flyfisher

[quote name='BILL POSTERS' timestamp='1408968637' post='2534981'] Dont you think a plumber gets job satisfaction then ? [/quote] Job satisfaction is different to enjoyment isn't it? I'm sure a plumber gets satisfaction from a job well done, but I'm equally sure that they don't enjoy it enough to choose to do it in the evenings and weekends as well, and for less money.

[quote name='JTUK' timestamp='1408967990' post='2534973'] . . . So, bands don't really help themselves in alot of respects. [/quote] Not really true . . . Bands happy to play for free and helping themselves You may think that's a bad thing because it affects bands trying to earn money, but is it really any different to a shop that sells stuff cheaper than its competitors? We have laws against cartels for a reason don't we?

Or another angle . . . . Given that many live bands need a good audience to 'spark off', perhaps people could form 'audience troupes' to tour around venues and offer their 'services' to help ensure that live gigs really go down well. For a suitable fee of course.

Exactly, and that's the 'problem'. Music is fun. People like to listen to it and they like to play it and they like to see people playing it and they like to have people watch them playing it. When people like something so much, they are prepared to do it for no, or very little, financial consideration. Anyone who wants to make money out of such a thing has to face that reality. Cue the plumber analogy . . . . Except it doesn't really work because plumbing isn't fun. No one really wants to be a plumber so they'll only do it for money. Music just isn't the same sort of thing. Simple fact of life.

Very few people really enjoy doing the same thing over and over again. Variety is the spice of life.

Indeed - that is the dilemma. No easy answer methinks, but I certainly don't believe anyone has a 'right' to earn money playing music just because that's what they wish.

After some false starts and miscommunications over the past weeks we finally played at the Hertford Music Festival's 'Musical Mystery Tour' earlier today. It was a bit worrying that only half a dozen people seemed to have turned up for the first couple of solo acts but it gradually filled up and we ended up playing outdoors to around 50-60 people for about an hour with a half and half mix of originals and covers, including a couple of new songs having their first outing. All in all a pleasant Sunday afternoon.

The 'playing for exposure' point is an interesting one in itself. I'm not a professional musician (not good enough) and the bands I play with are not (good enough) either, but we enjoy playing and gigging and writing our own songs. We have no pretensions about 'making it big' and so the idea of travelling far and wide in order to gain extra exposure is not really one we've thought seriously about. We play mostly for free (beer), but we don't incur any significant costs in doing so because we stay local. We've done a couple of gigs in Wales, but that was for a friend's 'mini festival' weekend and was more of a party really. So I seriously doubt a 'promoter' could entice us into paying to play 'for the exposure', because we're not really interested in the things that would benefit from such exposure.

[quote name='DogHammer' timestamp='1408705768' post='2532718'] I cant believe someone would just walk over and pick up another persons bass! I wouldn't even dream of touching another mans bass without asking. [/quote] This . . . . . [quote name='xilddx' timestamp='1408708734' post='2532780'] Arrogance and disregard for others spans all ages and socio-economic strata. Same as humility and consideration for others. [/quote] . . . and that!

I often play along to music at home on my own. In fact I do that far more than I play/practice with my bass on its own, so I guess it's my main form of practice. But it's really not the same as playing with other musicians, where you can spark off each other, change the style, mood, tempo, etc., whether gigging or not. I wouldn't say one is inherently better than the other, they're just different and we all prefer different things, so it's good to have so many options. Just playing is the first big hurdle to leap.

Playing for free is one thing but paying to play is a step too far, for me anyway. I've also heard of schemes where bands get a slice of the ticket money but only after a certain number of tickets have been sold, so it's a paid gig but you could end up with zero pay. But at least that doesn't mean you're actually out of pocket (well, apart from the usual travel and equipment expenses). I guess there are lots of schemes out there. I wouldn't call them scams as long as the 'rules' are clearly understood and are handled fairly. We're all grown ups and should be able to decide for ourselves.

[quote name='blue' timestamp='1408462442' post='2530436'] Me, I can't imagine a weekend without work. What would I do, read a book, watch TV, go fishing, go to a movie. I would be lost. I really think for my age I'm a minority in more ways than 1. [/quote] Well, you needn't choose just one of those things and do it every weekend. You could try a bunch of different things, including gigging - life's short enough without spending it just doing one thing.

[quote name='EliasMooseblaster' timestamp='1408448804' post='2530198'] I have shared a flat with a guy who admitted he "wasn't really interested in music" and just listened to "whatever's popular." Somebody on a different thread here coined a wonderful phrase of "music for people who aren't interested in music," to describe most of the current chart incumbents, that my former flatmate is now doubt listening to. Presumably such people must have existed in the past? [/quote] Those people would include my parents. Goodness knows where I got my interest in music from. Rebellion I guess.

The other thing to consider is why on earth [u]should[/u] old musicians give up playing. Don't we just get better and better the more we play, at least until physical restrictions kick in? Besides, is there anything better than seeing and hearing a bunch of 'old farts' at the top of their game, effortlessly and absolutely nailing whatever they play? It's all about the music!

[quote name='BetaFunk' timestamp='1408396453' post='2529853'] Music, as in chart and popular music isn't as important to younger people as it was to teenagers in the 60s and 70s. [/quote] I'd say that's a big part of it. Music was a big thing back then, probably because of its relative rarity. If you didn't buy the record then you would only hear it once or twice a day on the radio and if you did buy the record you could only listen to it at home or at a friends house - none of this any time, any place, anywhere business (to coin an equally old advertising slogan!). As to whether the 'old' music is any better than today, well probably not. I'm sure there is just as much tosh from the past as there is now. But, it's quite clear that the good old stuff is as popular with youngsters today as it ever was . . . . at least if FF junior and his mates raiding of my old converted LPs is anything to go by!

That's absolutely brilliant!

I'm not sure I understand the point of a stage earth spike because as I understand things an RCD doesn't use the earth connection to detect an imbalance between the Live & Neutral conductors. Edit: I think I was misunderstanding the position of the RCD. I use an RCD on the outdoor stage and don't rely on the one (if any) in the consumer unit, so there are no long cables back to the RCD on stage. Anyway, I found this document from the IET which gives a good explanation of such things. http://electrical.theiet.org/wiring-matters/20/entertainment.cfm?type=pdf

. . . which you will deserve for taking things seriously enough to double-check things by asking for advice. Good luck with everything and try to enjoy yourself!

Last time I saw BB King he had to sit down for most of the show. Johnny Winter (RIP) played sitting down at the Clapton Crossroads gig a few years ago. If people want to see stage gymnastics then age might be against us but if it's about the music then as long as we can still play then who cares about age? The good thing about being on the 'wrong side' of our mid-50s is that we grew up with some of the best music ever and our audience has grown with us. As the old saying goes: growing old is inevitable but growing up is optional

[quote name='Bassmonkey' timestamp='1408369336' post='2529468'] Give the bands end times rather than start times. So you will offer them say 40 mins ending at 6.00. That will focus them on getting on asap rather than fannying about setting up then still expecting 40 mins (or however long they've been offered) [/quote] Nice psychology there! I've written that one down in my little black book - thanks.

[quote name='skidder652003' timestamp='1408365245' post='2529398'] sound to light mode. NO! School Disco! set them to a slow fade every 30 seconds or so to a different single colour and use the foot controller for black out after each song, makes me feel like Geddy Lee! [/quote] Actually, I didn't really mean sound-to-light in the school disco sense (though I think that would work ok for some songs), I really meant 'sound operated mode' where the lights change colours or 'chase' in response to sound rather than modulate their brightness. The lights I have have this 'auto' switch on them and because of the complexity of DMX control I confess to taking the easy option and just using that!

Yep, slightly different clock speeds (and drift) would be my guess. A multi-channel input device for the laptop would be one answer. Perhaps the only one, unless there is some way to sync the two devices, which I doubt.

TBH, I've not had much luck with creating a 'light show' as such, even though I have various DMX lights and a controller. It's probably because I have too little documentation and don't know enough about DMX! It's fun playing around with them at home but for gigs I just set them up to run in sound-to-light mode or just a simple sequence. I suspect it'll be a while before I can tailor anything to specific songs - in fact it seems more complicated than sound mixing!

I've run a few small outdoor gigs, including one where it rained for some of the time, and the precautions you've described sound about right. Just make sure all the power feeds are via a suitable RCD. I also like to feed everything from a single socket just to be sure everything is on a single phase, though if there is lighting involved then I run that from a separate socket. This assumes the total power draw is within a single socket limit of course. With extension leads, it's a good idea to ensure they are fully unwound as cable on a reel can heat up. Also, try to run all cables where no one can tread/trip on them. I try to run all power above people onto the stage, e.g. Through trees, but it depends on the location. Sound wise, I've always found outdoors a bit easier, especially in terms of controlling feedback. But I have found a need to mic the drums with overheads to ensure the cymbals don't get lost in the mix, as well as a kick mic and subwoofer of course. If you can position the desk sensibly then I reckon if it sounds good to you then it will all be fine.

[quote name='Paul S' timestamp='1408349331' post='2529118'] HJ those are very good, thanks for the link. I have a single bar set which I would like to augment but hesitated because of the extra tripod - your very workable idea has solved that! I wonder if the lights can all be connected to work in unison, even though different manufacturers? [/quote] In theory, any DMX lights should be able to be controlled together, regardless of manufacturer.