Truckstop Posted November 13, 2012 Share Posted November 13, 2012 Hello all, Looking at getting some mics for my PA rig and struggling to understand exactly what is suitable for my needs. What's a condenser microphone? What does cardiod mean? Why do I see mics that can be used for snare and toms? Wouldn't they require different types? What is a windshield? For the vocals I have a couple of SM58's. I need to mic a kit and I'd like to have some mics suitable for guitar and keyboard amps too. Cheers!! Alex Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian Savage Posted November 13, 2012 Share Posted November 13, 2012 I just typed a really long, in-dpeth response to this, which my web connection then dropped and lost I was actually writing a book a while ago as a kind of introduction to PA and recording, shall dig out the old hard drive and C'n'P in a little bit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Truckstop Posted November 16, 2012 Author Share Posted November 16, 2012 Little bump! It's after 36 hours, right? Alex Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
51m0n Posted November 16, 2012 Share Posted November 16, 2012 I do intend to get all this stuff on the recording blog, but its a huge topic and I'm doing all my own diagrams and its taking an age, and a bunch of other people want an eq blog too, I need more time....... Quick answer. There are several different types of transducer design that generate electricity from sound. [b]Dynamic[/b] This basically uses a tiny speaker and magnetic assembly These are rugged, but by mic diaphragm standards the mechanism is not the lightest and therefore is not the most accurate at reproducing transients. Not an issue for most live applications [b]Condensor[/b] The transducer is a one plate of capacitor, it can be made of a very very thin membrane covered with an conductive material. These can be rugged if made specifically for live, but they are generally not so rugged as a dynamic, they do pick up the most nuances in the sound though, having the lightest diaphragm. They require 48v phantom power to charge the the capacitor up [b]Electret[/b] Like a condensor but the capacitor is charged up and retains its charge, meaning they dont need phantom power. Over time the charge ca seep away though, degrading the mic . [b]Ribbon[/b] An old fashion form of dynamic employing a corrugated strip of aluminium as the membrane. These are delicate, prone to relewaseing the magic smoke i you accidentally put phantom power up them, they sound darker than the other mics, but take eqing very well, and can sound smooth and lovely. Not really suitable for live though as they are generally a figure of 8 polar pattern. [b]Polar Patterns[/b] There are three main types and they describe from what angle the mic picks up best. Or looking at it the otherway where they reject from the best. Live its common touse tighter mics to try and help prevent feedback [b]Omni directional[/b] These mics pick up evenly from any direction - they are in effect miniature super sensitive barometers Not really suitable for live [b]Cardiod[/b] Pick up mostly from the front, reject from the rear Useful for many live applications (ie vocals, cabinet micing, kick and poss snare) [b]Hyper-Cardiod[/b] Reject from the sides and off to one side in the rear, but not at 180 degrees. Good where you want to tighten up the pick up pattern significantly. Useful sometimes for toms, or hats or snare where you want to control spillage. Even on some vocals a tighter cardiod can work better All directional mics (not omni) show to a lesser or greater extent something called boundary effect, whereby the nearer the mic is to the source the more bass boost you get. This is why omnis are so nice for recording beautiful sounds in beautiful rooms - they sound most natural of all. Great omni condesnors can set you back several grand If a mic can be used on a tomtom it can be used on a cab, a voice, a trumpet, whatever. How nice it sounds depends on a multitude of factors, trust your ears! Kick drum mics are cardiod as a rule, dynamic and their frequency response goes down to around 40HZ. Anything marketed specifically for kick (ie AKG D112) will tend to have a more or less significant dip in the mid range. Vocal mics should have good anti handling noise characteristics ie when you move them around the mic shouldnt pick up handling noise so well. Its a good rule of thumb to use one or two condensors (one is fine for live) as an overheads on the drums - I've miced up drums live with a kick mic and a single well placed OH and had fabulous results - you need to be micing a good well tuned and played kit though. [url="http://www.red5audio.com/acatalog/Drum_Kit_Mics.html"]Red5 Audio[/url] do great cheap mic kits for live SM58 or Sennheiser e835/e845 for vocals are great starting points SM57 for guitar cabs, horns and toms Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete.young Posted November 17, 2012 Share Posted November 17, 2012 Alex, If you can get hold of a book called 'Live Sound for the Performing Musician' by Paul White, it's well worth a read and has lots of information that I found really useful about mikes, mixers, and all kinds of other stuff to do with live sound. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Truckstop Posted November 18, 2012 Author Share Posted November 18, 2012 Lovely, cheers guys! Will check that book out and many thanks Simon for the read! Alex Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lozz196 Posted November 19, 2012 Share Posted November 19, 2012 SM58 or Sennheiser e835/e845 for vocals are great starting points SM57 for guitar cabs, horns and toms As per 51m0ns post, can`t really go wrong with these. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beely Posted November 19, 2012 Share Posted November 19, 2012 I was going to sing the praises of Red 5 Audio's drum mic set when I noticed 51m0n has already mentioned them. Good quality, robust mics if you are on a budget, or even if you're not. Got a deal on at the moment, 5 free mic leads. These are good quality as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
51m0n Posted November 19, 2012 Share Posted November 19, 2012 I really like the Red5 Audio kick drum, terrific mic, I got mine when they were on offer, for about £40 IIRC. Unbelievable deal! You can also use a Senn e835 on snare/toms/horns etc (I've used mine on all of thos and more, and its been fine, as well as for live vox) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOD2 Posted November 19, 2012 Share Posted November 19, 2012 [i]What's a condenser microphone? [/i] "Condenser" is another name for "capacitor" and it describes the mechanism inside the mic. Most importantly a condenser mic requires power to make it work. This is usually provided by the "phantom power" on a mixing desk. If your desk doesn't have phantom power then a condenser mic won't work unless you provide a separate power supply. [i]What does cardiod mean?[/i] It describes the shape of the mic pickup pattern. Cardoid means "heart shaped".Imagine a heart shape around the mic with the point of the heart at the front of the mic and the two heart lobes on either side. At the back of the mic the heart shape will have a notch cut out of it and this corresponds to a lack of sensitivity at the rear of the mic. Note that other pickup patterns also exist and this is important when positioning a mic relative to a stage monitor - you want the least sensitive area of the mic lined up with the monitor to minimise feedback. Pics here [url="http://www.bandwagonmedia.com/micPatterns.html"]http://www.bandwagonmedia.com/micPatterns.html[/url] [i]Why do I see mics that can be used for snare and toms? Wouldn't they require different types? [/i] There's not a lot of difference in the mic requirements for each. As long as they can handle the high (loud) input signal then the same type of mic could be used for both. [i]What is a windshield?[/i] This is usually a foam cover that goes over the head of the mic to reduce wind noise and breathing noise on the mic. It also helps keep the mic internals clean by stopping dust and spit reaching them (and can be easily removed and cleaned or replaced). [i]For the vocals I have a couple of SM58's. I need to mic a kit and I'd like to have some mics suitable for guitar and keyboard amps too.[/i] SM58s are the "industry standard" for vocal mics. Reliable, robust and not too expensive. The SM57 is often used as a mic for guitar and keyboard amps and is good general purpose mic. But there are lots of alternatives, as already mentioned. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bremen Posted November 19, 2012 Share Posted November 19, 2012 SM57 = SM58 without the 'ball' pop filter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
51m0n Posted November 19, 2012 Share Posted November 19, 2012 (edited) [quote name='bremen' timestamp='1353339989' post='1873840'] SM57 = SM58 without the 'ball' pop filter. [/quote] Not precisely. The innards are the same, but there is a head on the sm57 too, and that is what determines the polar pattern of the 57 and changes hw much proximity effect it displays. It sounds pretty gash if that head gets damaged, as does the 58 minus its spherical windshield (due to the loikelihood of it being affected badly by pops and wind noise etc. Unfortunately you cant just buy a 58 and unscrew the head to have a 57 whenever you want. Pity really! Edited November 19, 2012 by 51m0n Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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