CD duplication and copyright

[Skinnyman]

Apologies if this has been covered elsewhere - a search didn’t turn up anything 

 

A friend is a member of a choir and they’re aiming to have one of their concerts recorded and produce a bunch of physical CDs to sell at their performances.

 

There are loads of companies who do CD duplication, mastering, etc but I’m guessing that a few people on BC have been down this road and can suggest companies they recommend or ones to avoid?

 

Quantities won’t be massive - probably an initial run of 200. 
 

AFAIK, the music they’re recording is all out of copyright but just in case they’ve slipped in a couple of Megadeth tunes without telling anyone, does anyone know what the rules are for recording other peoples songs to CD?

 

I believe they’d need a PRS licence but can anyone confirm that?

Thanks….

 

[BigRedX]

I've done loads of CDs both for the various bands I've been in over the last 30 years and as part of a service I used to offer along with my graphic design skills to bands who wanted to get their music out cheaply and with the least amount of hassle to themselves. 

 

When it comes to CDs the important words to look for a "Duplication" and "Replication". Duplication means CDRs and used to be the cost-effective option for runs under 300 copies. However it comes with all the standard down-sides of CDRs in that your CD probably won't be playable in 15 years time. Replication is "proper" CD manufacturing with glass mastering etc and therefore a longer-lasting end product, but you used to need to order at least 500 to make it worth while. You'll need to look at the exact current figures but last time I looked once you got to about 300 copies on duplicated CDRs it was then cheaper to go for a run of 500 replicated CDs.

 

I've used the following in the past:

 

Disc Wizards used be by far the cheapest option for CDs but all their packaging templates were completely different to every other manufacturer, so if you'd already created the Sleeve/Inlay/Wallet/J-Card/Digipak artwork the chances are you'd have to do it all over again, which could be problematic depending on the design. However, last time I looked they weren't very much cheaper than the competition.

 

Media Hut good quality, much the same price as everyone else but they had the advantage for me of being local (well their office was).

 

Mobineko I've not used them for CDs but their vinyl production has been excellent. However I believe that they offer proper CD replication even on short production runs, so if not having CDRs is important to you then they are definitely worth looking at.

 

A word of warning. All of the above used to be able to offer good quality and low prices by farming out production to various companies elsewhere in the EU. Since the UK's exit from this they may not be as cheap as they used to be. Certainly pre 2019 any company who did all their CD production in the UK were considerably more expensive.

 

Regarding copyright, you'll need an MCPS (not PRS) licence if you are including any copyright material on your CD. Whoever is producing the CDs should be able to sort this out for you. IIRC you pay up front depending on the number of copyright songs and the production run of the CD. If the music is all out of copyright, or the producer of the CD owns the copyright then you normally just have to sign a waiver stating this when you pay to have the CDs produced.

 

HTH.

[Skinnyman]

That’s exactly what I needed to know - thank you!

[phil.c60]

Big Red is pretty much spot on. There is indeed an up front royalty payment system for small runs of CD's: It's on the PRS website under licences and it's the LM (limited manufacture) licence that I think you need. Should be MCPS only. It's fairly self explanatory. Another thing to consider is that  if any of the music is copyright and might get played on the radio (for promotional reasons etc.), you can have tags embedded in the tracks so the radio play royalties get sent to the right place. All the decent replicators/duplicators can do this. Most small radio stations require the tags to be embedded if you want them to play your CD as they don't want to faff about sorting out royalties for what they play.

[Leonard Smalls]

I've never quite understood how the licence system works...

If I were to release a cd with only original songs written by my band would I require a licence? Or would a licence be useful only If it's likely to be broadcast lots? And if so, how would the PRS know? I have a playing music licence for my garden centre which contained 1000 songs from a hard drive. I asked the PRS if they'd want a list of what was played and how many times - they said no. 

And If I were to release an album containing one cover, would I need a licence? Or would I just need permission from the copyright holder?

[BigRedX]

3 hours ago, Leonard Smalls said:

I've never quite understood how the licence system works...

If I were to release a cd with only original songs written by my band would I require a licence? Or would a licence be useful only If it's likely to be broadcast lots? And if so, how would the PRS know? I have a playing music licence for my garden centre which contained 1000 songs from a hard drive. I asked the PRS if they'd want a list of what was played and how many times - they said no. 

And If I were to release an album containing one cover, would I need a licence? Or would I just need permission from the copyright holder?

 

You need a MCPS (mechanical) licence if you release any copyright material that you (or your band) do not own. The cost of that licence is based on the number of tracks which are owned by other copyright holders on the record/CD and the number of records/CDs being made. This only applies to physical releases - CDs, records, cassettes. Mechanical royalty allocation for downloads of covers are generally handled by your aggregator.

 

Performance royalties (PRS) are handled differently. For CDs and other digital releases each track has an embedded unique ISRC code which is used to allocate royalties for radio play, so long as you are a member of the PRS. As a PRS member you can also receive royalty payments every time you play a song that you have written at a gig, although you'll need to submit a setlist to the PRS in order to receive this. If your band play regularly it is worth being a PRS writer member and submit a playlist every time you gig, as the performance royalties soon add up. As I've said before in similar threads when this subject has come up the performance royalties The Terrortones accrued from playing gigs paid for all our studio time and then some. I'm still earning performance royalties for songs written and recorded over 40 years ago by bands who are long gone.

 

Once a song has been released by someone you don't need permission from the songwriter or original artist to release your own cover.

 

I don't know exactly how it works at the moment, but it used to be that the money from PRS licenses such as those paid by your garden centre went into a pot for "unrecorded royalties" which would generally be distributed between all the members who earned more than a certain amount a year, based on the assumption that if they were popular enough to be earning a certain level of performance royalties then their works would have been included in these "playlists". The threshold to obtain a share of this pot is quite high, and I've only qualified once (mostly as a result of my band recording a session that was broadcast on Radio Trent in the 80s), but IIRC it boosted my royalty payments for the next 3 years. The way these payments are allocated does mean that the bulk of this money goes to those already earning signifiant performance royalties, but unless your retail space caters for a very niche customer base with very niche musical tastes the chances are you'll be playing popular music anyway.

 

Hope that answers all your questions.

 

 

[Silvia Bluejay]

Excellent answers by @BigRedX, as always. As per our previous discussions and comments on this subject, I'm still waiting for PRS here in the UK to catch up with what its equivalents in the rest of Europe have done for decades, and ask bands to submit their setlist for each gig, so the royalties go to the copyright holders of the correct songs.

[Leonard Smalls]

1 hour ago, BigRedX said:

The threshold to obtain a share of this pot is quite high,

This was my issue! I didn't want Paul McCartney to get money that should have been going to Ini Kamoze or James Blood Ulmer!

[BigRedX]

19 minutes ago, Leonard Smalls said:

This was my issue! I didn't want Paul McCartney to get money that should have been going to Ini Kamoze or James Blood Ulmer!

 

Considering that they are both better known than I am, I suspect they will already be eligible and their share will probably reflect their overall popularity, so nothing to be worried about.