Please recommend a wireless adaptor for stage mic

[Al Krow]

Our singer has just upgraded her Shure SM58 to an AKG D7S which provides much better directionality and lower feedback.

 

She would like to add a really good wireless adaptor which is hopefully not massively expensive. What would you recommend?

[JPJ]

The only one I’ve had any experience with is the Xvive U3, which worked perfectly and played nicely with two Xvive IEM systems but is £170 so might be considered pricey. 

[Al Krow]

Looking for low latency too and analogue UHF adaptors seem to claim very low latencies, despite being very budget. Is that correct? 

 

[JPJ]

As I understand it, Yes analogue should always be lower latency as there is no analogue to digital followed by digital to analogue conversion, but there’s then the issue of legal frequency and the old picking up the passing taxi if you’re on the same wavelength. 

[Phil Starr]

4 hours ago, Al Krow said:

Looking for low latency too and analogue UHF adaptors seem to claim very low latencies, despite being very budget. Is that correct? 

 

Hi Al, I would go back to @EBS_freak's in ears bible. All of the analogue vs digital radio connection issues are discussed there. The problem with analogue is the companders. Poor quality UHF systems degrade the sound quality so that is the problem rather than latency.

[Dan Dare]

AKG, Sennheiser, Shure and others offer wireless adaptors. Not the cheapest, but you can be certain they will do the job - see Phil's comments above. Avoid 50 quid Chinese no-name jobbies. Buy once, cry once.

Edited 8 hours ago by Dan Dare

[Chienmortbb]

You have to consider the system as a whole, with today's digital equipment there are delays, latency, propagation delay caused by both ADDA conversion and the finite time that the signal passes through the digital stages, each gate that the signal passes through causes a delay by any other name as transistors, the basic building blocks, cannot switch instantly.  These delays happen in digital pedals, mixers, digital wireless systems for instruments and IEMs. The amount of latency that you can hear varies between people, and some chain to be able to hear 2mS. The is ballcocks, it is equivalent to one cycle at 5Hz. 

 

So latency adds any one component does not usually add an excessive amount. Analogue, as @Phil Starr says, has a compander, really a compressor, at the input and an expander at the output. This compresses the signal as it goes in to enable more channels to be used, and expends it as exactly as it can at the other end to rebuild the original system. Most analogue systems use UHF bands and frequency modulation FM.

 

In most cases, the better the design, the better the end result. There are really two rules of thumb before you buy anything wireless. Do not buy anything on the UHF 863-865MHz band, and do not buy anything in the 2.4GHz band. 

 

Finally, do not listen to Scott Uhl on YouTube. The rules in the USA are very different, and most of the UHF systems he recommends are illegal in the UK.

[Al Krow]

56 minutes ago, Dan Dare said:

AKG, Sennheiser, Shure and others offer wireless adaptors. Not the cheapest, but you can be certain they will do the job - see Phil's comments above. Avoid 50 quid Chinese no-name jobbies. Buy once, cry once.

 

Hey Dan - don't be so quick to put down Chinese manufacturing! You do realise that the incredibly good value Behringer Bugera Veyron amps, which you and I both think are fab, are made in China? As well as, of course, some of the world's highest-end products such Apple iPhones?! They have just figured out how to do manufacturing really well. Apple have basically said they won't shift production back to the US because of the lack of skills there and fact that to make something of the same quality it would turn a $1k iphone into a $3k handset for the exact same product. They're very happy to pay the Chinese workforce less and keep the bulk of the profits for themselves in, err well actually, Ireland where they pay little or no tax...

 

Shure IEMs are widely regarded as overpriced (just head over to the IEM thread) and you'll find a LOT of BC'ers, including me, loving their KZ IEMs as being both better kit and considerably better value... and they're also made in China. And don't get me started on battery technology...

[Al Krow]

27 minutes ago, Chienmortbb said:

You have to consider the system as a whole, with today's digital equipment there are delays, latency, propagation delay caused by both ADDA conversion and the finite time that the signal passes through the digital stages, each gate that the signal passes through causes a delay by any other name as transistors, the basic building blocks, cannot switch instantly.  These delays happen in digital pedals, mixers, digital wireless systems for instruments and IEMs. The amount of latency that you can hear varies between people, and some chain to be able to hear 2mS. The is ballcocks, it is equivalent to one cycle at 5Hz. 

 

So latency adds any one component does not usually add an excessive amount. Analogue, as @Phil Starr says, has a compander, really a compressor, at the input and an expander at the output. This compresses the signal as it goes in to enable more channels to be used, and expends it as exactly as it can at the other end to rebuild the original system. Most analogue systems use UHF bands and frequency modulation FM.

 

In most cases, the better the design, the better the end result. There are really two rules of thumb before you buy anything wireless. Do not buy anything on the UHF 863-865MHz band, and do not buy anything in the 2.4GHz band. 

 

Finally, do not listen to Scott Uhl on YouTube. The rules in the USA are very different, and most of the UHF systems he recommends are illegal in the UK.

 

That is super helpful thank you. Singer started out with the Gear4Music SubZero UHF Wireless XLR (863–865 MHz Ch. 70) - so we will take that off the list! I had already suggested going for 5.8Ghz and avoiding 2.4 GHz.

Just as a rule of thumb it would be great to get a wireless bolt-on that comes to no more than 2/3 the price she is investing in the microphone itself, in terms of the incremental benefit of the wireless vs wired to her performance on stage, so that would suggest a budget of around £100.

 

Currently the JOYO 5.8 GHz looks like a decent contender that seems to tick quite a few boxes? If anyone has experience of this or similar, please do share. 

[Dan Dare]

1 hour ago, Al Krow said:

 

Hey Dan - don't be so quick to put down Chinese manufacturing! You do realise that the incredibly good value Behringer Bugera Veyron amps, which you and I both think are fab, are made in China? As well as, of course, some of the world's highest-end products such Apple iPhones?! They have just figured out how to do manufacturing really well. Apple have basically said they won't shift production back to the US because of the lack of skills there and fact that to make something of the same quality it would turn a $1k iphone into a $3k handset for the exact same product. They're very happy to pay the Chinese workforce less and keep the bulk of the profits for themselves in, err well actually, Ireland where they pay little or no tax...

 

Shure IEMs are widely regarded as overpriced (just head over to the IEM thread) and you'll find a LOT of BC'ers, including me, loving their KZ IEMs as being both better kit and considerably better value... and they're also made in China. And don't get me started on battery technology...

 

I'm not putting down Chinese manufacturing per se, just the cheap and nasty end of it. The best Chinese-made stuff rivals anything produced in the world. Plenty of reputable firms have stuff built there, but it will be to their standards and you will have a proper guarantee and some comeback if anything goes wrong. The things I referred to were "50 quid Chinese no-name jobbies" that you can buy on Etsy, Temu and the like. In China, the nickname for such junk is tofu dreg.

 

It's certainly true that you pay a premium for the name for stuff from AKG, Sennheiser, Shure and established brands. However, you can be sure it will do the job. You may well be able to find something cheaper that performs as well, but it won't cost a fraction of the price of the branded product.

[Woodinblack]

3 hours ago, Dan Dare said:

. Avoid 50 quid Chinese no-name jobbies. Buy once, cry once.

 

The singer in my band uses my Joyo 5.8GHz wireless adapters and has for the last 40 or so gigs indoor / outdoor in a variety of environments - he walks around, dances on tables and goes outside of pubs still singing and hasn't had any issues, we did work out how far he could get at a big outdoor gig once though, but when they did cut out it was clean and came back as soon as he was in range, we also have a lot of other wireless stuff (at the outdoor thing, wireless guitar / bass / IEM / Mixer).

Also hasn't gone low on batteries on 3 hour gig

Bought once, haven't cried at all.

[Al Krow]

43 minutes ago, Woodinblack said:

 

The singer in my band uses my Joyo 5.8GHz wireless adapters and has for the last 40 or so gigs indoor / outdoor in a variety of environments - he walks around, dances on tables and goes outside of pubs still singing and hasn't had any issues, we did work out how far he could get at a big outdoor gig once though, but when they did cut out it was clean and came back as soon as he was in range, we also have a lot of other wireless stuff (at the outdoor thing, wireless guitar / bass / IEM / Mixer).

Also hasn't gone low on batteries on 3 hour gig

Bought once, haven't cried at all.

 

Brilliant, thanks Woody! Think I'll recommend she puts that one on her Xmas list then!

[Woodinblack]

18 minutes ago, Al Krow said:

 

Brilliant, thanks Woody! Think I'll recommend she puts that one on her Xmas list then!

 

Now I look its actually the Lekato set, but looking at them they are identical apart from the logo, so I assume they are the same thing

 

https://lekatodeal.com/en-uk/products/wireless-5-8ghz-microphone-system-plug-on-xlr-transmitter-receiver

 

They are available cheaper than that.

 

Also found out that if you leave them on so they run out (they don't auto switch off) and forget to plug them in before a gig, 25 minutes being plugged in (they have one of those 2 way charging leads so you can do both together) onto a USB power bank is enough to get you through 1hr and 20 minutes of the first set, without them getting to the flashing stage (not sure how much longer, we plugged them in during the 20 minute break and lasted the next hour and a bit).

 

I would say that the only downside that we have noticed is that they are slightly wider than most microphones, so if you want to take them out of a microphone stand while you are singing, you need to pull the mic out, rather than slide the mic up.

 

[Al Krow]

6 minutes ago, Woodinblack said:

 

Now I look its actually the Lekato set, but looking at them they are identical apart from the logo, so I assume they are the same thing

 

https://lekatodeal.com/en-uk/products/wireless-5-8ghz-microphone-system-plug-on-xlr-transmitter-receiver

 

They are available cheaper than that.

 

Also found out that if you leave them on so they run out (they don't auto switch off) and forget to plug them in before a gig, 25 minutes being plugged in (they have one of those 2 way charging leads so you can do both together) onto a USB power bank is enough to get you through 1hr and 20 minutes of the first set, without them getting to the flashing stage (not sure how much longer, we plugged them in during the 20 minute break and lasted the next hour and a bit).

 

I would say that the only downside that we have noticed is that they are slightly wider than most microphones, so if you want to take them out of a microphone stand while you are singing, you need to pull the mic out, rather than slide the mic up.

 

 

That's very helpful, also, thanks. I'm guessing the Joyo is the original and Lekato the clone? But they are the exact same product? 

[Woodinblack]

5 minutes ago, Al Krow said:

That's very helpful, also, thanks. I'm guessing the Joyo is the original and Lekato the clone? But they are the exact same product? 

 

Actually no idea, I assume the companies are basicly buying stuff from the same factories - I just bought the first one I saw as I think it was just over £50 at the time and I thought it woudl be handy, and it really has been.