What do we make of Danny Sapko?

[peteb]

4 minutes ago, Woodinblack said:

 

You don't think that people might not want to be in a blues jam? Sorry to be the bearer of disappointing news but not everyone would enjoy that. 

 

That's fine, in that case the simple solution is don't go along to a blues jam.

 

However, you said that you don't think 'there are many people who couldn't play at a blues jam'. That is certainly not true! Plenty of people think that because they know what a pentatonic scale is, therefore they can play blues because it's easy. Then they get upset when it becomes obvious that they suck. 

 

If you have the technique to play a relatively complex heavy metal riff and can play in time, then you're good to go (to a certain level). Same with most other genres. Just about anyone can play a blues scale and know a couple of blues licks, but that doesn't mean that you can play the blues convincingly and when you are playing blues, there is no way to hide behind basic technique. You really have to know how to interact with the other players on the bandstand and have a bit of melodic nous not to sound completely cr*p. Nothing will find out a poor player quicker than a blues jam! I would suggest that one of the best things you can do to become a better musician is to learn how to navigate a blues jam, even if playing the blues is never going to be your main thing. 

 

[Steve Browning]

1 hour ago, Jackroadkill said:

 

Steve, perhaps I should have given more context.  I had a very unwelcoming and even humiliating experience as a young man.  It was really grim; I was 18, had no live experience and only very basic chops.  I didn't realise it at the time but it was basically an excuse for one or two flash bastards on the local scene to polish their egos and belittle other players.  I was thoroughly belittled, to the point of being told that I couldn't play for toffee and should give up and stop wasting everyone's time.  I'm certainly not going to tar all blues jams with that brush, and have subsequently been involved with plenty that have been great, but that first experience nearly saw me giving up before I'd started.

 

 

That's an awful introduction to live playing and commiserations for having to endure that. There certainly are some guys who are happy to be a big fish in a tiny pond.

 

Good that you came through that and weren't disheartened. I would hope the organiser banned them from playing. 

[peteb]

1 hour ago, Jackroadkill said:

 

Steve, perhaps I should have given more context.  I had a very unwelcoming and even humiliating experience as a young man.  It was really grim; I was 18, had no live experience and only very basic chops.  I didn't realise it at the time but it was basically an excuse for one or two flash bastards on the local scene to polish their egos and belittle other players.  I was thoroughly belittled, to the point of being told that I couldn't play for toffee and should give up and stop wasting everyone's time.  I'm certainly not going to tar all blues jams with that brush, and have subsequently been involved with plenty that have been great, but that first experience nearly saw me giving up before I'd started.

 

 

 

That goes against the whole point of inviting relative novice players to get up at a jam. The idea is that inexperienced players can get the opportunity to learn how to play with other musicians and develop their playing, especially how to busk / improvise. 

 

I would hazard a guess that the guys who slagged you off were not that great themselves! I'm glad that you had better experiences with later blues jams. 

 

[Misdee]

4 hours ago, peteb said:

 

That's fine, in that case the simple solution is don't go along to a blues jam.

 

However, you said that you don't think 'there are many people who couldn't play at a blues jam'. That is certainly not true! Plenty of people think that because they know what a pentatonic scale is, therefore they can play blues because it's easy. Then they get upset when it becomes obvious that they suck. 

 

If you have the technique to play a relatively complex heavy metal riff and can play in time, then you're good to go (to a certain level). Same with most other genres. Just about anyone can play a blues scale and know a couple of blues licks, but that doesn't mean that you can play the blues convincingly and when you are playing blues, there is no way to hide behind basic technique. You really have to know how to interact with the other players on the bandstand and have a bit of melodic nous not to sound completely cr*p. Nothing will find out a poor player quicker than a blues jam! I would suggest that one of the best things you can do to become a better musician is to learn how to navigate a blues jam, even if playing the blues is never going to be your main thing. 

 

Totally this. 

 

Blues can be many things, and a lot of them ain't easy. Listen to Robben Ford play blues and imagine having to back him up. 

 

Firstly, how does move through the changes? Not all blues is 1-4-5, and even if it is you need to make it sound good. What and where are the turnarounds? What cliches are the right ones?

 

I know we're only talking about a jam night but if it's with an audience and not in your mate's front room you don't want to show yourself up.

Edited 2 hours ago by Misdee

[Jackroadkill]

12 minutes ago, Steve Browning said:

That's an awful introduction to live playing and commiserations for having to endure that. There certainly are some guys who are happy to be a big fish in a tiny pond.

 

Good that you came through that and weren't disheartened. I would hope the organiser banned them from playing. 

 

Yeah, I didn't like it much!  Still, I'm still playing so I must have learned a bit from it.

 

5 minutes ago, peteb said:

 

That goes against the whole point of inviting relative novice players to get up at a jam. The idea is that inexperienced players can get the opportunity to learn how to play with other musicians and develop their playing, especially how to busk / improvise. 

 

I would hazard a guess that the guys who slagged you off were not that great themselves! I'm glad that you had better experiences with later blues jams. 

 

 

I'd had this idea that it might be a good place to learn how to play live, and envisioned a crowd of old sweats who'd nurture the youth; sadly not. in this instance!

[mep]

OK, enough of all this talk about blues jams (go and create your own thread for that boring nonsense)

 

Dany rules, and this is our new logo!

 

Edited 6 hours ago by mep
Edited from BESHCHAT TO BEHSCHAT. I'm from Devon and don't speak Northern!

[Jackroadkill]

2 minutes ago, mep said:

OK, enough of all this talk about blues jams (go and create your own thread for that boring nonsense)

 

Dany rules, and this is our new logo!

 

Beshchat?!

[SimonK]

3 minutes ago, mep said:

OK, enough of all this talk about blues jams (go and create your own thread for that boring nonsense)

 

Dany rules, and this is our new logo!

 

Is this for those of us who need a few pints in the system before being able to play live at (blues) jams?

[peteb]

5 minutes ago, Jackroadkill said:

I'd had this idea that it might be a good place to learn how to play live, and envisioned a crowd of old sweats who'd nurture the youth; sadly not. in this instance!

 

That's the whole point of jam sessions like that! 

 

Some of the most memorable nights of my musical 'career' have been blues jam sessions (admittedly with semi-known experienced players, rather than with novice players getting up)! 

 

Edited 6 hours ago by peteb

[Woodinblack]

1 hour ago, peteb said:

That's fine, in that case the simple solution is don't go along to a blues jam.

 

Thanks!

 

1 hour ago, peteb said:

However, you said that you don't think 'there are many people who couldn't play at a blues jam'. That is certainly not true! Plenty of people think that because they know what a pentatonic scale is, therefore they can play blues because it's easy. Then they get upset when it becomes obvious that they suck. 

 

I didn't say they wouldn't suck. I would think many of them would suck, but then so do a large number of guitarists playing blues too, for the same reason. And they don't get upset because its obvious they suck because to them it appears completely unobvious that they suck, even if it is obvious to everyone else that it is painful.

 

Not criticising anyone for going to one if that is what they enjoy, and any way of getting new people their first exposure that is hopefully better than the experience mentioned above is good, but for me it is not going to be enjoyable. 

 

[TimR]

3 hours ago, TimR said:

I suggest some people maybe taking some comments too literally. 😀

 

Bedroom virtuoso players who can't play with other musicians or lay down a track when the red light comes on?

[TimR]

Just now, TimR said:

 

Bedroom virtuoso players who can't play with other musicians or lay down a track when the red light comes on?

 

Yes, that's what I was trying to get at.

[LawrenceH]

I've always felt it's a bit of a shame how in the UK 'blues' became synonymous with 'electric guitar' and a particular restrictive formula. I remember growing up a lot of blues jams being held to ransom by a certain type of guitarist that meant I lost interest in the genre. One in particular, where a (good) keys player was told by the guitarist/singer that he just wanted repeated 8th notes at the top, nothing else, giving the guitarist all the space for his widdling.

 

It was seeing the big US names at successive Bishopstock festivals in the 90s that taught me how diverse and musically accommodating 'real' blues is. John Mayall was the only UK performer I remember who was near their level.