Using two midi devices with one controller?

[lidl e]

Is this possible? 

Something like the disaster area's micro? 

 

Can i hook that up with an adapter to be able to control two devices?

 

The devices in question are the Source Audio C4 and the TC Electronic Plethora x3

Edited June 5, 2023 by lidl e

[EBS_freak]

Very much possible.

 

You'll need the neuro hub to control the C4.

 

Midi controller > Plethora (Midi In) > Plethora (Midi Thru) > Neuro Hub connected to C4.

 

Make sure that both devices are on different channels. Done.

[BigRedX]

What exactly do you want to do?

 

If it's simply programme changing you'll probably want both receiving devices on the SAME MIDI channel and ideally for at least one of them to have MIDI programme mapping so that you don't have to spend ages making sure that the patches on each device are in the correct place.

[Woodinblack]

That is literally one of the purposes of midi - to be able to control many devices from various places.

[BigRedX]

To the OP - I take it your are also using the loop switching features of the Micro, because otherwise you should be able to everything you want using the Plethora as your controller, although you will still need Source Audio's overpriced Neuro Hub to interface the C4 to it.

[lidl e]

Yeah, i just want to do program changes and have access to 127 presets on the c4.

 

I keep reading about this neural hub.

 

Will have to look into it.

[BigRedX]

10 minutes ago, lidl e said:

Yeah, i just want to do program changes and have access to 127 presets on the c4.

 

You should be able to do all of that from the foot switches on the Plethora. Have a good read the manual and the MIDI implementation chart that comes with it. You need the Neuro Hub, because the C4 doesn't have a "proper" MIDI interface on it.

[lidl e]

36 minutes ago, BigRedX said:

 

You should be able to do all of that from the foot switches on the Plethora. Have a good read the manual and the MIDI implementation chart that comes with it. You need the Neuro Hub, because the C4 doesn't have a "proper" MIDI interface on it.

If i could find a future compact housing id use that as i alread have their midi interace but your man seems to have disappeared!

[Jakester]

3 hours ago, BigRedX said:

To the OP - I take it your are also using the loop switching features of the Micro, because otherwise you should be able to everything you want using the Plethora as your controller, although you will still need Source Audio's overpriced Neuro Hub to interface the C4 to it.

 

You don't need a Neuro Hub to use a Micro with the C4. It works over USB Midi - you need a USB Host, but it does work.

[EBS_freak]

27 minutes ago, Jakester said:

 

You don't need a Neuro Hub to use a Micro with the C4. It works over USB Midi - you need a USB Host, but it does work.

I think BRX is trying to get the OP on a standardised MIDI controller. I'm not a big fan of USB and MIDI, cos the tiny USB cables that manufacturers choose to use aren't really gig friendly. (I get it, they take up much less room... but more prone to cable failure)

[BigRedX]

55 minutes ago, Jakester said:

You don't need a Neuro Hub to use a Micro with the C4. It works over USB Midi - you need a USB Host, but it does work.

 

AFAICS the OP isn't intending to use one. Proper MIDI is a peer-to-peer network. You simply connect the MIDI out of one device to the MIDI in of another not need for hosts or any of this other nonsense that "MIDI" over USB requires. Hence the need for the expensive Neuro Hub, when if the C4 had proper MIDI sockets on it the OP would simply need a standard MIDI DIN lead or if they were planning the use more than 2 devices and sending timing critical data they could get away with a MIDI Thru box at less than half the price of the Neuro Hub.

[lidl e]

Do you need the neuro hub to use the diasater area micro.

 

I cant use tye plethora for C4 program changes, can i?

Edited June 5, 2023 by lidl e

[BigRedX]

5 minutes ago, lidl e said:

Do you need the neuro hub to use the diasater area micro.

 

For any MIDI functions that do not involve connecting the C4 to a computer you need the Neuro Hub. This is because the C4 doesn't have a standard MIDI interface, and uses either MIDI over USB to connect to a computer or the Neuro Hub to connect to devices that sport standard MIDI sockets.

[BigRedX]

9 minutes ago, lidl e said:

I cant use tye plethora for C4 program changes, can i?

 

You'll need to consult the Plethora manual and MIDI implementation chart to be sure, but just looking at the device, if the foot switches include program up and down functions (which they appear to do) then it should also transmit these commands out of the MIDI out socket - you might need to enable this somewhere on the device. Hopefully also either the Plethora or the C4 include MIDI program mapping so you don't have to spend ages shuffling programs around so that the correct patches on each device match up.

[lidl e]

16 minutes ago, BigRedX said:

 

You'll need to consult the Plethora manual and MIDI implementation chart to be sure, but just looking at the device, if the foot switches include program up and down functions (which they appear to do) then it should also transmit these commands out of the MIDI out socket - you might need to enable this somewhere on the device. Hopefully also either the Plethora or the C4 include MIDI program mapping so you don't have to spend ages shuffling programs around so that the correct patches on each device match up.

I dont think you can

 

The X5 isn’t intended to be the central control point for your gear. It doesn’t send MIDI commands out (but can pass them through) and it won’t change channels on your amp. There isn’t the equivalent of Line 6 Preset mode. That is achieved via MIDI.

[BigRedX]

7 minutes ago, lidl e said:

I dont think you can

 

The X5 isn’t intended to be the central control point for your gear. It doesn’t send MIDI commands out (but can pass them through) and it won’t change channels on your amp. There isn’t the equivalent of Line 6 Preset mode. That is achieved via MIDI.

 

I've just had a look at the very basic "Quick Start"guide which is on the TC website, and you may be right. Why is there no complete manual available?

 

So in "play" mode the foot switches simply turn on and off each of the three effects? I was hoping that the "up" and "down" arrows next to them meant that you could use them to scroll through the various "boards" you create - is there no way of doing this from the device itself?. If you can only change "boards" via the computer or MIDI then you will need another device to do this. Are you sure the Disaster Area Micro is the best solution for this? I'd be looking at the Behringer foot controller that is shown in the Quick Start guide as it probably do far more.

[lidl e]

13 minutes ago, BigRedX said:

 

I've just had a look at the very basic "Quick Start"guide which is on the TC website, and you may be right. Why is there no complete manual available?

 

So in "play" mode the foot switches simply turn on and off each of the three effects? I was hoping that the "up" and "down" arrows next to them meant that you could use them to scroll through the various "boards" you create - is there no way of doing this from the device itself?. If you can only change "boards" via the computer or MIDI then you will need another device to do this. Are you sure the Disaster Area Micro is the best solution for this? I'd be looking at the Behringer foot controller that is shown in the Quick Start guide as it probably do far more.

Yeah, there are a few complaints ive read about no manual for the plethora!

 

I dont really have any idea how im going to do what i plan! 

 

I ususally just ask a bunch of questions until an answer presents itself!

 

Im cyrrently trying to build a small grab and go board. I suppose i dont really need midi for the plethora, just to control the C4 and access patches.

 

The plethora is killer, but no synth is a bummer.

 

If the future impact werent so big id use that since i have the midiconnect for it

[BigRedX]

If you're looking for a small-footprint board, EBS_freak's original solution will probably be the way to go.

 

It might be worth looking to see if there are any even more basic MIDI program foot switches available than the Disaster Area Micro since it appears to have a load of loop switching functions that you probably don't need. If you can get away with simple program up and down switches I'm sure there is something else that will do the job. Don't forget you'll need room for a PSU (or PSUs depending on power requirements) for all the devices and all the cabling to connect them all together. MIDI connectors aren't particularly compact compared with some pedal board jack to jack cable options available. I would also consider cable-tying anything that isn't a 1/4" jack lead or XLR in place so there is little chance of it moving and becoming disconnected mid-performance. If you want to be able to use the effects on/off switches of the Plethora separate to MIDI patch changes you'll need to consider its positioning on the board.

 

All this kind of messing about makes me thankful that I have made the decision that if it can't be done on the Helix, I'll make do without that function for live use.

[EBS_freak]

26 minutes ago, lidl e said:

If the future impact werent so big id use that since i have the midiconnect for it

You know some geezer, (forget username) is 3d printing small enclosures for the future impact? Pretty much halves the size?

[EBS_freak]

Here you go - 

 

[lidl e]

28 minutes ago, EBS_freak said:

Here you go - 

 

Aye. Ive emailed him and PMed him a few times. 

 

He seems to have left the board.

 

He had read one of my PMs back in march but no answer and he hasnt been back since.

 

Id really like one!

 

@GisserD

[lidl e]

18 hours ago, BigRedX said:

If you're looking for a small-footprint board, EBS_freak's original solution will probably be the way to go.

 

It might be worth looking to see if there are any even more basic MIDI program foot switches available than the Disaster Area Micro since it appears to have a load of loop switching functions that you probably don't need. If you can get away with simple program up and down switches I'm sure there is something else that will do the job. Don't forget you'll need room for a PSU (or PSUs depending on power requirements) for all the devices and all the cabling to connect them all together. MIDI connectors aren't particularly compact compared with some pedal board jack to jack cable options available. I would also consider cable-tying anything that isn't a 1/4" jack lead or XLR in place so there is little chance of it moving and becoming disconnected mid-performance. If you want to be able to use the effects on/off switches of the Plethora separate to MIDI patch changes you'll need to consider its positioning on the board.

 

All this kind of messing about makes me thankful that I have made the decision that if it can't be done on the Helix, I'll make do without that function for live use.

Yeah, i can build a board. I can even kind of get midi working (at least enough to add expression pedal and external buttons to my FI).

 

From what ixam seeing you dont need the neural hun to use the dmc disaster dealie. 

 

I might grab one just to be able to access the C4 presets if I end up that route 

[AJ567]

OP just needs the new source audio midi adapter to control the C4, no need for the neuro hub unless there are multiple source audio pedals. Google "SA 168"