EssentialTension Posted February 23, 2009 Share Posted February 23, 2009 Has anyone ever played a bass part for Richard Thompson's [i]1952 Vincent Black Lightning[/i]? I've got the chord structure (accurately I believe) but I'm struggling to develop a bass line that I'm competent to play and which adds to the song. Any suggestions gratefully accepted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YouMa Posted February 23, 2009 Share Posted February 23, 2009 Can you not just follow the root notes of the chords hes finger picking,theres enough of em. I think that tunes in DADGAD tuning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wateroftyne Posted February 23, 2009 Share Posted February 23, 2009 If the arrangement is the same as RT's... I would leave lots of space and concentrate on acting as a counterpoint to the vocal, staying well away from the guitar. aka 'what would Danny Thompson do?' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EssentialTension Posted February 23, 2009 Author Share Posted February 23, 2009 [quote name='YouMa' post='417100' date='Feb 23 2009, 01:37 AM']Can you not just follow the root notes of the chords hes finger picking,theres enough of em. I think that tunes in DADGAD tuning.[/quote] Thanks YouMa. I can follow the root notes but it was a bit boring and didn't seem to me to add anything to the song. I guess it is the fall back position. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hubrad Posted February 23, 2009 Share Posted February 23, 2009 [quote name='wateroftyne' post='417136' date='Feb 23 2009, 08:12 AM']'what would Danny Thompson do?'[/quote] Exactly! Listen to the RT + DT live albums.. inspiration for both instruments! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EssentialTension Posted February 23, 2009 Author Share Posted February 23, 2009 [quote name='wateroftyne' post='417136' date='Feb 23 2009, 08:12 AM']If the arrangement is the same as RT's... I would leave lots of space and concentrate on acting as a counterpoint to the vocal, staying well away from the guitar. aka 'what would Danny Thompson do?'[/quote] Thanks WoT. It is RT's arrangement (although I think the guitarist may be doing a slightly simplified version ). I think your advice is good. I been stuck between doing root notes only or doing something too fast and too complicated that followed the guitar and was anyway (for me) difficult to play at that speed, especially as it's on fretless. I've been thinking 'what would Danny Thompson do?' but hadn't quite come up with the answer - other than I'm not quite as good as DT. So thanks. I'll let you know if I can pull it off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YouMa Posted February 23, 2009 Share Posted February 23, 2009 If you just stick to the root notes and add small pentatonic fills for colour tones you should be fine,the main thing in a song like this is not to over complicate,Danny thompson also has no frets so has that droney sound which is more suited to folk music. I would reccomend getting hold of any pentangle albums basket of light is brilliant and taught me a lot about folk playing. Hope this helps mate, folk music is an exciting music and i think it is a genre which is often overlooked by bassists.Good luck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EssentialTension Posted February 23, 2009 Author Share Posted February 23, 2009 [quote name='hubrad' post='417635' date='Feb 23 2009, 05:47 PM']Exactly! Listen to the RT + DT live albums.. inspiration for both instruments! [/quote] Which album(s) did you have in mind? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hubrad Posted February 23, 2009 Share Posted February 23, 2009 [quote name='EssentialTension' post='417645' date='Feb 23 2009, 06:06 PM']Which album(s) did you have in mind?[/quote] Hi Dave, just leaving work at the mo.. I've a couple at home; I'll find the titles. I think both are from the mid-90s.. saw them in Leeds on one of those tours, and it's still one of those gigs of a lifetime for me! HUGH Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EssentialTension Posted February 23, 2009 Author Share Posted February 23, 2009 [quote name='hubrad' post='417667' date='Feb 23 2009, 06:32 PM']Hi Dave, just leaving work at the mo.. I've a couple at home; I'll find the titles. I think both are from the mid-90s.. saw them in Leeds on one of those tours, and it's still one of those gigs of a lifetime for me! HUGH[/quote] Thanks Hugh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EssentialTension Posted February 23, 2009 Author Share Posted February 23, 2009 [quote name='YouMa' post='417643' date='Feb 23 2009, 06:04 PM']If you just stick to the root notes and add small pentatonic fills for colour tones you should be fine,the main thing in a song like this is not to over complicate,Danny thompson also has no frets so has that droney sound which is more suited to folk music. I would reccomend getting hold of any pentangle albums basket of light is brilliant and taught me a lot about folk playing. Hope this helps mate, folk music is an exciting music and i think it is a genre which is often overlooked by bassists.Good luck.[/quote] I've listened to a lot of folk over the years including RT and DT and Fairport and Pentangle and loved it but I've rarely had to play it. I'm not quite in the groove with it yet. Thanks again for the advice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wateroftyne Posted February 23, 2009 Share Posted February 23, 2009 Yay! A folk love-in! Another excuse to post [url="http://www.jollybeggars.co.uk/stuff/oakeyreel.mp3"]WoT's favourite folk / bass moment[/url]! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EssentialTension Posted February 23, 2009 Author Share Posted February 23, 2009 [quote name='wateroftyne' post='417678' date='Feb 23 2009, 06:41 PM']Yay! A folk love-in! Another excuse to post [url="http://www.jollybeggars.co.uk/stuff/oakeyreel.mp3"]WoT's favourite folk / bass moment[/url]![/quote] What was that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hubrad Posted February 23, 2009 Share Posted February 23, 2009 [quote name='YouMa' post='417643' date='Feb 23 2009, 06:04 PM']Danny thompson also has no frets[/quote] [quote]I would reccomend getting hold of any pentangle albums basket of light is brilliant and taught me a lot about folk playing.[/quote] Absolutely.. Basket Of Light was the album that got me into folk music. [quote]Hope this helps mate, folk music is an exciting music and i think it is a genre which is often overlooked by bassists.[/quote] All the more fun for the enlightened among us! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wateroftyne Posted February 23, 2009 Share Posted February 23, 2009 [quote name='EssentialTension' post='417686' date='Feb 23 2009, 06:49 PM']What was that? [/quote] It's the reel tagged on the end 'Oakey Strike Evictions' by Jack the Lad. Marvellous! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YouMa Posted February 23, 2009 Share Posted February 23, 2009 [quote name='wateroftyne' post='417817' date='Feb 23 2009, 08:31 PM']It's the reel tagged on the end 'Oakey Strike Evictions' by Jack the Lad. Marvellous![/quote] On crysalis good shout,up the lindisfarne. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hubrad Posted February 23, 2009 Share Posted February 23, 2009 [quote name='wateroftyne' post='417817' date='Feb 23 2009, 08:31 PM']It's the reel tagged on the end 'Oakey Strike Evictions' by Jack the Lad. Marvellous![/quote] Actually, that's a jig! The name'll come back to me.. useless with names. Cracker all the same. Anyway, Dave, I found one of the live CDs so far.. RT + DT Live at Crawley (Jazz Festival) 1993. D'Oh! No VBL1953! Still well worth finding; sometimes crops up on Ebay - think that's how I came by this one. I have RT Live From Austin TX.. also with DT on bass. Contains VBL1953.. RT solo! What can you do? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete.young Posted February 23, 2009 Share Posted February 23, 2009 [quote name='wateroftyne' post='417817' date='Feb 23 2009, 08:31 PM']It's the reel tagged on the end 'Oakey Strike Evictions' by Jack the Lad. Marvellous![/quote] Er, it's a jig. Damned if I can remember the name of it though. It'll come to me at 3.00 in the morning, as usual. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wateroftyne Posted February 23, 2009 Share Posted February 23, 2009 [quote name='pete.young' post='417894' date='Feb 23 2009, 09:38 PM']Er, it's a jig. Damned if I can remember the name of it though. It'll come to me at 3.00 in the morning, as usual.[/quote] yes yes yes yes yes *mumbles under breath* Blimmin' Folk mafia.. worse than Jazzers... Anyway... as for what it's called... no doubt it's got a name. Probably nine or ten of 'em... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EssentialTension Posted February 23, 2009 Author Share Posted February 23, 2009 [quote name='hubrad' post='417843' date='Feb 23 2009, 08:56 PM']Actually, that's a jig! The name'll come back to me.. useless with names. Cracker all the same. Anyway, Dave, I found one of the live CDs so far.. RT + DT Live at Crawley (Jazz Festival) 1993. D'Oh! No VBL1953! Still well worth finding; sometimes crops up on Ebay - think that's how I came by this one. I have RT Live From Austin TX.. also with DT on bass. Contains VBL1953.. RT solo! What can you do?[/quote] Thanks. I've got the Austin TX one and, as you say, no bass - maybe I'm not the only one who can't play it . I'll check out Live at Crawley. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hubrad Posted February 23, 2009 Share Posted February 23, 2009 [quote name='wateroftyne' post='417908' date='Feb 23 2009, 09:46 PM']yes yes yes yes yes *mumbles under breath* Blimmin' Folk mafia.. worse than Jazzers... Anyway... as for what it's called... no doubt it's got a name. Probably nine or ten of 'em...[/quote] jig.. reel.. all sound the same, innit? Diddly-eye-doh! BANISH MISFORTUNE!! possibly I (and another mate who was also really into Jack The Lad) sometimes get to play with Ian Fairbairn. Saw him at the weekend.. pleased to report he's still brilliant! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldGit Posted February 25, 2009 Share Posted February 25, 2009 (edited) I must say it's tempting to suggest not playing anything as it's pretty much perfect as it is... However, taking themes from the vocal line, subtle underpinnings emphasising various parts of the tune - say under the rising lines such as "And I’ve seen you at the corners and cafes it seems .." may do it. Here's a more country version but with bass .. Oh and use the Jack the Lad bass tone and a pick ha ha ha joking .... Edited February 25, 2009 by OldGit Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EssentialTension Posted February 25, 2009 Author Share Posted February 25, 2009 [quote name='OldGit' post='419015' date='Feb 25 2009, 08:52 AM']I must say it's tempting to suggest not playing anything as it's pretty much perfect as it is...[/quote] +1 on that. In fact the other (slide) guitarist and harmonica player and drummer all didn't think they could add to it - which is what I said as well - but at last night's rehearsal I was unfortunate enough to manage to play something vaguely musical and interesting (some of the time) and they all went 'But there should definitely be some bass on it'. So I've got a recording of the guitarist on his own and I'm supposed to perfect my part by next Tuesday. [quote name='OldGit' post='419015' date='Feb 25 2009, 08:52 AM']However, taking themes from the vocal line, subtle underpinnings emphasising various parts of the tune - say under the rising lines such as "And I’ve seen you at the corners and cafes it seems .." may do it. Here's a more country version but with bass ..[/quote] Excellent. Thanks for that. Very interesting. I've emailed that to the whole band. [quote name='OldGit' post='419015' date='Feb 25 2009, 08:52 AM']Oh and use the Jack the Lad bass tone and a pick ha ha ha joking .... [/quote] Er...OK...I'll look into that... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Fudge Posted February 25, 2009 Share Posted February 25, 2009 I used to play this in my serious guitar days. I seem to remember the E is dropped to C and A is dropped to G. I think Thompson cappos on the third. I have seen him live 20+ times. If I practiced for a month I might be able to play it again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EssentialTension Posted February 25, 2009 Author Share Posted February 25, 2009 [quote name='Mr Fudge' post='419662' date='Feb 25 2009, 10:04 PM']I used to play this in my serious guitar days. I seem to remember the E is dropped to C and A is dropped to G. I think Thompson cappos on the third. I have seen him live 20+ times. If I practiced for a month I might be able to play it again. [/quote] I don't know what tuning our guitarist is using although he is playing a simplified version of the excellent Thompson version while singing it very well. I think if we are going to perform it, it needs to be turned into an ensemble piece. The harmonica player is now hinting at the possibility of a jaw harp. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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