Pirellithecat

I may be kidding myself! I've just swapped (reversed) the white and black wires from the pickup into the Volume Control. Also removed all the grounding wires (Bridge/ Copper shielding). And it seems much better! I've tried reversing the reversal (with no additional ground) and it reverts to muffledness. Very difficult to know whether the change will be as positive through the bass rig .... but I'll reinstate some grounding wires and try it out at rehearsal on Thursday. If this turns out to be the issue I shall be very pleased!!

HaHa..... Well, my ears a very definitely on their way out! Which is why even a slight reduction in the upper registers are so important. The Strings are new(ish) GHS Basics (following on from d'addario NYXL's). I think that using TI's and used in the context of playing Blues it would be fine and it could be that my expectations are unrealistic. If I I remember correctly, when it was strung with TI flats it was great ..... until I took it to a Jam Session where the resident bassist was using a Mark Bass Head set up for a very bright SX Jazz Bass. I literally couldn't hear the notes that I might have been playing! Pick-ups - they are stock 1990's Squier Japan - could well be the problem ...... maybe I'll swap them out but the only ones I have "spare" that will fit are SD PB1's - good reminder - I'll do that now. I wanted to put my EMG Geezer Butler's in it but this would require routing as the "pocket" is insufficiently deep. Any suggestions on a decent pickup which isn't too "dark"? Currently using a Genzler Magellan 800 which is certainly not muffling anything. In terms of recording, a) I've never done that so not sure how I'd get a representative tone. b) My ears tell me that clips of basses even on good quality headphones are not really representative and, most of all ........c) without the heavy disquise of lots of drums and crashing guitar NO-ONE would want to hear me playing ANY bass on its own! I'll have a play with strings and pickups this evening.

Good idea, I think over time he may come round to this. At the moment I think he's uncomfortable with the "look" but we'll try some decent headphones at rehearsal over the coming weeks to see if the sound "benefits" motivate change. Softly softly catchee Monkey and all that ............ Actually, may be in search of the impossible. I don't think we sound bad, many people complement us on our sets. Few mention "it's too loud", but whilst the Excellent may be the Enemy of the Good, I feel that if we could all hear what was going on better, we would play better, the songs would end up tighter, and the individual instruments would contribute better to "The Song" rather than just the overall impact of the sound.

Haha, it's a labour of love! Or maybe a fools errand! But it'll be a slow process. The sound is a lot better on stage and the feedback issue is pretty well sorted except for the drummer. He has a less than ideal mic, so if we can improve that and work on appropriate monitor positioning, I'm hopeful we'll get on top of the situation. Just need to get the overall volume on and off stage under control after that. Optimistic that a little PA support for backline will allow a reduction of backline volume so it's a work in progress. 🤞🤞

2 steps forward, one back! Drummer doesn't like IEM's so wants his monitor back! Very loud gig last night and drum monitor leads to feedback. Got it controlled but it's touch and go. I can borrow a Shure SM58 Beta for the next Saturday's gig, but are there any thoughts on mics for drummers (which are not too prone to feedback)? Going to try mounting his monitor on a stand to get it pointing directly at his ears. Anything else I can do? Except REDUCE THE VOLUME!!

Yes, you're right Pick transforms the sound! Sadly I'm unable to use a pick for anything more than the simplest of pieces........ I'll keep trying ...... it's a lovely bass to play! Ta!

Bigger "performance area" than usual on Saturday. Changes made One monitor (rather than up to 3) IEM's for me and drummer Better Mic/monitor positioning Mic sensitivities done pre gig Monitoring set up after FOH volume. New guitar cab - portrait angled top vs on floor to ankle. IEM's for me and drummer Increased FOH speaker vol/reduced mixer gain. Sneaked a bit of guitars into front of house instead of cranking volume ....... Results No feedback! Still very loud out front Loud but not painful on stage IEM's not very successful in consistently getting right mix (any mix for me). Needs work if we are going to continue to uses them for drummer. Even without any actual mix (tech issues?) IEM's good in term of noise reduction but being able to hear. For drummer we will need to add overhead Mic(s) to capture all drums in IEM mix. Drummer could sing without feed back - great benefit. So, either a benign venue or the changes are having an effect! We went down a storm so just for fun, here's the band in action!!

Hmm - I wonder what the common-or-garden-pub-gigging-band's budget is? Am I right in thinking this is around £1400? Might be a compelling argument for going digital? I must become more brave ...........

Bloody hell - and I'm worrying about too complex! How long does it usually take to get set up and sound check? I guess with experience (and less back line) it gets easier/quicker? I ask because at our upcoming gig we follow a band who nominally finish at 8pm. No shared gear so they have to clear away before we can make a start setting up (PA, Drums, Monitors, Backline, Sound Check) and be ready to start at 9pm. If they have an encore - we're stuffed! In preparation I shall watching replays of Formula 1 Pit Stops! Thanks for the detail though - very useful!

Yep - had it all apart last night and the tone pot is OK. It works in so far as it increases "muffledness" when rotated anticlockwise!! But good thought.

I suspect that you might be right! However, when I listen to other players using P Basses I don't notice the "muffledness" but that could very well be that, from the audience point of view, everything sounds the same😂 I really should try an alternative , but it has to be at home, as in shops I find it difficult to really judge the sound as I'm usually hijacked by the action/playability and my ears seem to have a "shop filter" . But that would be the definitive QC check!

Pickup Height - well.... I've just checked that and it might be a tad too low .... so I've taken everything apart, put new "foam" under the pickups and re-assembled. Not sure it sounds any different, but I'll reserve judgement until I take it to rehearsal on Wednesday. I've actually also reduced the relief on the neck and adjusted string height and intonation - certainly this makes it a little better to play but I'll leave it overnight and check it all tomorrow once everything has settled down a tad. It does play really nicely, and the 40mm neck is great and it might be that I'm expecting too much tonal variation from an "old" P bass. On the Cobalt front, I've tried these in the past and find the D'addario NYXL's brighter ... I currently have GHS Bass Boomers on it just to experiment, but these don't really improve things over the NYXL's. But good thought. I'll report back after rehearsals.

Yep - reduce sound levels first then think about different/more monitor mixes 👍 I can (have) used the EQ controls on the Monitors. Basically rolled off the bass and fiddled with the Mids/Treble to get meaningful info out of the monitors without feedback (as far as I can with the Laney anyway!!). Cheers everyone - 4 rehearsals and 4 gigs in the next 4 weeks so I'll see how I get on and report back.

That's interesting. If I'm successful in reducing our stage volume, won't the Drummer find it (even more) difficult to hear the guitars and bass especially if he uses IEM's? Whilst i wasn't thinking of putting the guitars, drums and bass through the Vocal monitors, my trials with IEM's, so far, indicate I need vocals, guitars, bass (.... and might even be tempted with a little drum to improve the "lock-in" between bass and drums) via my monitor feed. Am I missing something?

🤣 Great! ...... so that'd be 4 monitor feeds (Bass, Drums, 2 Vocals) ... and we've recently replaced our mixer with a nice new shiny Mackie 16ProFX ........ with 3 Aux Sends!!!! 😳Doh! But you are right. I'll start trying to sell all my "spare" gear (and maybe a kidney) to fund a 4 Aux send mixer - any suggestions!! What were you using on Saturday - great sound with several monitor feeds and not enormous in terms of "footprint". Great crowd response too - how did Sunday go?

Thanks - I'm trying to use Xvive U4 currently - bit of a learning curve but fingers crossed it'll help. Yep, I've tried EQing the monitors and it certainly helps, but to get to the required volume they are still prone to feedback. Clearly if we can manage the volume we'll help with the feedback. Concerning the choice of an analogue desk, in hindsight this was a mistake. I was worried about the learning curve/complexity, the reliability of the connection and the ability to reach over mid song and deal with issues whilst playing, but I probably should have bitten the bullet. Any thought on the idea of doubling up the monitors so that we replace one large one with two more compact ones so that each vocalist can get the level they need rather than the higher level they need when sharing? Does the ability to position each monitor closer to the relevant person's ears and in better alignment with the Null area of their Mic outweigh the fact that there might be more sound overall from the sum of the sounds of having 2 Monitors rather than 1? VSmith1 of this Parish has very kindly just leant me the reference book mentioned above, together with another tomb, so I'll have a look at those over the next few days and see if I can find Nirvana! Much obliged!! Thanks all!

I do need to work on the positioning of the band members/monitors on the stage - that's a very good point. Might require a bit more "negotiation though ....... We currently use a single monitor shared between the vocalist and the guitar player who also sings. If we "split up" the vocalist and guitar player I suspect we would need another monitor. I'm wondering whether that might actually be a good idea anyway, as each individual monitor would have to cover a smaller space and consequently be able to be quieter. Each monitor would also be more able to be positioned in the Null Zone of each Mic. One is an SM58, the other an SM58Beta. In the rehearsal space the bass cab is not near a wall - it's centrally placed in the room, at least 2meters away from the nearest wall. I'm trying to measure the volume of overall sound pressure waves reaching my ears rather than the bass volume. The (doubtless approximate) sound-meter app seems to suggest that we are a tad loud and that it's not just my perception or aged ears. I've re-read the info on SM58 placement relative to a monitor and we're pretty much in line with that, except the wall behind the vocalist in the rehearsal space. So next steps are - use 2, different monitors - away from the reflective wall and in the null zones of the mics. If this helps, negotiate the position of the band members on stage. (This would also be really helpful as it would move me away from the Crash Cymbal!.)

Thanks Phil, Progress I think. Taken at above/behind the bass rig (a bit further away from everything than my ears), and using Backline plus 2 Vocal Monitors, NO MAIN PA Speakers. Peak levels at rehearsal (accepting all caveats) were 115dB. This at 3metres from Drums, Guitars, and 2 meters from monitors. Most songs in the 107 - 112 range with peaks at 115. This was using Backline and 2 vocal monitors Didn't tell the band until the end. They were shocked, We agreed to monitor it some more and try to reduce levels. 115dB's at the topography of the rehearsal space suggests that the levels for someone playing (drummer) or standing on top of the Crash Cymbal (me) will be exposed to levels significantly higher than 115 - I'll measure at next gig. The drummer tried IEMs again and once his drums are Miked up - he might be OK with using them - he still feels isolated from his drums etc .... but work in progress. I'm still trying IEM's, but find that, I can't really tell what the bass actually sounds like "out front" so without a "Sound guy" that makes live a bit tricky - but I'll see how this evolves. One remaining issue is that the main vocal monitor, in front of the Vocalist, seems excessively prone to feed back. At volumes she can hear herself properly it feeds back erratically. Shure SM58 Mic, Laney CPX12 Monitor. could be reflections from wall immediately behind her, rehearsal set-up positioning, horrid monitor - or useless bloke on mixer (me)! All in all though a step in the right direction Thanks everyone for continuing input.

Very interesting ...... whether dB's are relevant or not I'm with the band tonight so I'll see what output my cab is (dB) in the context of the overall sound levels (at my ear or thereabouts) Is the 120dB at 1metre?

I see there's a nice one going on here .......

Not sure this is in line with the question, ..... but...... I have been using a Studiomaster Sense 12+ as a floor monitor in a noisy band. No drums but Vocals/guitar/+/_Bass. I found it to be better than my RCF Art 710 even with the latter on a pole. It's a very neat (small) footprint as it has a concentric driver and is relatively light and inexpensive. It can also be pole mounted.

Most weekends my right ear is closer to the Crash Cymbal than is the drummer's left lug hole, ...... I'm clearly doomed! 😲