How was your PA last night?

[Chienmortbb]

On 18/11/2025 at 15:28, synthaside said:

Last night ... " well saturday" ... our PA failed , We had to spin our  Monitor round and crank it to make up with it ... as a Fully ampless band this was a bit of a disaster.

The right side of the Mackie Industrial  ART 200A  would not transmit any sound from the main speaker ...  the Horn/Tweeter was producing sound confirming that  it wasn't a power issue or a mixer send issue , I confirmed  this swapping it and in my post mortem testing sunday ... when i cracked it apart hoping to find a simple issue like a loose terminal connection and within my cack handed ability to mend.

Sadly is seems one of the EQ block's is soggy / rotten 😐

Annoying ... but we've had to rush order a new EV PA ahead of next weekend's gig , the band voted with their wallets after being let down by used gear.

 I have found the circuit diagram for this speaker, and it uses fairly conventional analogue circuitry.  It is not a high-powered speaker, using three LM3886 amplifier chips, two for the LF and one for the HF. I have to say that Mackie run this chip very close to its maximum voltage unless the LF speaker is 16 ohms. Happy to have a look at it if you like. IMHO, useful as a monitor, but not FOH. 

[jimmyb625]

On 21/12/2025 at 16:01, Steve Browning said:

I went for the TS312s on foh and 310s for monitoring. On larger gigs we add a 312s sub.

That's the same setup I used to have (except for the 310's). It's a great rig for the price.

I eventually got hold of a 315s as there was a b-stock item going for a ridiculous price (£120 off the top of my head). It's good, but definitely not as easy to move around as the 312s.

[Al Krow]

9 hours ago, jimmyb625 said:

That's the same setup I used to have (except for the 310's). It's a great rig for the price.

I eventually got hold of a 315s as there was a b-stock item going for a ridiculous price (£120 off the top of my head). It's good, but definitely not as easy to move around as the 312s.

 

We've got a sub on our wish list now that we've got a band member who is able to store and transport it!

 

I appreciate a single 15" sub is usually considered inferior to two 12". But did you notice a significant improvement of the 15" over a single 12"?

[synthaside]

On 22/12/2025 at 13:31, Chienmortbb said:

 I have found the circuit diagram for this speaker, and it uses fairly conventional analogue circuitry.  It is not a high-powered speaker, using three LM3886 amplifier chips, two for the LF and one for the HF. I have to say that Mackie run this chip very close to its maximum voltage unless the LF speaker is 16 ohms. Happy to have a look at it if you like. IMHO, useful as a monitor, but not FOH. 

Thank you for the offer but I ended up taking it to the recycling centre on the clean up for Xmas , I felt bad but its been recycled at least....  we're using the surviving one as a side fill as it's got a smaller footprint than our current wedges.

[Phil Starr]

20 hours ago, Al Krow said:

 

We've got a sub on our wish list now that we've got a band member who is able to store and transport it!

 

I appreciate a single 15" sub is usually considered inferior to two 12". But did you notice a significant improvement of the 15" over a single 12"?

Hi Al, I wouldn't worry about this, though as ever real world experience counts for a lot so I'd always respect anyone who has tried both.

 

I think in your position you need to be looking for quality and practicality, you have great tops so don't cut corners with your sub(s). From the looks of your videos your band should make decent money so cost shouldn't be too much of an issue. 

I have a pair of Wharfedale EVP 15" subs. Old, heavy and reliable but they onle get used once a year on average. In smaller venues they are a liability, sonically and space wise. Last year I picked up a nearly new RCF 905 AS Mk3 and its rated output matches that of the pair of Wharfedales. I've done small outdoor festivals with those so that's as capable as I'll ever want to be. Indoors I don't think I'll ever need more. A mates soul/funk function band are going round with a pair of 2x8 FBT subs and they sound great so size isn't everything especially with that sort of music, which is close to that which you and I play. I'll add a second 905 probably if I see one going cheap but that will be for the look and the odd outdoor gig. I don't think I'll ever need it but is would give me the opportunity to run cardioid subs, if I ever get the space to set that up. I don't think you'll ever need it but you could run with a single decent 15" sub for quite a while and then judge if you need a second.

Your tops are rated 133db and the AS905's are rated the same you could go to the RCF8003's which are rated 135db to match both your tops with a single cab but at the expense of a 43kg lift and an extra £500. That's the same as my Wharfedales and they are quite a carry, one of the main reasons I upgraded.

 

So the only reason for going for 2x12's is to get the 'look' of a sub each side and a lighter carry. The look is important to a function band though. A pair of 12's is going to give you plenty of output but so is a 15 of the same quality. It's going to cost you more and may or may not be more convenient to transport. Basically I'm saying don't base your choice on speaker size. Look at the spec's but be very sceptical of them, the specs are advertising not technical measurements in most cases but they help within a brand for comparisons. Each brand exaggerates but by a fixed amount. Look at functionality, quality gear from the likes of RCF, FBT and Yamaha aren't going to let you down.

 

[Al Krow]

Thanks Phil!

 

"A pair of 12's is going to give you plenty of output but so is a 15 of the same quality." is a very helpful summary 

 

So the key question for me then is: is a single 15"speaker going to be significantly better than a single 12" speaker for a sub? 

 

The 2 x 8" FBT sub is not one I had considered, though and one to look into, but seems to be an alternative to a 12" sub i.e. typically go with a pair rather than just one?

Edited 4 hours ago by Al Krow

[Phil Starr]

1 hour ago, Al Krow said:

So the key question for me then is: is a single 15"speaker going to be significantly better than a single 12" speaker for a sub? 

 

I can't answer that  

 

it all depends upon where you are going to use them and how they are used. There's no reason why they shouldn't sound the same at low sound levels. However making loud bass is af everything else is equal question of shifting lots of air and a big piston will outperform a little one if everything else is equal. Thats about cone area so you can work it out . Roughly thats 250cm^2 for an 8, 530 for a 12 and 850 for a 15. That's comparing like with like. The rcf 702 gives 129db, the 705 gives 131db and the 905 133db in their spec sheets. You'd have to decide for yourself whether the extra 2db or 4db would be needed. Remembering also that 2x 12" 702's are £1470 and 1x 905 is £1150. The 12's weigh in at 42kg and the 905 at 31kg so tht is a factor too.

 

I doubt that in practice a single 12" sub would outperform the 12" speakers in your ART 932's, so I think only a pair of 12's make sense

[Al Krow]

Thanks Phil - the 2 x 12s at 21 kg apiece are actually an easier carry between them than a single 905.

 

I actually did a bit of spec comparison across 8 different 15" active sub-woofers and interestingly the three that came top for me on £price, weight, SPL and reputation for quality were:

 

Subwoofers - 15in active summary.pdf

 

The overall winner on my personal criteria was Electro-Voice EKX-15SP. A mate of mine uses a pair of Electro-Voice EKX-12SP, and I'm wondering whether I can sub (excuse the pun!) those two 12" with a single 15".

 

The RCF 905 AS-3 should definitely go on the list, too, and maybe will be a case of seeing which of those comes up in good condition used first!

Edited 1 hour ago by Al Krow