Calling all graphite neck enthusiasts!

[Kiwi]

5 hours ago, itu said:

I tried to make a list of necks and options proposed so far. I am not quite sure if all options are available to every neck. I suppose that depends on the interest. 

 

- J (£450) 

- P (£450) 

- MM (£480) 

- MM5 (£480) 

 

- normal nut 

- slim nut 

 

- frets 20/22 

- fretless 

 

- no dots / unlined 

- dots / lined 

- blocks (+£30) 

 

Prices do not include P&P. 

Yes.  To get a firm price, I'll need to weigh the package and enter the measurements.  I don't have that information to hand because I don't have the necks yet.  I will supply an educated guess based on some assumptions about the weight of the neck but it will be subject to confirmation.  Initial enquiries for UPS/DHL express shipping (3-5 days) are eyewatering and I've asked if there are cheaper 'priority' options.  I don't know what the shipping companies are smoking but I will look into insured rail and sea as well but the shipping times will be significantly longer.

 

Options for every neck are fingerboard focussed.  Options beyond that, e.g. nut widths, number of strings etc. are going to be subject to MoQ, or the custom route is an option.

 

6 hours ago, WalMan said:

something that is a straight drop in for Fender or MM would probably be a preference (itch starting for a P) and I do like the black and graphite weave showing through on my Status necks so would prefer not to lose that

Yes, if you check the headless video out you'll see I've gone for that.

I think it looks distinctive and really shows what you're playing isn't wood. The necks will also have a matt finish not only because it wears slightly better but also it looks a little more contemporary.

[Jack]

15 hours ago, itu said:

Prices do not include P&P. 

Or presumably import duties?

[Kiwi]

19 hours ago, Jack said:

Or presumably import duties?

Unfortunately I wouldn't be able to allow for those and customers would end up paying them regardless, even if I had sufficient volume in sales to justify UK based warehousing.  Another option would be to bring a stock of necks over personally as checked baggage but the quantities would be limited and I could only do it during a public holiday here in China (Late January, August and, at a pinch, first week in October).

 

Update: Shipping...

I've spent the last day reaching out to various shipping companies.  My regular guy quoted me 2000RMB (over 200 quid) to express UPS ship to the UK in 4-6 days.  I said 'no'.  

 

Another company has offered 390RMB for the same delivery based on some BS volumetric/weight calculation.  However, it made me wonder if I could combine two necks in a single shipment but then the reciever would have to make sure one neck got to it's respective owner.  If two BCers are open to collaborating it could slash the shipping charges in half.

[WillyPete]

Reading this post with interest in the engineering aspects.  

 

Quick question Kiwi: How much would a "neck-through" length neck cost over your regular scale necks that fit to different bodies?  

Couldn't you build a single neck length that people could sandwich between 2 pieces of a body shape that mimic their favourite body style, and then fit the correct scale fingerboard for their needs?  

Slotted bolt holes for the bridge could allow the placement to be made for the scale length of choice.  

Would the difficulty lie in the pickup placement spaces weakening the structure?

 

Quote

However, it made me wonder if I could combine two necks in a single shipment but then the reciever would have to make sure one neck got to it's respective owner.  If two BCers are open to collaborating it could slash the shipping charges in half.

Maybe you need a "distribution agent" in the UK to take delivery of several at once, reducing shipping and import fees to one shipment.

[Kiwi]

3 hours ago, WillyPete said:

Reading this post with interest in the engineering aspects.  

 

Quick question Kiwi: How much would a "neck-through" length neck cost over your regular scale necks that fit to different bodies?  

Should be possible technically.  I have someone who does the 3D modelling.  But it would require a custom mold so would be a custom order.
 

3 hours ago, WillyPete said:

Maybe you need a "distribution agent" in the UK to take delivery of several at once, reducing shipping and import fees to one shipment.

Yes, but my main concern is keeping costs down so I'll be talking to some friends in the UK who used to handle my wife's Ebay merchandise.  They'll expect compensation but I'm hoping it will be less than warehousing, which has been already mentioned.  And shipping surface takes longer but the costs are significantly less so maybe that will be an option if I get to the point where I'm confident of selling a batch of necks speculatively.

[Musicman666]

don't forget uk import tax ..20% ouch. 

[Kiwi]

Coming to China is always an option 😁 There's a direct flight from London to where I live twice a week.

[Lo-E]

I’m very late arriving to this party but I thought I’d chime in anyway. 
 

I’m a wide & flat neck guy so the Jazz Bass or narrow MM necks hold little appeal for me. 
 

I own an early/mid ‘80s BassStar, which I love, and I’ve always wanted an unlined fretless version of same so an unlined fretless P would be top of my list but…. 42mm is actually narrow than my old Modulus. What I’d really like is a 44mm nut that’s pretty flat front-to-back. I’m not sure if that makes me an outlier in my preferences. 
 

Next on my list (your poll didn’t allow multiple selections) would be MM necks, also with wide nuts. It would be wonderful to be able to convert my US S.U.B. Model to a DIY Cutlass and I’d happily find another S.U.B. If I knew I could convert that to an unlined fretless. I have no idea if the neck pocket of the pre-EB MM and the later, 6-bolt S.U.B. is the same but I doubt it. 

In either case, I would like to see headstocks matching the original Fender and MM designs and I don’t know what kind of licensing hassles that would create for you. 
 

For me, the real issue is that I’m in the US. The cost of these necks would be a bit of a stretch for me (although I don’t think it’s unreasonable, given the constraints of small-batch manufacturing) but the shipping and new tariff silliness would almost assuredly put these necks out of my reach. 
 

I think it’s great that you’re doing this, though, and I hope it all goes well. Status and Moses really left a big hole in the market. I really wish I had grabbed Status necks when they were still available. 

[Kiwi]

Update time: I  think the total number of deposits will allow us to make moulds for the p bass, j bass, SR4N and SR5N necks. Thank to everyone who put deposits down.  I'll start final confirmation of measurements this week.

[BridgeCables]

This is such a cool thing. Is a truss rod-less graphite neck possible? Always loved that aspect of aluminium ones.

[itu]

2 hours ago, BridgeCables said:

This is such a cool thing. Is a truss rod-less graphite neck possible? Always loved that aspect of aluminium ones.

They were available from Modulus Graphite and Vigier, among others during late 80's and 90's. MG started to put truss rods back after some people did not like the neck without a rod. I do not see it a must, but as some say, your mileage may vary. 

[Kiwi]

16 hours ago, BridgeCables said:

This is such a cool thing. Is a truss rod-less graphite neck possible? Always loved that aspect of aluminium ones.

Unfortunately, it's not available at the moment because it would be necessary to do some research first to figure out whether a standard PEEK fingerboard would resist the string tension sufficiently.  And, if not, what thickness would.  I'm talking to my fabricator about getting the phenowood fingerboard on my Vigier 5, which is truss rodless and pre-curved, replaced with PEEK.  Perhaps after this point I will be in a better position to know whether PEEK will be stiff enough for truss rodless necks.

[BridgeCables]

17 hours ago, itu said:

They were available from Modulus Graphite and Vigier, among others during late 80's and 90's. MG started to put truss rods back after some people did not like the neck without a rod. I do not see it a must, but as some say, your mileage may vary. 

 

Thanks, I've been looking them up, lovely guitars. I think I read that Vigier changed tack due to feedback too right, blending their graphite necks with wood?

 

2 hours ago, Kiwi said:

Unfortunately, it's not available at the moment because it would be necessary to do some research first to figure out whether a standard PEEK fingerboard would resist the string tension sufficiently.  And, if not, what thickness would.  I'm talking to my fabricator about getting the phenowood fingerboard on my Vigier 5, which is truss rodless and pre-curved, replaced with PEEK.  Perhaps after this point I will be in a better position to know whether PEEK will be stiff enough for truss rodless necks.

 

Cheers, I'm really looking forward to an update on that then. I'd be really interested in a rod-less one. Also, apologies if this is a stupid question, but does that mean the fingerboard is structural in a graphite neck?

[itu]

1 hour ago, BridgeCables said:

Also, apologies if this is a stupid question, but does that mean the fingerboard is structural in a graphite neck?

You can glue nearly anything to a graphite if the epoxy/glue is right. MG has used Chakte kok, our dear @Kiwi uses PEEK, phenolic resin is fine etc. 

[WalMan]

If there's a bit of time still I  may have rather more immediate interest for a P than I did at the start of the week 🫣

[Kiwi]

1 hour ago, WalMan said:

If there's a bit of time still I  may have rather more immediate interest for a P than I did at the start of the week 🫣

There is still time!  The jb mould will be started this week.

[Kiwi]

7 hours ago, BridgeCables said:

 

Thanks, I've been looking them up, lovely guitars. I think I read that Vigier changed tack due to feedback too right, blending their graphite necks with wood?

 

 

Im not an expert on Vigier by any means but their all graphite necks were excellent.  The 90/10 ne ks have a curve carved into the fingerboard which changes according to string tension. Its less than ideal and may actually be an example of over design.  But the bass does sound good.  Late night discussions last night sugfested that PEEK wont be rigid enough for a Vigier neck. 

 

7 hours ago, BridgeCables said:

 Also, apologies if this is a stupid question, but does that mean the fingerboard is structural in a graphite neck?

Not a stupid question at all!  Yes, the graphite composite neck should be stiff enough to resist string tension on its own which means the fingerboard material can be selected for tone shaping potential.  

 

The early Alembic necks by Modulus, Vigier necks and Status necks were really well made, stiff, flat and very low action was achievable.  Later necks, by multiple manufacturers in the nineties, tended to rely more heavily on a phenolic fingerboard for strength and if the recipe for the resin wasnt mixed precisely, the necks bowed under string tension.  Conversely if the resin was too stiff, the bass would sound brittle and glassy. My Alembic has an ebony fingerboard, I've tended to prefer wooden fimgerboards for this reason.  It removes one variable.

[BridgeCables]

That's really interesting. Would a rod-less one provide an opportunity to add extra strength to the neck too, using the extra internal space? 

 

It is cool how the fingerboard material can change the tone of a neck. I have a few aluminium neck guitars, and most of them are one piece but then the one with an ebanol fingerboard definitely has its metallic harshness reined in a bit. Have you ever been tempted to try a fingerboard that preserves or even accentuates the natural sound of the graphite neck? I love weird sounding stuff!!

[Kiwi]

5 hours ago, BridgeCables said:

That's really interesting. Would a rod-less one provide an opportunity to add extra strength to the neck too, using the extra internal space? 

It's a difficult question to answer without speculating.  A hollow monocoque neck (like the design of Auerswald) can be made strong enough to resist string tension without core material or truss rod. But hollow construction can introduce resonancy peaks. which may or may not be welcome. Those peaks can be also managed by choice of core material or the use of outboard eq.  The more solid (and denser) the material, the less pronounced the peaks are and the more easily an instrument can adapt to different musical situations and sit in the mix.  But solid necks do tend to weigh a bit more.

There is a school of thought amongst luthiers with very traditional approaches that a guitar neck has to be just stiff enough to resist string tention, and if it's too stiff it will reduce midrange and warmth.  I've realised over the years that basses featuring multi laminated necks tend to sound very similar to one another once there are more than 7 laminations.  Status experimented with different core materials and (I think) their Stealth II basses had epoxy foam in their monocoque construction to dampen certain resonances in addition to fingerboard choice and selected weave orientation.   One thing I've noticed with my Status bass is that it still sounds like a Status regardless of what electronics are installed!

 

5 hours ago, BridgeCables said:

It is cool how the fingerboard material can change the tone of a neck. I have a few aluminium neck guitars, and most of them are one piece but then the one with an ebanol fingerboard definitely has its metallic harshness reined in a bit. Have you ever been tempted to try a fingerboard that preserves or even accentuates the natural sound of the graphite neck? I love weird sounding stuff!!

Yes!  That's the reason why wooden fingerboards are an option.  They provide some dampening of the higher frequencies.  Plus it's possible to investigate wood options for dampening properties more than strength so mahogany, padauk, alder and other softer hardwood species can be potentially considered too.