren't organised or nice enough to have such a bountiful wealth of knowledge, friendship and arguments as what you find on this 'ere small corner of the internet. I think Skank summed it up perfectly..."f*** 'em" [/quote] Or alternatively they are and by pouring scorn and derision on you it deflects attention from them and the possibility of you finding out about their Extreme Knitting forum.

I'm not in the busk it at 'practice' camp either. Practice is what you do at home, rehearsal is what you do as a band. However, this is ok when you are covering a basic tune with the same instruments. Replacing keyboard/guitar with guitar/keyboard and rehearsals often become practices But everyone should at least have the progressions, licks and form down off pat, which makes arranging a lot quicker and simpler.

Well kind of, but after 25 years of playing I would hope I know my intervals and have played enough chord progressions for most songs to fall under my fingers pretty quickly. Couple that with PCs and MP3s and 20mins should be plenty. Although occasionally a song will take a lot longer. Compare that to 25 years ago when I was rewinding tapes and picking notes out 1 by 1, a simple pop tune could take all night to learn.

That's just an experience thing though. I think the more experience you get, the less time it takes you to learn your part, or you just skim learn it to get it to rehearsal level. So then you don't feel you have invested hours in a song and don't want to bin it.

[quote name='Kiwi' timestamp='1338553823' post='1676247'] 2,300,000 hits a month speaks for itself, I think. [/quote] All from the same 23 users It's geeky rather than nerdy. I think there was a thread recently about personality types where strangely we all fitted into the same group. Funny that. There are chat rooms/forums on practically every subject but the strangest one I've seen is Pistonheads a very narrow demographic! I'm a member of about 4 different ones on different subjects and they're all the same and mainly the off topic subjects are the same and the busiest areas.

It's all part of working with artists. If a painter want's the sky painted blue, it's not going to be easy for him to tell you which shade of blue. At least with music someone can write down some basic dots or chord structure and you can work on that. We've all been in the situation where we've been told - just stick to the roots. Only later to be told that one of the notes we're playing is wrong - "Well yes, that's because you told me to play roots...." It works both ways, as I said earlier, and will maintain, there are a lot of guitarists who think they can play bass. It seems to be more common and I wonder if this is why 'good' Bass players are apparently so difficult to find. I've seen 3 bands this year where I've not thought much of the bass player, only to see the guitarist and 'bass player' swap roles at the break and been even worse. So that's 6 guitarists that can't play bass I've seen this year, and doesn't include guitarists who picked up my bass during practices to 'show me how it goes' We bass players have either got it horribly wrong, or a lot of guitarists don't actually know what the role of the bass player is. At least we can be fairly sure that as this guy used to be a bass player he has an idea of what he wants. But, hey, it's music, it's an art-form, there's no wrong and right.

I've never met a guitarist who can play bass. I've met too many who think they can. If the producer has advised him fair enough. The main thing to take from this is that it's not a band. You are the bass player for the song writer. You don't have any stake in the songs unless you have a written agreement. If you are planning on putting any more into this project I would seek professional advice, whether that be going on tour or writing additional material. You may even find that when he gets signed properly you are dropped and a backing band are bought in.

I'm not sure that I've ever vetoed a song. It's just a bunch of notes. I have suggested thatvwe don't play one or two because I didn't think musically we were up to them. Which I think if musicians are honest sometimes we can't do some songs justice. I had a drummer who couldn't play regae to save his life, I'm not great at it. He suggested some Bob Marley and some ub40. We tried them but couldn't get them off the ground.

Well 25% say is going to be hard to measure. There's a fine line between having firm ideas of how you want a project to go and being dictatorial over your involvement. I can kind of see if you've had experiences in the past where no one has taken your song choices on board it can be frustrating. I was in a band where I ended up suggesting songs through another member of the band because the 'band leader' just ignored my suggestions out of hand (a control issue?)

Indeed. I think that's really the issue. Starting up a band with sole control isn't really the way to go unless you have something to give the other musicians. Be that money or creative input. Unless you are a very talented writer/arranger you need a guitarist to play like a guitarist and a drummer to play like a drummer not a guitarist to play like a bass player playing guitar etc. I wouldn't be too fussy about having strong control over it as it will probably drive you mad. Guitarists have a habit of improvising at every opportunity.

What's in it for them?

[quote name='ahpook' timestamp='1338292923' post='1672190'] if that was mooted at any initial band meet-up i went to, i'd say my goodbyes and leave. i'm always dubious of anyone wanting to proclaim themselves a leader without experiencing the group dynamic first [/quote] It's tricky. You need someone to initially get things going. I would expect fairly early on there to be some sort of director. I've joined bands where nothing ever got done because there was no leader. I suppose it depends on whether you have a dictator or a leader.

Well a few ideas for discussion rather than a rigid agenda. Nothing worse than sitting round a table saying "Let's start a band....." and everyone looking blankly at each other. I think my first step would be to establish a leader. Not me, I've been there and done that and appreciate what a thankless task it is. I would rather someone with some time and drive did it and I just help guide it if neccesary, even if they get paid extra from gig money.

I've done it the other way. Just turn up and play for an originals band. They gave me the bass lines I played them. Are you planning on writing everything, drum lines etc or are you planning on getting some input from the others? I think there will be very few musicains willing to do that for free. It's quite refreshing though to play in a unit where all you do is turn up.

I think you're right there. A few bands I've been in have been fine rehearsing for ages and as soon as the performance pressure rears it's head some people just implode. Getting a gig booked early, even just an hour support slot would be one for my list.

Has anyone produced a 'roadmap' with timescales etc? I'd not really thought about that aspect of it. Maybe we need a sticky on starting a band? In the past all my bands have grown organically, recordings, gigs and photos have come when we felt we needed them. While this won't be my band and I don't want to be pushy maybe I'll suggest we put down some timescales.

I have PA and lights. Not too stoked about how/whether that gets paid for as long as the guys don't start taking the P. I've been in too many bands where I've supplied PA and lights, hauled it to every gig for free with no appreciation, only complaints and no help loading/unloading the car. Anyway.... Some good points and motives there. Agree a setlist? I'm going to suggest someone does a setlist of about 30 tunes and we familiarise/learn 12 of them before we start rehearsals. I'm not really fussed what's in the setlist, I would rather learn 12 tunes and the band not get together for a second rehearsal than the first rehearsal be one of those "What do you know"/"Let's just jam" type thing.

[quote name='Happy Jack' timestamp='1338228567' post='1671211'] The only possible answer is "it depends". Why are you starting a band? .... [/quote] Some good questions there. For me, I've always played in bands and each one has had a fairly clear purpose; Become famous. (Didn't happen) Play some original tunes (ended up playing what the Singer/songwriter told us to) Jam on a Sunday morning (Jams get boring after a while) Commitments tribute band (drummer liked hard rock) Function band (as long as we can pick and chose the gigs paying lots and close to home) Cover band doing gigs (if they're to their mates) and so on.... This one? I'll find out later this week, but if it's rehearse once a week forever then I'm not buying in. I'm still doing that in the cover band. Gig, gig, gig please - money is secondary but has to be right. I'm not playing for 'free' beers.

[quote name='serengeti' timestamp='1338227979' post='1671198'] [url="http://www.talkbass.com/forum/f67/if-only-i-knew-then-what-i-know-now-429034/"]http://www.talkbass.com/forum/f67/if-only-i-knew-then-what-i-know-now-429034/[/url] Check this! [/quote] Thankfully we've all been around long enough to know all that. But yes we've probably learned it the hard way. Lol.

I'm going to meet with some guys this week about starting up a band. I've played with the drummer a few times, and I know the other 2 guitarists are good. They're pretty much sorted on the type of music they want to play. I know and can play the genre and am looking forward to it. The only things I want to lay on the table are minimum practice, giging asap and playing popular tunes. Other than that I'm easy. What would you guys push for or be happy to let slide?