Beer of the Bass

[quote name='Dad3353' timestamp='1413729813' post='2581286'] Well, there were other names suggested. I offered 'Sunbeam', and '[i]Le[/i] 200'; hardly mega-macho..? [/quote] That's true. I'm one who struggles with names for things; I built my own pedals, guitar amp and bass and none of them have names as I can't come up with any that don't make me cringe a little! I had an Aria "Thor Sound Bass" which I always used to refer to as the TSB. I can see why manufacturers so often go with the boring alphanumeric titles...

[quote name='skankdelvar' timestamp='1413728260' post='2581268'] Seeing as it'll be a bunch of blokes using the amp that's probably a good thing. I suppose [i]you'd[/i] have named it the MJW Lilac Bouquet, ya big poncey metrosexual. [/quote] Hmm, the names in the poll do seem to be aimed at the D&D playing crowd! Still, EBS did OK with a similar naming scheme and it's probably better than sniggering-blokes-in-a-tour-bus style innuendo (as pioneered by Electro Harmonix).

[quote name='PlungerModerno' timestamp='1413647124' post='2580529'] If a reputable classical instrument builder (and it's an if, at least regarding the reputable ones!) chooses significantly inferior wood - purely for the name - that's sick. AFAIK (and I'm no classical instrument builder/player) the traditional instrument needs to be kept carefully to last - e.g. case humidifiers in dry environments. An instrument made with odd wood parts might have lots of issues - not only spoiling a luthiers reputation, but perhaps causing massive upset and lost earnings to a performer / teacher. Some people can't do without a given instrument. To risk them losing it, from the builders side, is exactly the opposite of what they should be striving for. [/quote] Yeah, it's weird, but players keep asking for it and even when it's crazy-grained flatsawn wood extracted from a tree stump it attracts a premium. The builders are just responding to demand, after all. FWIW my brother won't use Brazilian Rosewood at all - I think he's working with FSC certified African or Malaysian Blackwood at the moment.

[quote name='PlungerModerno' timestamp='1413640541' post='2580435'] You're on to something there. What if an unscrupulous builder / company uses wood of an exotic or rare tree to promote an instrument - but the woods rarity means less than ideal pieces are used, even though ideal pieces of a run of the mill tree as available. [/quote] My brother is a classical guitar builder, and I get the impression that this is what the demand for Brazilian Rosewood is doing in the classical and acoustic guitar world. The good stuff is mostly gone (at least through legal routes), but some luthiers will use wild-grained pieces just to have the cachet that goes with it. While Indian Rosewood is demonstrably not the same (being less dense and having a duller tap tone) and arguably inferior, there are plenty of other more sustainable hardwoods with similar properties and tone.

[quote name='molan' timestamp='1413580356' post='2579930'] There are some good used synths around for this sort of money. Obviously very different but you can pick up an almost new Novation Mininova for £150 on eBay these days. [/quote] True, but I'm as much into the DIY project aspect of the Shruthi as finding something ready made to do the job. I'd also prefer a module to a keyboard as I don't get on with mini keys.

[quote name='Happy Jack' timestamp='1413544450' post='2579316'] In fairness, if his Dad bought it in the early 90s (i.e. pre-Internet) then there was a LOT less information about this sort of stuff out there, and it was far easier to get done, even with a fraud as amateurish as this. [/quote] Yes, it could be a copy from that period with some cheeky fake labels and decal. It looks a lot like an Encore or similar, right down to the truss rod adjustment, bridge and tuners. It's weird that the seller points out that the control cavity had to be widened for full-size pots, without knowing that a Fender would have come fitted with them. This suggests a certain lack of knowledge on his part, as any scammer worth his salt wouldn't have mentioned this. So was his dad ripped off, or is it him trying to rip us off?

Those bridges with the extra screws at the front seem to be a cheap copy thing too.

I'm pretty sure that's ash. The picture seems to bring out more of a pinkish quality than it has in the flesh, but then the maple neck looks similarly warm toned.

[quote name='Zenitram' timestamp='1413475926' post='2578658'] Yes, it's very intuitive. The LEDs below the knobs let you know where you are. And if you have a midi controller thing, like a Behringer BCR2000 or a Novation Remote SL, you can control the 24 most common parameters by CC, so you have all those controls at your fingertips at the same time. Apparently. I haven't tried it yet, but I read it somewhere. [/quote] I'd be playing it from my Roland SK-500 keyboard which doesn't have any knobs, so hopefully I'll get by OK with the Shruthi as it is. If I don't I could always pick up a knob-based controller later. [quote name='Zenitram' timestamp='1413476711' post='2578674'] This is a good deal: [url="http://mutable-instruments.net/forum/discussion/5901/fs-shruthi-smr4-mkii"]http://mutable-instr...ruthi-smr4-mkii[/url] [/quote] Hmm, it does look like a good deal, but I'm viewing assembling the thing and coming up with my own case as part of the fun! I have access to a laser cutter for the front panel and I like the idea of making a case with hardwood sides.

[quote name='Zenitram' timestamp='1413470790' post='2578580'] I'm noodling around on it right now! [/quote] How do you find the four knob interface for tweaking sounds? Is it reasonably intuitive to get around? I want something I can play around with the different parameters on without having my head stuck in the manual all the time.

Yep, I'd say octaver too, ideally an OC2. Something about that synthy sound goes well with the ability to slide around. It's 80s as hell, but the good sort of 80s IMO!

Has anyone got experience with these? [url="http://mutable-instruments.net/shruthi1"]http://mutable-instr...ts.net/shruthi1[/url] They seem to offer a lot for the money, and I miss my old analogue monosynths that I sold when skint a few years ago (I had a Teisco S110-F and an original Novation Bass Station). These are an analogue/digital hybrid with digital oscillators and modulation sources into an analogue filter and VCA, with different filters available. I've enough experience with DIY electronics that I'd be confident in building one, and the fact that you can get a moog-style ladder filter for it is attractive, as that covers exactly the type of noises I'd like to make. The lack of knobs for individual functions could take some getting used to, but otherwise they look sort of appealing.

[quote name='Annoying Twit' timestamp='1413386783' post='2577800'] I think I've worked out the acronyms in other posts. MB200 I recognise, but I had to google to find out what an EA whizzy 10 is. I've just lifted a 2x10 250w combo, and it was pretty heavy. On a bicycle trailer that weight may be an issue. This is all theoretical at the moment, but I like to think about things well ahead. [/quote] I also have an EA Wizzy 10 I use when travelling on the bus. It fits neatly in a padded cajon bag with space at one end for a head and cables. The weight is about 17lbs, so there aren't many lighter bass cabs on the market (except the Greenboy Crazy 8 design). I'd think twice about carrying one on a bike rack, but it should be fine in a good trailer.

[quote name='Annoying Twit' timestamp='1413371341' post='2577558'] I think this is the wrong comparison. The topic of the thread was meant to be whether the species of body wood makes a difference to the tone. The correct comparison then would be an instrument individually handmade from carefully selected woods with no expense spared to another instrument individually handmade from some other wood with no expense spared other than the choice of wood species. Or, two crudely made basses that only differ in the species of wood of the body. Otherwise you're comparing apples with oranges. Particularly since nobody seems to be claiming that a crudely made instrument is as good as a very well made instrument. Returning to the topic, the violins and brass instruments are good examples of how the personal experience of people who are quite expert in a field can still easily be wrong. That's why we need well designed and implemented experiments to find out what the truth is. [/quote] On the "crudely made" phrase, I was alluding to the idea sometimes hinted at on forums that the cheapest copy with a decent pickup installed will be as good as anything else. It's true that in many contexts the sound will be similar enough to be indistinguishable, but there are all kinds of subtle things which may make the cheap copy less pleasurable to play than a premium instrument. Maybe not strictly relevant here admittedly, but I choose my instruments through playing them and not through double-blind tests. With regard to the violin and brass players, I don't think their personal experience [i]is[/i] wrong, but their interpretation and explanation of that experience probably is. Their personal experience is simply that they prefer playing instrument X to instrument Y, which is a valid (if personal) observation. The questionable bit is whether another instrument made from the same material as X will have the same desirable traits.

[quote name='uncle psychosis' timestamp='1413360349' post='2577389'] What I will say is this. Most brass musicians swear blind that the metal you make their instruments from makes a clear difference to the sound they make. White gold is "mellower" than brass, etc etc etc. However, proper double blind tests, where a high end trumpet maker made a series of valveless trumpets (they have no moving parts so they're fairly straightforward to duplicate) out of different materials showed that the effect of the material was inconclusive at best. Turns out musicians are better at "listening" with their eyes then their ears Same with violinists. "Everyone knows" old violins like Strads are "the best" but in double blind tests professional violinists prefer modern top end violins to old classics. The moral of the tale is that its very, very dangerous to assume anything when it comes to the brains effect on the ears. [/quote] Yeah, this is an odd area. If all of these subjective things about our relationship to an instrument are so important to how we feel about playing it there could be a case for embracing that, as long as we're honest about it. If a player has a positive feeling about playing an instrument individually handmade from carefully selected woods with no expense spared, does it matter whether he could tell it from a crudely made copy in cheap woods with the same pickup when recorded in a blind test? Could it be argued that if that player feels better about the first instrument then it is a better instrument for him?

[quote name='skankdelvar' timestamp='1413209627' post='2575834'] If someone who [i]wasn't[/i] a stuck-up, talentless amateur possibly under the age of 20 with an annoying haircut... [color=#ffffff].[/color][/quote] If you're under 25 and in an originals band, having a silly haircut is a time-honoured practice and a sign of dedication! To sport a sensible haircut is to let the side down. The haircuts have changed through the decades, but they've always been silly. There'll be plenty of time for sensible haircuts later on...

I like that. It's got a bit of a lighter touch and more of a sense of fun than I've seen in some fusion-y projects. Can I detect a little Hillage influence in your guitar playing in the opening number?

[quote name='Acebassmusic' timestamp='1413195878' post='2575602'] I think it was on Talk Bass that a guy did such a test using a Jazz bass. He recorded the bass as standard and then swapped out the body for a random lump of wood he found. He was quite particular to place the bridge / pickups / action so that any changes were attributed to only the body wood. I think the result was that in this case there was very little discernable difference. I'll see if I can find the link......here it is : [url="http://www.talkbass.com/threads/scrap-lumber-bass-vs-alder-bass-can-you-tell-the-difference.743932/"]http://www.talkbass....ference.743932/[/url] [/quote] I don't think the Talkbass thread puts the issue to bed forever though. It shows that those particular two materials can sound similar under the conditions used, but we can't extrapolate that to say that [i]all[/i] body materials would sound the same - the data just isn't there for that. It would be interesting to attempt a similar trial using woods of more disparate properties, say a soft, light piece of paulownia and a hard, dense piece of wenge or similar. If those couldn't be distinguished in a blind test, there might be more grounds for dismissing the notion of tonewoods in a solid body.

[quote name='stingrayPete1977' timestamp='1413194349' post='2575586'] I don't think it's fair to demand that a young player in an originals band takes a spare bass to every gig, I only had one bass when I was starting out and I know lots of people here still take one bass on a gig. If he had turned up empty handed I'd have laughed in his face but a faulty Jack socket mid gig could happen to any of us, I'd have lent him a bass this time although the five string still gets me out of being asked as does the upright when these things occur. [/quote] Interestingly the double bass has been the one that I've let other players use, but only in very specific situations with players I'd trust. A few years ago my band kept being at the same gigs and festivals as a friends' band from Glasgow, and we often sorted it out between us to bring and use one bass. I think I've played as many gigs on his bass as he has on mine. It helps that my insurance covers accidental damage while on loan.

Gordon Smith have a method of installing rods in one-piece maple necks without a stripe or separate fingerboard. They won't tell anyone how they do it...

Cheers guys. I should probably point out, this is the band I had the thread in General Discussion about leaving, and I'll no longer be playing with them. These recordings were done over a year ago when things felt on a little more of a roll, and I thought I'd stick them up here as I'm still kind of pleased with how they came out. I've been chatting with a guy who's trying out for the post and he's a decent player and seems enthusiastic enough, so I reckon the band will still be worth catching live when they get back to gigging.

[quote name='funkgod' timestamp='1413026609' post='2574257'] Im going for 3 as the tape one ?? [/quote] Correct! We had a fairly limited project studio type setup so it may not show it to its full effect.

[quote name='KiOgon' timestamp='1412927527' post='2573293'] Top tip!? When I get new flats of any make I give them a really good rubbing down with cotton pad soaked in Surgical Spirits - you might not believe the shyte that comes off them & it seems to smooth them off before starting to use them. [/quote] I wonder what the stuff that comes off is? I guess it could be some sort of residue from the polishing process, as I've noticed it on flats and groundwounds, but not on rounds.

I've seen it a couple of times here in Edinburgh, but in both cases it's been instigated by visiting Americans! One is a guitarist who comes over during the Edinburgh festival each year who I do pub gigs with. It seems to work quite well, so I'm not complaining!

[quote name='Burg' timestamp='1412970532' post='2573830'] I was tempted by this bass on Gumtree but the crack in the front put me right off. [/quote] Ooft! That's right where the soundpost sits, and a pro repair would likely be close to the value of the bass. Unless you're looking for a crash course in luthiery you were wise to avoid that one!