Al Krow

Three Kens in a den!

Yes. But early days. Ask me again in a few months... In the meantime, you're clearly on the verge of getting another Stomp or Native yourself, I can tell!

If you check out the Zoom B1X-4 / B3n patch idea thread you can see that the basic ToneLib layout is very intuitive for each individual effect, with ready embedded software explanations on hand for each parameter. Add easy drag and drop features and you have something that provides a really 'accessible' and easy workflow - that makes creating and editing patches both a doddle and a lot of fun. It's just such a darned shame that Zoom are limiting their offering to the sub £130 multfx budget end of the market. If they would iron out a few minor niggles (eg low level 'digital noise' underneath the notes) and add a little more capability / DSP, I'm sure there are many Zoom fanboys (and girls!) who would readily part with another £45 to £70 on top. I'm sure with time I may come to view the Helix interface similarly. But not necessarily. You will have seen Jimfist's much more articulate post on why he is much happier with the Zoom interface than that of much more capable multifx, due to the easier workflow. And he is someone who has spent many many hours tweaking multifx pedals over many years.

If you check out the Zoom B1X-4 / B3n patch idea thread you can see that the basic ToneLib layout is very intuitive for each individual effect, with ready embedded software explanations on hand for each parameter. Add easy drag and drop features and you have something that provides a really 'accessible' and easy workflow - that makes creating and editing patches both a doddle and a lot of fun. It's just such a darned shame that Zoom are limiting their offering to the sub £130 multfx budget end of the market. If they would iron out a few minor niggles (eg low level 'digital noise' underneath the notes) and add a little more capability / DSP, I'm sure there are many Zoom fanboys (and girls!) who would readily part with another £45 to £70 on top. I'm sure with time I may come to view the Helix interface similarly. But not necessarily. You will have seen Jimfist's much more articulate post on why he is much happier with the Zoom interface than that of much more capable multifx, due to the easier workflow. And he is someone who has spent many many hours tweaking multifx pedals over many years.

So far no question that ToneLib (for Zoom) knocks HX Edit out the park for ease of use. But maybe that view will change as I spend more time with HX Edit.

Thanks Woody. The above are two very relevant points, from my perspective. The first i.e. not using a PC in rehearsals or gigs and using actual pedals at home is exactly where I am coming from, which would indicate "no" to Native. However if you are also saying that Native can take the place of our existing DAWs eg Ableton or Reaper then that's something I, for one, wasn't aware of and would change my view of its usefulness (to me, anyway) entirely.

Slightly amusing that we're having this discussion when you don't have a Stomp and I don't have Native: clearly two real experts on their overlap then! 😂 We should have @CameronJ jumping in, who has both. Apologies if my use of language was less than precise - not the first or likely the last time, I'm sure! It's the operational workflow that is the only real interest point for me and their similarities in this respect is what I was trying to get across, and also why I don't feel any particular need to get Native as a bolt on to my Stomp & HX Edit. Of course, if Native is going to be useful for what someone is doing, then they absolutely should go for it.

Oooh you have a Gibson 335 😍

Did you get some steel shoulder implants by any chance? I hear they were all the rage in the 70s with the advent of metal.

Ah, in which case I now totally understand why your 425 is your favourite bass of the lot! 😂

@krispn - nope not my point at all that you can't edit the Stomp on the fly, of course you can! My point was simply that I prefer to edit multifx patches (on Zoom and now Helix) using a decent PC editor. ToneLib transformed my workflow with my Zoom multis. So I will be using HX Edit with my Stomp and I'm happy with that decision. If folk want to get Native on top, please don't let me stand in your way. @Woodinblack my linking of the Native and Helix is based on this article I came across which was very helpful: https://www.soundonsound.com/reviews/line-6-helix-native In it they made a comment: "Operationally, Native and HX Edit are very similar, with the obvious technical differences that Helix Native is both editor and processor, and works as a plug-in within your DAW host, while HX Edit is just an editor and functions as a stand-alone piece of software."

Plenty of us think many things are a good idea. Be interesting how many of this "vast" army of bass players you refer to actually get a Stomp + Native, given that there is quite a significant proportion who don't think the less featured HX Edit is worth bothering with, as they prefer to be able to edit patches on the fly. It may well be a useful addition, but I'm certainly not going to get religion about it either way. I thought krispn summed up its value to some bass players well in his earlier post.

Nothing wrong with great gear, but you don't need a fancy bass to be inspired to make great music. You can take away ALL my fancy gear, and leave me with 'just' a £200 used Yamaha BB 425. I will still love playing bass with my band.

Or you could just listen to Carol Kaye playing some of her amazing bass lines for an hour? Won't cost you a penny and in terms of inspiration...

I managed to get up close and personal to a KS BT 5er today. I'm completely blown away by the quality of the workmanship and have to admit to feeling more than a little jaw dropping 'wow', right now!

Found myself at BD today, albeit not for as long as I would have liked, and had a brief chance to try out the Mesa WD-800 through a couple of VK 112s. It's a pretty capable amp - I particularly liked being able to boost the bass whilst engaging the HPF. You could really see / hear / feel the HPF doing it's thing with significant cut when set at 125hz but much more marginal when engaged at 25hz. The combination of amp and cabs was crisp and articulate. I would need to spend a bit more time with it before having something more in depth to report but first impressions were good and I suspect more time would only confirm that view! Interestingly Mark was gobsmacked when I pointed out that these are available at $999 retail in the US. He messaged Westside whilst I was there to find out why he can buy more cheaply from a US distributor than he can from them! Like us, he would have expected these to be priced to allow a £999 retail price in the UK allowing for VAT, Customs and transport.

@JohnDaBass with pleasure. My B1X-4 is actually in my gig bag with my drummer who took a whole bunch of stuff for us following our last gig as I had to stay behind with PA and get an Uber! So it's going to be a few days before I get hold of the pedal again. But in the meantime worth noting that I have not set volume and gain in a particularly scientific manner - just balanced volume and gain so that the overall volume effect is neutral compared to by-pass.

You're welcome to borrow my 1025 Dave (and you're right it's not for sale!). Love my 1025 but the P35, for me anyway, is better still. Make sure to play your P34 through a rig, not just headphones this weekend though!

I have to agree with you that the 425 is one of the punchiest basses around! I also very much agree that the P34 / P35 are really nicely weighted and balanced which makes them a pleasure to 'wear' and play. In terms of tone I'd say that: BB 425 pups = flatter, more kick BB 1025 / P35 pups => more complex overtones, less kick / more 'civilised' than the 425 (but certainly not 'polite' in the sense that the Delanos on my Berg were 'polite'). The 1025 / P35 can both produce a tasty growl when you dig in! Looking forward to getting your thoughts when you've got a set of strings on that you really like and have A/B'd both basses through a quality rig.

@krispn You've exactly nailed it, mate.

Looks like we Stomp owners are going to be splitting into brainers and no-brainers then. Guess that makes me a brainer? 😂

It's kinda interesting to see Boss move away from their iconic "Boss pedal" housing.

Does look good. But at that size could have maybe included an hpf & lpf to provide a 'killer' product.

A huge number of Fender basses for sale on all bass forums, when taken together => must be a really shite brand right? There is not one single Yamaha BB 1025 for sale in the whole of the UK currently** on any bass forum => clearly this must the very best bass available today!! But obviously neither statement is correct. ** if there is, please shout - as there's a queue on the Yammy BB thread for one!

Sold Dave my MS-60B pedal. Very smooth transaction, good comms throughout and a pleasure to deal with. Enjoy the pedal! Bas