xilddx

[quote name='ironside1966' post='949356' date='Sep 8 2010, 12:44 PM']I can see where you are coming from. Most of the bands I have played with where very tight and slick with little room for maneuver, and I like bands like that. Some genres of music like jazz, rock and blues improvising is part of the makeup. IMHO in song dependent music there should be a musical reason for improv, if it is done to impress the musicians on the audience then its back to the old is he a musician or a bass player.[/quote] You see clearly

[quote name='jakesbass' post='949224' date='Sep 8 2010, 10:40 AM']Sounds a little to me Nig that the only justification you seek is for your own state of understanding. I might also venture that your observations sound more like an argument raging in your head that any convicted position (I could be wrong) despite some quite convicted statements in your posts various. My take on it is that music deftly and beautifully escapes the conditions you're trying to constrain it with, and I would cite the following as evidence. Early classical music was happily defined and along came Bach an arch improvisor, the world of Pop bass (having evolved from one of THE most improvised art forms history had known, Jazz) was plodding along in simple enough form and along came Jamerson... These are just 2 examples in the world of music that defy condition. Further, in every case and example between and there are millions, reside proponents great and small, (sticking to bass now) from a Jaco Pastorius, through a Marcus Miller, an Entwhistle ..................etc............... down to yo and I, All just trying to make the best music we know how. Sometimes that requires a bit of solid 'what I have always played' and sometimes 'a little flare'. What it doesn't (in my experience at least) generally require is a set of strict conditions to make it work (even though they CAN work) which makes for a tough definition... if you see what I mean..... or... Shut up [/quote] Bugger, I was hoping you would stay out of this one

[quote name='arsenic' post='945406' date='Sep 4 2010, 02:20 PM']That is looking really, really nice - The white body will really set it off. [b]Will the narrower string spacing on the Ric bridge have any effect on the string alignment over the pickup pole-pieces and along the neck to the nut?[/b] Edit for managing to spell "really" - 3 totally different ways [/quote] It does, but I think I can get away with it. The saddles are adjustable for string spacing so at their widest they are more or less acceptable. Cheers.

[quote name='Earbrass' post='949193' date='Sep 8 2010, 10:10 AM']Kettle, kettle, come in kettle, this is pot. [/quote]

[quote name='JMT3781' post='948861' date='Sep 7 2010, 09:45 PM']I did 3 years of a module called "Improv" at uni.. which taught you not only soloing on your instrument within a pop band.. but each week you would find yourself in a different band, even on the day of the assessment, the bands would shuffle round minutes before the exam, giving you two minutes to hastily come up with a structure between yourselves, and away you go. Its been really helpful for me, both as a regular in a band and as a dep. It increases confidence and improves your ear... all in all getting you through some tough gigs and ones where the luxury of preparation wasn't available.[/quote] Interesting, but that doesn't necessarily justify improvisation. What that is is training your ears and musical mind to adapt your playing to something unfamiliar, which is great. It allows you to get the structure of a piece of music and play within it. I improvise all the time, just not on stage. I think in most cases it is completely inappropriate.

[quote name='JMT3781' post='948898' date='Sep 7 2010, 10:13 PM']Check my earlier post Silddx Just my little oppinion hope your well mate... used the Kopo on a recording. Pure sex.[/quote] I am well mate, hope you are too Glad to hear the Kopo is getting some love! I'm going through all these posts now

[quote name='bubinga5' post='948911' date='Sep 7 2010, 10:25 PM']We are like bus drivers, and I do not want to get on a bus with a bus driver who likes to improvise. i dont think there is any thing wrong with playing an [b]improved part [/b]out of vanity, as long as that vanity doesnt overtake the song...i love to hear great bassist showing off from time to time and so do some of the audience...[/quote] Improved according to whom?

[quote name='thodrik' post='949030' date='Sep 8 2010, 12:48 AM']If I want to hear a brilliant composition, I'll probably listen to Mozart, Vivaldi, Stravinsky or some other guys that really mastered the concepts of theory, harmony and melody, not a person that attempts to justify boring simple plinky-plonk bass lines as being 'all that is needed', and that any deviation from root and fifth notes to be pointless and unnecessary. For me less is more only if you are capable of more or know why you need less, otherwise less is simply less.[/quote] More lofty prejudice.

[quote name='thodrik' post='949030' date='Sep 8 2010, 12:48 AM']Frankly I think that if none of your band can improvise it can make for a very dull band and often means that they are unable to adapt to anything unusual (string break, drummers skipping a beat etc) in the context of a gig.[/quote] This is what I mean, there is some prejudice here that if you [b]don't [/b]improvise that means you are not capable of doing so. My bands are eminently capable of improvising, but we don't because it would detract from the impact of the carefully crafted songs. There is also evidence in this thread that improvisation should be used to tart up music which would otherwise be dull. So stop playing dull music.

[quote name='ShergoldSnickers' post='949085' date='Sep 8 2010, 08:12 AM']I'm on tricky territory here as the band I'm in only ever improvises. That's the whole point in our case. With nothing to learn (except how to listen and how to play with restraint), we can just turn up to a gig and play. For as long as required. We make no claim to be fantastic musicians, but we enjoy what we do and it's immense fun. We keep getting asked back to various venues so we think we are doing something right - primarily managing to find venues that will have an audience that is more conducive to what we do. It does vary in content sometimes sounding jazzy, sometimes like prog rock or moody film music. And sometimes just plain barmy or wrong - that comes with the job. We limit ourselves in time to each 'number' having a large clock on stage - the final minute concentrates the mind into having a stab at stopping together. There's certainly no-one else in the area doing what we do, but if we thought for one minute that we were only torturing an audience - we'd stop gigging at least. None of us are too proud to be told the truth as others see it. I'm not sure your comments would really apply to my band in any case silddx, as the whole point is that the entire band improvises and I'm therefore left with no option but to join in. [/quote] You sir, are exempt

[quote name='Doddy' post='949039' date='Sep 8 2010, 01:39 AM']When is a good time to improvise on stage? Let's take a typical 12 bar rock and roll/blues changes. You may be playing a typical I,III,V,VI walking pattern for the majority of the tune,and then during a solo the soloist might play a lick or pattern that catches your ear,so you play a reacting line to it. Or you may start climbing into a higher register which then causes the soloist to play something that reacts to your playing. In these cases you are improvising in 'popular music' and hopefully taking the music into a slightly different direction,all by reacting to what you have heard and improvising a line. If you have a large enough vocabulary on the instrument,you are more likely to be able to improvise 'musically' and be able to react to the music being played than if you know two or three 'licks' that you churn out all the time.[/quote] And that is why blues evolved into jazz. There aren't many musicians around with a "large enough vocabulary on the instrument" who are content to continue playing 12 bar.

[quote name='dood' post='948848' date='Sep 7 2010, 09:32 PM']I have always truly believed that when it comes to trying to communicate or express a feeling through my chosen instrument, it should be as fluid as conversation itself - and that is what I strive toward. Hell - I have a long way to go but to build up a musical vocabulary that flows from the speakers like speech itself is like nirvana for me I reckon. And what is day to day conversation? It's closer to improvisation than reading off the page for sure! So for me, improvisation is very important. You can still stick rigidly to the framework of a song in much the same way that a bunch of people will talk about a certain football manager or whatever - you'd look a bit stupid going off on a tangent about hatstands and hyperthirculators - but my point is - freely improv' in context. I feel that if you never improvised - how would you ever come up with new ideas? It's jamming that can help gel musicians together and 'bond' musically too. my thrupenny-bit[/quote] That is precisely what I'm getting at, Dan. I come across very, very few musicians with those sorts of, and that developed level of, conversational skills. It is very rare and takes special people. I freely admit I hear stuff in my head when I'm playing live, and play it. But it's usually for selfish reasons, vanity, adrenaline and the like. And it usually sounds wrong, Normally I reserve any improv for rehearsal and if it works well it gets incorporated into the song and becomes "written". We have a proper job to do, us bassists. We are like bus drivers, and I do not want to get on a bus with a bus driver who likes to improvise.

I've been remiss in not making it clear in my OP that I mean in a live setting. So if you play in a "popular music" type band, when is a good time to improvise on stage? And what is the reason for your improvisation?

[quote name='aj5string' post='948813' date='Sep 7 2010, 09:05 PM']Totally depends on what you mean by improvisation... Do you play exactly the same bass line every time you play a song? If not, surely your improvising then?[/quote] I mean real improvising, not chucking in tired old stock fills to show off, or out of boredom.

Is there a point? Unless you play jazz I can't see one. The occasional inspired extra note here and there, sure, but studying improvisation on a bass!?! It seems ridiculous. Learn to cook instead, it's much more useful and pleasing for other people. It sounds like a recipe for cheating your audience to me. Only musicians will feel any "magic" happening, and that magic will be VERY rare. The audience won't get it anyway, and why not compose something beautiful in the first place. For me, improvisation on a bass is for jazz and pompous tits who convince themselves it's entertaining. I wish they would realise NO-ONE GIVES A sh*t. EDIT: I mean in a live setting.

[quote name='deathpanda' post='948328' date='Sep 7 2010, 02:29 PM']King Crimson - eleKtriK other music just seems totally irrelevant right now.[/quote] Interesting. I'm listening to Fragile by Yes, and reading Bill Bruford's autobiography, both of which are excellent.

RATS!RATS!RATS! Deftones. Stunning, in all senses of that word.

[quote name='derrenleepoole' post='948178' date='Sep 7 2010, 12:16 PM']Most fat dub tracks [/quote] Nah, most good dub pedals around root 5th octave.

[quote name='AndyTravis' post='945116' date='Sep 4 2010, 01:14 AM']This makes me cry inside...and i'm fairly tolerant. Jesus Christ, f***ing awful... If that's what a bass trem means, then f*** bass trem.[/quote] You can tell an enormous amount about a player by their use of vibrato, and I can tell that geezer's an unmusical c***.

I'd like some gentle blue side LEDs, and I think dood's are very tasteful. But generally they look rank.

Kit Richardson live at The Old Queen's Head, Angel, London I really am loving these black silk gloves

Bump.

Thanks gents I need to work on the body a bit, it's not cut exactly right so I need to take a bit off here and there. 95% there though!

[quote name='Marvin' post='944837' date='Sep 3 2010, 06:48 PM']They won't let me look unless I join. [/quote] Oh, I didn't realise that, that's odd. Sorry. Here you go .. The plan I gave to my mate. The raw unfinished body - it weighs 4.25lbs .. As you can see, it needs some slight profiling work with the sanding block, but not much. He got a little overeager with his new routing pin in the control cavity which has eaten a little into the pickup route, but only by a few mm. Dead easy to sort. The neck socket is as tight as a duck's intimate circle. The whole ting. Just got to get the pickguard made by John Shuker now. Close ups of the body and headstock, with the gold Hipshot Ultralites and the D-tuner, brass JANIII. The only issue really is the max string spacing on the Hipshot Ric Replacement bridge is kind of too narrow, stupid me hadn't even thought to measure it. I might get away with it. If I decide I want a standard bridge, I will flog the Ric one on here. The John East Pre is immaculately built. Next job is to get the body ready for its Oly White nitro paint job. Cheers

[quote name='Marvin' post='940967' date='Aug 31 2010, 02:05 PM']Traitor. BTW I can't get that link to work you traitor Oooo look they've got a big Bill Fitzmaurice forum bit! Tempting, tempting. (^I knew that was there already though )[/quote] Pics now up on FB. [url="http://finnbass.com/showthread.php?p=113167#post113167"]http://finnbass.com/showthread.php?p=113167#post113167[/url] Cheers