Killerfridge Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 Little bit of a back-story to this one. I have been doing the demos for my band for a few weeks, recording using 2 condensers and whatever dynamics we had to hand in our rehearsal space (all no-name brands). As I have literally no experience recording or mixing, this seemed like an interesting experiment. Anyway, after having 5 or so songs recorded like this, we decided it would probably be a good idea to get them recorded professionally, as my mixes aren't exactly what one might call "pro-quality". However, once we got the tracks back from the producer, we were a little surprised at the quality of the final product. This may be to do with the expectations we had going into the session, so I was wondering if I could get some constructive criticism about the mixes, and whether you think that the studio mix is better (or at least, worth paying for in the future). To avoid any biases, the tracks are all unnamed (other than ABC). One of them is my mix, one the studios, and one our guitarists take on it (which he is convinced is better than the studio). All feedback greatly appreciated (Listening with headphones probably a good idea) [url="http://soundcloud.com/killerfridge/sets/basschat-studio-challenge"]http://soundcloud.com/killerfridge/sets/ba...tudio-challenge[/url] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skol303 Posted August 9, 2011 Share Posted August 9, 2011 For some reason I can't get track A to play on your SoundCloud page (could be my bandwidth or something...?!). But regardless, I'll stick my neck out here and take a punt on track A being the studio cut, even though I can't actually listen to it! Why? Because: -> I'm guessing that track C is your own version, only because it's more subtle than... -> ... track B, which I'm guessing is your guitarist's version, only because it's quite overdriven and distorted with the levels set too high (in my humble opinion); hence his reason for thinking it sounds better than the studio version - because it's loud! Which is typical of a guitarist! So, by the power of deduction alone, I'm going with track A being the studio mix. If it's not track A then seriously, I'd find another studio to work with. I'm certainly no "pro" myself, but I'd be disappointed if I'd paid money for mixes B or C (no offence meant by that at all). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrRatty Posted August 9, 2011 Share Posted August 9, 2011 I like B - OK it is distorted but at least it's clear, has some energy and is much more exciting. A and C both sound muffled to me so with that in common I'd guess that these are your recordings and B is the studio going for a live sound. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Killerfridge Posted August 9, 2011 Author Share Posted August 9, 2011 [quote name='Skol303' post='1333097' date='Aug 9 2011, 01:45 AM']For some reason I can't get track A to play on your SoundCloud page (could be my bandwidth or something...?!). But regardless, I'll stick my neck out here and take a punt on track A being the studio cut, even though I can't actually listen to it! Why? Because: -> I'm guessing that track C is your own version, only because it's more subtle than... -> ... track B, which I'm guessing is your guitarist's version, only because it's quite overdriven and distorted with the levels set too high (in my humble opinion); hence his reason for thinking it sounds better than the studio version - because it's loud! Which is typical of a guitarist! So, by the power of deduction alone, I'm going with track A being the studio mix. If it's not track A then seriously, I'd find another studio to work with. I'm certainly no "pro" myself, but I'd be disappointed if I'd paid money for mixes B or C (no offence meant by that at all).[/quote] Spot on - and no offence taken at all, I know I have no abilities to properly mix anything Especially spot on with B! And yes, A was the studio version, although they appear to be going for, shall we say an underwater sound? This track wasn't actually that bad from them, other than some phasing issues on the Hi-Hats, and the noise gate that occasionally cuts out the guitar and bass. The gripe we have with them is another track that sounds like it was produced by their deaf cousin! Hopefully when we get the masters back from them, we will be able to give it a decent punt ourselves! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skol303 Posted August 9, 2011 Share Posted August 9, 2011 ^ Phew! Well, I'm glad I guessed right I'll try playing track A again tonight and pass on any feedback, for what it's worth. And don't be too hard on your own mixing skills! Your version actually has more potential than B in my opinion, as there's more 'room' in the mix and more scope to produce a decent finished sound from it - rather than simply ramming all the levels up on maximum! Although there is a time and a place for distortion, for sure. If you're not happy with the studio cut then I'd definitely have a go at remixing it yourself, assuming you have the time. It'll save you a bunch of ca$h and it's also a great way of learning about music production, which is itself very useful (as it helps when communicating your 'vision' to other, better studios). Like I said, I'm no professional myself - I'm just a humble home hobbyist! - but there are plenty of very helpful folks on Basschat who know a ton of stuff about music production and mixing. So if you need any help then simply ask - the advice you'll get here is top notch, in my experience. Best of luck! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moonbass Posted August 9, 2011 Share Posted August 9, 2011 Sadly I think the studio version is the worst of the three! The phasing on the cymbals is pretty terrible, and they seem to have forgotten to mic up the kick drum. So many people have Logic or similar nowadays you might be best getting the original tracks from the studio and doing some 'buffing up' yourself as I'm sure they could be made to sound much better with a little time and effort. A. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rimskidog Posted August 9, 2011 Share Posted August 9, 2011 Sadly not all studios are created equally. There's a vast difference between a demo studio and a high end studio (but there's of course a price difference that goes with that too) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archetype Posted August 9, 2011 Share Posted August 9, 2011 Good topic! I can tell B was done by a guitar player who only liked loud things (no supprise) A and C it comes hard to tell, A is more balanced, nothing sticks out too much so I would say that was the studio C is a little more bass up front, so I suspect a home studio. My comments on C is not based on the "bassist mixed it thus bass is most important" idea, but mainly becuase its a common problem with home recordings and bass frequencys. I think home studios are great, for mixing, when it comes t recording you can't beat a pro studio and a producer/engineer who wants to help. But then i have been to many of these "Pro" studios and heard much much worse than any of those mixes. Good job BTW! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrRatty Posted August 10, 2011 Share Posted August 10, 2011 Looks like I must be playing the wrong thickness strings because I still prefer B! I don't think it's because it's louder either since I can turn it down to be quieter than the other two and still prefer it. To my ears the instruments can be heard more clearly, there's more character and more excitement. A and C both sound rather flat & muffled in comparison. I'd keep your guitarist in the loop with the mixing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigRedX Posted August 11, 2011 Share Posted August 11, 2011 B is horrible. It's massively distorted and over-compressed. Sure it sounds exciting for the first minute but then it becomes fatiguing to listen to. C with some sympathetic mastering EQ and compression will sound just as exciting and won't be so hard to listen to in the long term. Out of interest what made you pick the studio that you did? Did you get to hear anything that had been recorded there previously? Also what do you mean by getting the tracks back from the producer? Were you not there for the mixing? By "producer" do you mean studio owner/engineer? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MacDaddy Posted August 11, 2011 Share Posted August 11, 2011 i don't think it's about the recording medium, but the know-how behind it. If I was let loose in Trevor Horn's studio and he had a go on my Boss BR600 it doesn't take an industry expert to work out who will get the best quality recording. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ou7shined Posted August 11, 2011 Share Posted August 11, 2011 It fascinating how different people can make the same pieces of music sound so different. Of course it all depends on what kit they are auditioning it through (my eternal fear). My money is on C but with a bit of B thrown in for aggressiveness. You and the guitarist should get together and do it yourselves. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Killerfridge Posted August 11, 2011 Author Share Posted August 11, 2011 [quote name='BigRedX' post='1336268' date='Aug 11 2011, 11:48 AM']Out of interest what made you pick the studio that you did? Did you get to hear anything that had been recorded there previously? Also what do you mean by getting the tracks back from the producer? Were you not there for the mixing? By "producer" do you mean studio owner/engineer?[/quote] B (guitarist mix) does sound horrible, and to make it worse, either our guitarist or vocalist has just uploaded it to our Facebook site yesterday along with a message stating that it was finished . I have since deleted both message and recording. I have a feeling I may have to take them off the admin list for the page We picked the studio purely from convenience, as well as price. No, we hadn't heard anything by him, although some big(ish) names had used him before. It was also a bit of an experiment to see whether a 'professionally' recorded and mixed track would sound significantly better than the stuff we recorded on our own. We were there for the mixing, but due to time constraints (we had to go before we'd finished a couple of the tracks) we didn't have time to hear the mastered tracks, nor retrieve the original recordings - we will be picking the originals up at a later date. The track that was mixed entirely by the engineer sounds atrocious; I may have to upload that for you to all hear! During the mixing I pointed out that cymbals sounded strange, but neither he or the guitarist could hear it - I asked him to take the gating off the overheads, but they both said it sounded fine, so I got overruled. I think this was down to the engineer being deaf, and the guitarist assuming that he knew what he was doing. I also wasn't too keen on the vocals sounding like they had been recorded underwater, but I assumed that was to do with the studio setup, and not the actual track, because when I asked to dial it back a bit, the reverb was taken down by one notch. And also, yes, studio engineer who thinks he's a producer, rather than an actual producer. Thankfully I have access to some willing producers who will have a crack at the original recordings in September . Also, what sort of EQ-ing might you recommend for C (home recording), as it is currently the only one I can play with? Cheers guys, you've all been a great help Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
51m0n Posted August 15, 2011 Share Posted August 15, 2011 I havent read the posts imbetween, but from your OP I'd say A=studio, B=guitarist (btw you're right, its way overcompressed and harsh, sounds pants!), so C must be yours, it sounds pretty good as a starter, certainly better than the studios attempt. I think C needs some added top, its still a little dull. The problem will be that the cymbals are rather splashy, and may end up over powering things. Having said that SC is pretty poo in terms of audio quality, so on the wav that may sound fine. I'm unsure fomr your OP whether these were just mixed at the studio or tracked there as well, either way if you have the stems they could be almost certainly be remixed to get a better result, assuming you have enough tracks and not too much spill. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
51m0n Posted August 15, 2011 Share Posted August 15, 2011 [quote name='Killerfridge' post='1336366' date='Aug 11 2011, 01:13 PM']B (guitarist mix) does sound horrible, and to make it worse, either our guitarist or vocalist has just uploaded it to our Facebook site yesterday along with a message stating that it was finished . I have since deleted both message and recording. I have a feeling I may have to take them off the admin list for the page We picked the studio purely from convenience, as well as price. No, we hadn't heard anything by him, although some big(ish) names had used him before. It was also a bit of an experiment to see whether a 'professionally' recorded and mixed track would sound significantly better than the stuff we recorded on our own. We were there for the mixing, but due to time constraints (we had to go before we'd finished a couple of the tracks) we didn't have time to hear the mastered tracks, nor retrieve the original recordings - we will be picking the originals up at a later date. The track that was mixed entirely by the engineer sounds atrocious; I may have to upload that for you to all hear! During the mixing I pointed out that cymbals sounded strange, but neither he or the guitarist could hear it - I asked him to take [b]the gating off the overheads[/b], but they both said it sounded fine, so I got overruled. I think this was down to the engineer being deaf, and the guitarist assuming that he knew what he was doing. I also wasn't too keen on the vocals sounding like they had been recorded underwater, but I assumed that was to do with the studio setup, and not the actual track, because when I asked to dial it back a bit, the reverb was taken down by one notch. And also, yes, studio engineer who thinks he's a producer, rather than an actual producer. Thankfully I have access to some willing producers who will have a crack at the original recordings in September . Also, what sort of EQ-ing might you recommend for C (home recording), as it is currently the only one I can play with? Cheers guys, you've all been a great help [/quote] Why the hell were they gating the overheads though??? That is just daft..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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