Pirellithecat

Thanks for that - yep I too was concerned about the link and was going to get a proper link sorted (or in my case, more likely "shorted") once I'd tried it out. I also have A BDI21 and can try that out later today. The little box shown is an elegant solution though. Tried the set up on Friday's Gig and the whole FOH/Monitor arrangement works well - it's getting better with each bit of implemented advice. However, in an effort to reduce overall stage noise I put my bass cab close up to the wall adjacent to the Drummer in an effort to reduce stage volume ('cos with the bass in his lug hole the drummer might want things turned down a bit!!). But it's a really dreadful/bassy venue and I could not EQ the very boomy/mushy bass out of the set up without ending up with a rather "Clanky" sound (on stage). Great in ears though but very distracting trying to get the room sound OK. Also, spent time EQing the guitar feed to IEMs and that turned out well. So, doubling up he channels works well, spending time EQing (quite aggressively) the guitar also worked well (I have a spare channel I may also double this up to get FOH mix and IEM mix separate). Weekend off "Covers" next weekend (but working on a new Folk/Fretless project so the mixing trick might be needed!!) and then another tricky/small pub to practice on! Onwards and upwards!! Many thanks for all the inputs (😅)!

First update. Just rewired things so that it's simpler. Half insert ordinary jack into Insert on 1 channel and feed this into adjacent channel input. Seems to work just as well and reduces complexity/no of wires. So now it's Bass - Pedal Board - Amp - DI (preEQ) into mixer Channnel 1 (> FOH), Insert out to Channel 2 for IEM's. So dead simple. We'll see later!!

Used a passive DI box to take signal from Insert on the mixer bass guitar channel to a free channel so I now have a FOH bass feed and an IEM bass feed I can now adjust volume and tone for on stage, In Ear and FOH independently🤞 We'll see how it goes at tomorrow's gig!! Thanks all!

Thanks . The Fractal is an FX8. Basically I think the only way to take a feed which captures the pre-amp and effects is to split the FX return. But I'm just a bass player, so don't understand the essential "Foo" of amping guitars for magicness!! I quite like the mixer solution though .... is this a better route than just inserting an e.g. BDI21 or equivalent into the feed from the Bass? Alternatively I guess I could use it as an "Insert"????? Sorry if this post just demonstrates my lack of knowledge on all this .... but better to ask and get shot down as it's all part of the learning curve. 🙄

I spoke too soon! The Fractal doesn't really do DI out - you can get a feed but it's preEQ/FX etc so sounds pretty naff. I suspect I could insert a DI box into the FX return lead from the Fractal to the amp and run a DI out from there, but it's probably too difficult to get agreement to do this. On the bass side of things, is it possible to actually insert something like a BDI21 into the Feed from the DI out from the Bass Amp to the mixer? Probably over egging this but I just can't get an acceptable sound for IEM's using just the Mixer tone controls. Basically I want independent tone/volume control - one for the stage sound and one for the Mixer/IEM feed.

We use these at our local Music Events organisation - our sound tech swears by them and he gets a great sound. !!

My (limited) experience with Sound Engineers is that they "want" a pre EQ DI feed so that what you do by way of changing settings on the amp during the set doesn't affect their settings on the mixer. So generally they prefer a straight DI from your bass. This is beneficial in some ways as it leaves you more freedom to adjust your amp to get the stage sound you want should the need arise. So that's a very simple arrangement and if its a passive DI needs no power supply etc and can be relatively inexpensive (check out Behringer). The DI box matches the output impedence to that required by the mixer so it's not quite the same as just plugging your bass into the mixer. Another option is the Behringer BDI21 which is an pre-amp/DI - one went on here for £20 recently. Good Luck!!

Wow - great! The guitarist uses a Fractal board so I guess I can take a feed from that (?) That would also solve the perpetual Pain In the "proverbial" of him turning his amp up during the set!! That would be a real "win" (if I'm right!!). The Mixer is an analogue 16 channel desk - sits by me, so I'm the roady, the bass player and the "sound guy" . All monitor/FOH on mixer , FOH done by me touring the audience now and then. So ..... If I had something like a SansAmp VT/Para driver or similar I could just DI out from there and use the amp for the stage/FOH sound without having to adjust the IEM mix at each gig. I like it!! Any other "better" DI out ideas for the Pedal board? (I would like to use swap basses for some songs so something like the VT Deluxe appeals - but it might be a bit dated these days .... or?) And it's a relief it's not just me finding the IEM bass a little tricky. Many thanks

Had my most successful outing with IEM's on Saturday and am getting a better mix from all the instruments/vocals. But a few observations/questions if I may .... Observations 1) The importance of good isolation can't be underestimated. 2) As I get the hang of mixing the IEM's better it's noticeable that I'm probably using too much volume - need to turn IEM Aux down. Q's Bass How do you get a decent Bass sound? On the mixer have Bass, Semi Parametric Mids, Treble, and HPF, but I just can't seem to craft the sound - twangy top end and a mushy bottom end. Probably just need practice but any help appreciated. The IEM bass tone bears little resemblance to the on-stage bass sound. Any thoughts on Pre vs Post EQ from the DI out of my Ashdown ABM600? Guitar(s) This is a direct DI from the valve amp (some kind of cab sim involved I think). Seems to accentuate the guitar "dirty" channel which merges with my Bass IEM feed to produce a combined sound that I hate - keep checking to see if something wrong on the amp!! Worth using a Mic on his cab or is there any other way round this? I was getting a bit pessimistic about ever getting this sorted but I'm more optimistic following last weekend's outing!!

Tried a few "tricks " on a very small stage area on Saturday. Seemed to help. Repositioned Drum Monitor as far as possible (slightly behind drummer - he sings at almost 90 degrees to front of stage..) Removed kick drum from drum monitor and increased it FOH (seemed to provide enough "extra" kick on stage minus the feedback (??) Put everything into FOH - albeit at low volumes (apart from vocals). Reduced ALL monitor levels Turned my bass down!!!! on the basis that if I'm less loud the guitar will sound louder (relatively) on stage therefore reducing the tendency to increase the (guitar) volume. Used IEM's Best sound we've ever had out front! (Yep - I get to wander about in the audience to check everything's OK at Sound check and then in the first song in both sets). NB I didn't tell the band I'd done any of this, just nodded when given instructions and carried on regardless - I don't believe they noticed anything except absence of problems and great sound!! Need to work on IEM's though .... so hoping to get a few more tips on a new thread. I'd like to explore gating the drum Mic, but he does move around a lot, and whilst the expensive mic'ing options are very attractive the expense seems a limiting factor. So, once again, Thanks for the engagement and helpful advice.

This is all good! Short of buying the drummer a new Mic ('cos he won't!) it's probably worth redoubling the effort put into Mic/Monitor placement and trying to reduce Mic sensitivity. So all this info is great .... I might "borrow" an SM58 beta to see if I can convince him to invest though .......

Yep - had a look at mic'ing up the drums differently - I guess the Glynn Johns idea is a good compromise between complexity and sound quality. However, i have to remember that there are things I can affect and those I can't - e.g. I suggested a "better" mic for the drum vocals - drummer just bought a Chinese clone of a Shure SM58 (maybe?) but it does have an off/on switch! I think I can move the kick drum mic to see if I can reduce the unwanted frequencies and maybe reduce the vocal mic gain, but not much to do in terms of compression as I don't use it on the drums or the drum vocals. I really should have bought a digital desk as there's so much more frequency control options and the "gate" idea might be something to think about (although the comment about the volume of the drums be trumping any vocal input strikes a chord). Anyway a few things to tweak .... everyday's a school day! Thanks for all the advice.

Thanks everyone - disaster averted!! Thanks for the advice.! Sub out of corner and away from drum mics - so front edge of stage to the right against wall - and a great gig was had by all. Still need to work on a way to get the drum vocals working without feedback from monitor and bleed/feedback from kick drum/Snare Mics. SM57 on Snare (rim) - wonder whether an overhead might work better ???? But kick drum .... no clue! Current solution is to turn off drummers vocal mic!! Hey Ho - upwards and onwards!

Phew! The available location would have been adjacent to the Drummer, in the rear corner - primarily resulting in grief for the sound-man and bass player (me!). So THANK YOU!!! I shall revert to Plan A. or maybe make a carboard cone and sit the sub adjacent to the front of the stage, beside the wall.

Will just need to persuade he guitarist that it's not too risky/complicated/tempting fate. That's Rock and Roll for you!😅

Hi, Tricky stage on Saturday next, but there is space at the back, to the side of the Drums, for the Sub ......... but it might be a risky experiment as I have used it "out front" previously but this involves convoluted wiring and reduced space for the "performers". So ... convenient, but am I going to run the risk of feedback via Drum mics and Drum Vocals/monitor? The vocal mics should be OK as they are High Pass Filtered at above the sub frequency (or thereabouts). Basically only the Drums go through the Sub (maybe a bit of bass should the need arise.) And yep, I know bass is omnidirectional, so it doesn't theoretically matter but I guarantee the drummer will hear more kick drum via the sub if he's sitting next to it (as will I!). So i guess his mics will too ....... If anyone has practical experience of doing this and would like to share that would be really helpful. Cheers.

Hi Mike, Is popping down to Classic and Cool Guitars in Teignmouth an option? Mark seems to have 3 TT's (and a VT) there at the moment and it might help eliminate the active option (or not) and let you try out the weight? He's really helpful and has some well priced examples. I bought my customised VM4 from him and tried a TT Superlight there more recently (and it was very impressive - luckily he sold it before I could buy another expensive bass I really don;t warrant!!)!!). Good luck,

Do tell, how was rehearsal?

Yep - simple and inexpensive ("used") mixer eg Soundcraft Signature (or Behringer??) is probably all you need. Some have built in FX's which is really handy, and you might want to think about how many monitor mixes (Aux outs) you need. (sounds daft, but with In Ear Monitors you soon find you need more than you think!). However, if you buy a second hand unit you won't really lose anything if you in future decide you need more Aux outs. We started out a couple of years back in your situation and have evolved since then. My biggest "win" was adding a single Sub. Even in small venues this makes a surprisingly big difference to the sound. And even in small pubs, as the PA speaker Top sits above it it has minimal effect on space requirements - indeed it helps to stop the PA getting knocked over when things get "lively"!! I thought 10 inch tops would be ideal in terms of size in small pubs and transport, but if I started again, I'd go straight to 12inch main speakers, as they cope with bigger gigs too. Good luck!!

Doh ........ still need to check out all the aforementioned basses, but used my Ashdown ABM 600 at Friday's big gig. Sorted! GAS almost evaporated, not only on guitar front, but also amp front ...... might still be looking at some complementary speakers ....... single cab , 2 x 12, light and very loud ............ ☺️

Yep - I did confess to Dave that I had a boxful of broken leads awaiting my feeble soldering skills - he just said .... "pop 'em in - I'll fix them for you" . Almost worth the 300 mile trip😊.

A bit of positive feedback on a miserable Sunday ...... ABM 600Evo IV just back from Dave at Ashdown to check out a "hypothetical" buzz. Disassembled/reassembled/soak tested - nothing wrong, amp in perfect nick. "Check your leads" was Dave's advice! The amps been a back-up for a while but I used it at an important gig on Friday. We weren't that loud (although the venue turned off the sound limiter equipment after the first song!!) and it was barely ticking over. I'd forgotten just how good it is - lots of positive comments and I was able to dial out the slightly mid-forward" tone my bass is prone too for the first time in ages. So - big call out for Ashdown and Dave in particular - FANTASTIC customer support and happy owner.(my other amp will find it's way onto the "for sale" listings shortly!!)

Yep .... I concur ....... the sound is a bit mid forward and, like you, I slightly favour the P Pickup for most "songs". Usually (as evidenced by wear on the P Pup cover) my right hand "rests" just to the neck side of the PPup.

Thanks TRBboy. AlnicoV pickups! Well that's interesting. So, not Delano and not Blacklabel? The Sandberg shop is closed until Jan29th (and I'm not sure they export to the UK these days) .... but if that worked then that would be ideal as I really like everything else about the bass!!! 👍

Yep - I have Blacklabel's in my VM4 ..... but still a bit "mid honk" for me ...... probably need an EQ tweak to my lug holes!!