Nortski Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 Hi all, any advice offered for a gigging virgin? I've just started rehearsals with my first band and am desperate to get a good sound out of my Markbass CMD 102p Head II combo. I spent ages getting a sound I liked in my flat, at low volume, but surprise surprise after cranking it up in the local club all my tone vanished and it just sounded pig awful. Forget about the fact that it's DI'ed through the PA, the actual sound coming from my amp is quite disheartning. I really know little about EQing principles, are there any basic concepts I need to be aware of, such as "never have the gain past ##o'clock etc? Now I know that my amp should be quite capable of producing a great sound, for £1100 I would hope so anyway, it's just trying to get it! Any advice would be greatly appreciated. Nortski. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Musicman20 Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 Keep the EQ flat first, and experiment with the two end knobs....VLE and VPF. I always seem to end up leaving the EQ. What bass are you using? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hamster Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 [quote name='Nortski' post='622141' date='Oct 9 2009, 11:13 PM']Hi all, any advice offered for a gigging virgin? I've just started rehearsals with my first band and am desperate to get a good sound out of my Markbass CMD 102p Head II combo. I spent ages getting a sound I liked in my flat, at low volume, but surprise surprise after cranking it up in the local club all my tone vanished and it just sounded pig awful. Forget about the fact that it's DI'ed through the PA, the actual sound coming from my amp is quite disheartning. I really know little about EQing principles, are there any basic concepts I need to be aware of, such as "never have the gain past ##o'clock etc? Now I know that my amp should be quite capable of producing a great sound, for £1100 I would hope so anyway, it's just trying to get it! Any advice would be greatly appreciated. Nortski.[/quote] If you're anywhere near Surrey, there's a Bass Bash tomorrow 10 October with a 'seminar' on tone and acoustics you might find useful? See the link in my sig Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Foxen Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 If you crank it up and lose your sound, could be your speaker disagreeing with being cranked, also, the room is different, which will change the tone. You'll have to learn to eq your amp to the room, and try and get your tone from bass and fingers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fraktal Posted October 10, 2009 Share Posted October 10, 2009 The VPF filter is VERY dangerous. I have a combo like yours and always leave the VPF at minimum. After all, 10" speakers are only efficient when dealing with mid frequencies, and the VPF filter removes precisely those frequencies. Also, when playing with a drummer you are gonna need much more mids and highs than you would like to hear when playing alone. Forget about the settings you liked at your flat, and build a new tone WHILE playing with the drummer/drum samples/whatever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZMech Posted October 10, 2009 Share Posted October 10, 2009 i had a similar issue a couple of months ago, so after doing some research I wrote this EQing guide in the wiki: [url="http://wiki.basschat.co.uk/info:tips_and_tricks"]http://wiki.basschat.co.uk/info:tips_and_tricks[/url] not sure how useful you'll find it but it might make a good starting point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tischbein Posted October 10, 2009 Share Posted October 10, 2009 [quote name='Fraktal' post='622233' date='Oct 10 2009, 08:58 AM']The VPF filter is VERY dangerous. I have a combo like yours and always leave the VPF at minimum. After all, 10" speakers are only efficient when dealing with mid frequencies, and the VPF filter removes precisely those frequencies. Also, when playing with a drummer you are gonna need much more mids and highs than you would like to hear when playing alone. Forget about the settings you liked at your flat, and build a new tone WHILE playing with the drummer/drum samples/whatever.[/quote] Perfect 10 explanation... the sound in a band mix is TOTALLY different than living room playing.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.T Posted October 10, 2009 Share Posted October 10, 2009 Start with everything totally flat and tweak from there..... if needed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.T Posted October 10, 2009 Share Posted October 10, 2009 Also... I think that if the sound you are getting, with the amp and bass set completely flat, is not even in the right ballpark you might have the wrong kit (for you). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thumperbob 2002 Posted October 10, 2009 Share Posted October 10, 2009 yeah I would leave the amp flat and concentrate on the bass and fingers- by far the two most important factors- find out exactly what the individual pickups sound like- different plucking location- bridge- neck- you should really only touch the volume knob- though you may need to tweak slightly depending upon the room - but only small adjustments- takes months to really find out what a bass wil do / sounds like. Always viewed the amp as a tool used to simply amplify the bass signal. Do not try to boost either the bass or treble frequencies- concentrate on the mid range. Bob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris_b Posted October 10, 2009 Share Posted October 10, 2009 [quote name='Nortski' post='622141' date='Oct 9 2009, 11:13 PM']....I've just started rehearsals with my first band and am desperate to get a good sound out of my Markbass CMD 102p Head II combo. I spent ages getting a sound I liked in my flat, at low volume, but surprise surprise after cranking it up in the local club all my tone vanished and it just sounded pig awful. Forget about the fact that it's DI'ed through the PA, the actual sound coming from my amp is quite disheartning.[/quote] In my experience, I've got an LM2 and I set the controls on 12 o'clock and the VP/VL things off. I find that the volume doesn't affect the tone that much and any minor adjustments are fine managed from the controls on the bass. I don't make extreme changes to the EQ on any of my amps. Small changes should be enough. What kind of music are you playing? How loud? Live playing is an altogether different thing to bedroom playing. Was the sound coming through the PA ok? If it was then are you in the fold back? Are you hitting the strings a lot harder when you're playing with the band? There are a lot of variables that can be causing your problem! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Foxen Posted October 10, 2009 Share Posted October 10, 2009 [quote name='Fraktal' post='622233' date='Oct 10 2009, 07:58 AM']After all, 10" speakers are only efficient when dealing with mid frequencies[/quote] Not true. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Academy Posted October 10, 2009 Share Posted October 10, 2009 You need to get out of the guitar player's frequencies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fraktal Posted October 10, 2009 Share Posted October 10, 2009 [quote name='Mr. Foxen' post='622345' date='Oct 10 2009, 12:29 PM']Not true.[/quote] Well, then, can you explain us why there are 21" and bigger speakers built with the purpose of handling low frequencies? And the same applies to 1" and smaller high frequency drivers. Surely if 10" speakers were efficient at handling low and high frequency content, those other speaker sizes wouldn't exist? A 10" speaker is inherently a mid frequency driver. Can it play lows? Sure. Can it play highs? Of course. Can it do efficiently? I dont think so, just check their frequency response curve. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTUK Posted October 10, 2009 Share Posted October 10, 2009 you should have no problem getting a good sound out of the combo... and if it sounds good at low volumes then you know that the key components work ok...ie the bass sounds good at some point. I like a bright-ish sound so if your strings are a bit off, then just turning up the volumes can introduce all sorts of nasties.. I'd start with the sound you have at home... as a reference..and just tweak the controls if you think something is lacking or too pronounced. These filters can be pretty powerful so use very sparingly.. I'd mildy boast/cut one freq, and then see how it stacks up in a mix... You may have alot of work to do to find what works and suits..sometimes there is no easy way around this..it can take some working out Plug in and play is not so easy to achieve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexclaber Posted October 10, 2009 Share Posted October 10, 2009 [quote name='Fraktal' post='622431' date='Oct 10 2009, 01:54 PM']A 10" speaker is inherently a mid frequency driver.[/quote] No it isn't. Look at the T/S parameters to determine its best usage. Alex Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexclaber Posted October 10, 2009 Share Posted October 10, 2009 [quote name='Fraktal' post='622431' date='Oct 10 2009, 01:54 PM']Well, then, can you explain us why there are 21" and bigger speakers built with the purpose of handling low frequencies? And the same applies to 1" and smaller high frequency drivers. Surely if 10" speakers were efficient at handling low and high frequency content, those other speaker sizes wouldn't exist?[/quote] Different speaker sizes exist to give different dispersion/power handling/sensitivity/box size/frequency response/cost/etc. There is also a historical legacy in what's sold, as well as marketing led decisions. Alex Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nortski Posted October 11, 2009 Author Share Posted October 11, 2009 Thanks guys, this is all hugely helpful. It's given me a lot to chew on! Think I'll start from scratch and flaten my tone, new set of strings etc and work fom there. Probable should've done that anyway! Of course, any more suggestions will be gratefully received! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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