peteb

[quote name='Bilbo' timestamp='1336035455' post='1639683'] I just want to stress that reading music is not just about reading music on gigs/sessions. Its a great way of learning about the mechanics of music. Learning parts by rote has its place but understanding notation is a massively useful skill when you are working with lots of different people. Writing ideas down becomes easier, studying other pieces of music like solos by other players, understanding theory and harmony, explaining intervals etc. Of course you can get by without it and millions do. You can also undo a screw with a butter knife at a pinch but why would you want to? [/quote] I would suggest that developing a good ear is far more important....

[quote name='Bilbo' timestamp='1336035455' post='1639683'] You have played with these guys but they are the ones who play music for a living and have done tours, played on sessions (records, TV themes, adverts, etc.) [/quote] You seem to doubt me sir! The chap that I am particularly referring to is a very good keyboard player that I had the pleasure of playing quite a lot of gigs with last year, and who has on his CV a long stint touring the world with a 60s singer who is a genuine household name (he also played with a 70s pop singer who is pretty well known) and who worked in a studio and has a number of TV themes, ads, etc. to his credit. It is always good to play with good players, not least because you can learn a lot from them. And one of the things that I learned from him is that he seemed to place great value on having a good ear! I would guess that he may be able to read music because of some of the work that he has done in the past, but I certainly saw no evidence of it….!

This old chestnut again! If someone asks me to do a dep with songs that I don’t know, the first thing I do is pull up the tabs and then check them against the originals on YouTube, just because it saves time and tabs will give you a starter for ten! Many tabs on the net are not very good, but surely it doesn’t matter if a poorly transcribed piece is tab or dots? As far as I understand, tab for stringed instruments actually pre dates notation, which I always think of as tab for instruments where you can only play a note in one position (such as a keyboard). Both have their limitations; mainly that it is more difficult to show note length in tab, whereas notation can get very messy once you go too far off the stave. If a guitar player wants to learn ‘Eruption’ by Eddie Van Halen, then a standard notation transcription will be worse than useless but a decent tab could be very helpful…… In over 30 years of playing in bands I have [b]never[/b] been presented with a piece of written music (or tab for that matter but I have played dep gigs with chord sheets). I should point out that I have played with plenty of guys who play music for a living and have done tours, played on sessions (records, TV themes, adverts, etc.). I assume that most of them can read, but the subject has never come up when I have played with them in a band situation. If you want to play pit gigs then reading dots is obviously a necessity……

3-1-4 for me usually, pivot with your thumb to move from the 3rd to the 5th Obviously depends on the passage you're playing though.....

He has has also got quite a fascinating story for the film to call on, so it could cross over to the mainstream and appeal to people who have never heard of him! People are always fascinated by the best in any particular field and when you can throw in a rags to riches story with a tragic ending there is always a chance of it catching the imagination of a wider audience....

[quote name='Gust0o' timestamp='1335803930' post='1636281'] Anyway, f*** off about cover bands you - that looks like a wedding picture! Congratulations! [/quote] Yep, it is indeed - many thanks!

[quote name='Gust0o' timestamp='1335713166' post='1634863'] What I'm drawing for this entire thread, is that there's a lot more [i]crap[/i] - for want of a better term - associated with joining a covers band, than there has ever been, from my experience, in joining an originals band. [/quote] Actually Gus, in my experience quite the opposite - less egos involved in covers bands generally!

The white pearl looks good to me!

[quote name='jakenewmanbass' timestamp='1334573985' post='1617731'] Thanks!!, it makes a refreshing change to hear that attitude, musicians are either seriously undervalued or paid vast sums in our little corner of the worlds music market, I've been lucky to have a regular gig and a decent amount of freelance work, for most of my working life. If you're lucky enough to have a good balance between a day job and gigging then charge professional rates I say and get the value from your skills and a serious bonus to your annual, as I said earlier, other industries are not shy about charging, and life in the UK is expensive. [/quote] Whilst I appreciate your sentiments, I think that is important take into account what the market is (both for your act and more importantly the venue / promoter or whatever) and to have some sort of a business plan in mind for what you want to do! If you are mainly playing pubs or similar places you should bear in mind that there is a recession on in all but name, not to mention the smoking ban, etc and charge accordingly. A few years ago I was in a covers band that did pretty well, but we were prepared to lower our prices when things got tough for landlords. Remember that you always want the landlord / promoter to make money otherwise they won't bother putting live music on in the future. If they do well when you play they might not panic too much when they next lose £50 on a decent band that haven't played the venue before, just the same as you hope that someone will take a punt and put your band on in a town that you haven't played before! By the same token, you do not want to play for less than the market rate as, if nothing else, the venue will inevitably undervalue you and not bother to do any promotion for the gig if they have nothing much at stake!

[color=#222222]Yet another van story while I think of it, concerning a mate of mine who is a singer with a kind of sleazy charm that seems to be irresistible to a certain type of female![/color] [color=#222222]He was doing a gig in a WM club with his band in South Yorkshire somewhere, having taken the woman he was living with at the time and who happens to be the mother of (two of) his children. At the gig he meets a young lady who seems very friendly and is intimating that she would like to be even friendlier! In order to oblige, he sneaks her out to the hire van that they are using for the gig where they enjoy a brief, but undoubtedly very romantic assignation.[/color] [color=#222222]He then starts to worry that he has been missing for a while and that his missus may be wondering where he is. So he sends the girl back to the bar and gets in the hire van and intentionally crashes it into an archway, causing it very minor damage. He then goes back into the club saying “lads, I was just moving the van and I’ve crashed it into the archway”. They go outside to inspect the damage, moaning about his driving and how accident prone he is – thus alerting his partner’s suspicions that he has been up to no good (again)…..[/color]

[quote name='WalMan' timestamp='1334697335' post='1620038'] Slightly more recently he was stopped in a smaller van with the PA in it by an excitable young constable and his puppy walker. "Have you been drinking?" "Only water all night" "Well in that case I require you to take a roadside narcotics test" Puppy walker stood on the passenger side raises his eyebrows. "Why?" Response from the puppy was to the effect "You look dozy" which was greated by cries of "HE ALWAYS LOOKS LIKE THAT!" from the rest of the van & puppy walker telling us to sod off before putting the leash on his charge [/quote] [color=#222222]Last year we were coming back from a blues festival in a very smart part of Cheshire in an old van borrowed from one of the band leader’s mates in Halifax when we were stopped at 2o’clock in the morning by what must be the politest policeman I’ve ever met![/color] [color=#222222][font="Times New Roman"][size="3"] [/size][/font][/color] [color=#222222]Once he had satisfied himself that we were not on the way to rob Wayne Rooney’s house he sent us on our way having apologised for keeping us from our beds, not commenting that we had the keyboard player sat on my bass cab in the back (thereby no seat, yet alone seatbelt), a knackered van that must have had something wrong with it if you looked hard enough, or that we had a couple of open bottles of beer. Come to think of it, not even a suggestion of a breathalyser (Paddy was driving and had drunk two bottles of this local strawberry beer that the landlord had been giving us all day – completely sober but most coppers would have still have had a go at getting a result on a breathalyser)[/color] [color=#222222][font="Times New Roman"][size="3"] [/size][/font][/color] [color=#222222]Nope, just apologies and wishing us a speedy journey home. If only all policemen were like that….!![/color]

[quote name='thisnameistaken' timestamp='1334689411' post='1619881'] I think you win the thread. [/quote] I fear I don't do the story justice! You ought to hear them tell it - hilarious! Your trip across America was pretty cool......

Despite spending much of the 80s travelling up and down the country in the back of a transit, I haven’t got too many good stories apart from the time that the singer mistakenly topped up the petrol tank with water, which made for an interesting journey home! The best van stories I have are secondhand and happened to various mates. A guy that I used to share a house with, along with a few other mates played at various times in a pro showband, travelling up and down the country playing workingmans clubs and army bases, etc back in the days when you could make a living doing so. To amuse themselves on the long trips they used to always take a shotgun along, so that they could take potshots at passing motorway signs at 3 o’clock in the morning, etc. They used to have a roadie who always drove, chainsmoking and continually dropping ash in to an overflowing ashtray, which he kept by his side next to the handbrake. The guitar player thought that it would be a rather jolly idea to remove the ash from his ashtray, empty a shotgun cartridge into it and then refill with ash! Once they got on the motorway he lit a cigarette, whilst everyone in the back seats of the van waiting with bated breath to see what happened. Apparently it didn’t go off immediately, but halfway home he managed to stub out a cig on the gunpowder, which of course exploded, filling the cab with smoke causing him to veer onto the hard shoulder at 70mph, nearly crashing the van with all the other occupants in hysterics……

[quote name='skankdelvar' timestamp='1334505865' post='1616946'] Competence, feel and technique aside, I think I'd rather be in a band with Mr Peart than the frankly unhinged Mr Bonham. Bit too high-maintenance for me. [/quote] Dunno - old Neil doesn't exactly strike me as a barrel full of laughs.....

[quote name='Davo-London' timestamp='1334415519' post='1615949'] Bonham has an incredible following amongst pro drummers. Peart doesn't. Davo [/quote] To be fair, Peart has influenced plenty of drummers - just not as many as Bonham...!

It may be that there will be digital profiling / modelling amps on the market that are as good as the real thing. I haven't heard one yet, but it could be just around the corner. You will know that they have arrived when the likes of Steve Lukather, Philip Sayce, Steve Morse, etc start using them without being paid shed loads of money in endorsements!

[quote name='silddx' timestamp='1334402458' post='1615683'] I had a valve Fender Twin, and a bunch of expensive effects. The POD is way more versatile and reliable, portable, powerful, etc. But the fact is, I LOVE the sounds I get from from it. It really is that simple. I don't need to justify anything other than that. You are clutching at straws Pete. I do understand why people are distrustful of new technology, however. [/quote] I don't think that I am clutching at straws nor am I distrustful of new technology. I remember the days when we used to go out with a van full of really big and heavy PA gear that you piled up to the ceiling. Now, you can get better results from a powered 1x10 cab each side and one 1x12 sub. I have no wish to go back to using a ton of outmoded gear when the newer lighter kit is better. I often gig with a mark bass head these days - it is not quite as good as my mesa boogie, but it is still a great amp and a hell of a lot lighter! Whatever, people should use whatever works best for them (compromise or not). All I can say is that in my world of loud guitars and Bonham worshiping drummers - modelling amps just do not cut it! Lots of guys have tried to use Line 6 amps, etc but they all seem to get rid of them pretty quickly, must be a reason for that.....

[color=#222222]It seems to me that there is an awful lot of justification going in this thread. For example, Silldx mentioned that the engineer at a recording session didn’t use the best mic to record the vocalist so that he could get a better live performance by allowing her to play her keyboard at the same time. His mate then piles in and says this was, in fact, an inspired choice and gave some spurious reason that her voice is somehow better suited to the lesser mic. This, of course, is b0110cks – the engineer was forced to compromise and didn’t use the better mic for practical reasons.[/color] [color=#222222][font="Times New Roman"][size="3"] [/size][/font][/color] [color=#222222]If you are trying to get to gigs on public transport or you have a hairdresser’s car that you can’t carry any gear in, then a pod seems a practical solution, as is carrying one bass in a gigbag. If you then work out how to get the best out of it you may then manage convince yourself that you got the pod because it is better than the amp it attempts to imitate, rather than the real reason, which is that you didn’t want to have to lug a heavy amp around![/color] [color=#222222][font="Times New Roman"][size="3"] [/size][/font][/color]

[quote name='dmccombe7' timestamp='1334328940' post='1614706'] Maybe a blessing in disguise in a round about sort of way. If he gets an endorsement that'll be a nice bonus and lift his spirits a bit. [/quote] It would take more than some gear being stolen to dampen Paddy's spirits for long, always a silver lining - the most upbeat guy that I've ever met! Gets a bit annoying at times...!

[quote name='ThomBassmonkey' timestamp='1334326099' post='1614616'] I'm joining this party a bit late, but I've done various sessions (live and studio) with modelling and various amps (guitar and bass) and I don't like modelling. IMO it's like buying a corsa then putting a ferrari body on it and saying it's just as good as the real thing. All of the manipulation that happens inside modelling units is manipulation, it's not "natural" sounds. The biggest problem for me is that live, high gain sounds never fit in the mix properly, they seem to behave like scooped tones where they can sound great on their own but when they go into a mix they disappear. The same thing happens in the studio but the engineer obviously has a lot more control over the sound, there's layers etc. Given the choice between amp or modelling, it's a no brainer for me. Modelling for clean tones is better than modelling for distortions, generally clean modelling is pretty good nowadays, it's still not as good as a decent amp though IMO. If you want a variety of sounds and/or can't take an amp to gigs (e.g. you don't have a car and rely on public transport) then modelling is a good solution. If you're in a studio and people always turn up with crap amps then having modelling software rather than spending thousands on amps then having to store them, modelling is a good solution. That's all it is to me currently though, a solution, I just don't think they match up to a real amp if you have that option available. [/quote] Exactly, you have just articulated what I have been trying to say - great post...!

[quote name='dmccombe7' timestamp='1334317981' post='1614372'] My worst nightmare !!! No words can explain feelings on this one but hopefully the gear is still ok and that maybe someone will know who the scum was. Hope all is well All the very best Dave [/quote] Cheers Dave Obviously it seems like a big thing at the time and it p155es you off but no one died and all it costs is a bit of money and inconvenience so you have to put it in a bit of prospective. Still, great to get it back - luck of the Irish eh...! Funnily enough, he's just arranged to buy another amp, even going as far as negotiating an "endorsement deal" to get it a bit cheaper. Dunno what he will do now??

[quote name='silddx' timestamp='1334317085' post='1614350'] We recorded live, in the studio mate In the same room, stage set up, no separation. No overdubs. no fixes (except one two bar section for me where I played the most rancid, foetid note I have ever set finger on). [/quote] But I assume that you were not playing in a large room thru a PA with an audience present?? The music you produced went straight to disk where it could be manipulated by the engineer. I recognise the playing the rancid, foetid note bit - I used to hate recording studios!

[quote name='charic' timestamp='1334316122' post='1614322'] As before, sound = sound. Bar various mic'ing techniques (which can obviously be discounted ) and double tracking what you can do in the studio you can do live [/quote] Sorry but you're wrong! For example, in a studio you could (if you wish) put a guitar amp in a separate room and record three or more strategicly spaced mics whereas live you will just close mic the edge of the speaker. Live you cannot isolate instruments like you can in a studio, you will have a guitar cab next to a noisy drum kit and the sound is going out of a big PA rather than straight to disk.

Latest news - police have just found Paddy's gear dumped in Ovenden! No idea what condition it is in but great news.......

[quote name='charic' timestamp='1334315601' post='1614303'] But if it can sound as good or better recorded then it can sound as good or better live. Sound is sound, whether it is on a disc or a PA system live [/quote] Recording in a studio and live are two completely different things