Dankology Posted February 18 Share Posted February 18 (edited) Just trying to track down the route of an issue... Last night my bass went silent just before the last two songs of the set. It's a Jazz with EMG JVX pickups which run off a 9v battery tucked behind the control plate. At first I thought I'd muted the amp - no. Amp on/off - nothing. Tried my back up (passive) bass - nothing. Back to the Jazz via a couple of DI boxes - nothing. At which point I gave up. The soundman came up to me afterwards and said he was convinced it was the bass - and sure enough when I messed around while packing down, the Jazz was still silent while the Rick seemed fine. So I assumed it was simply the 9v in the Jazz dying and in my flustered state I'd somehow muted the amp when trying to swap to the Rick. But when swapping the battery today, the old one was reading at something like 7.2 on the multimeter which some light Googling leads me to believe should be sufficient for most purposes. Plus running the bass on the old battery into an amp at home seems fine. Also, I seem to remember the last time the battery went, there was a period of distorted sound that gave me adequate warning of imminent failure, rather than the apparent sudden cut off as last night. I've checked my lead and the wiring inside the Jazz and all seems well. I don't have access to the amp I used last night at present so I can't check that properly yet. But what are the panel's thoughts re the voltage on the old battery - is 7.something volts likely to be the culprit here and in resting the battery overnight I'm just getting a brief final surge of power on testing today? GIven that I was getting nothing through the DIs, I'm thinking the bass is the most convincing explanation but why is it working so well this afternoon and why did the passive back up bass seem to be silent last night too? Edited February 18 by Dankology Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mottlefeeder Posted February 18 Share Posted February 18 A multimeter does not load the battery, so you will get a slightly higher reading than when the battery is in use. Also, the voltage droops as the battery discharges, but it will recover a bit if left alone for a while. Put back into service, it will not last long, but it may allow the circuit to operate again for a while. David 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boodang Posted February 18 Share Posted February 18 (edited) 7.x volts means the battery is history! Plus it’s just a PP3, replace it already! Edited February 18 by Boodang 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bass_dinger Posted February 18 Share Posted February 18 I tend to replace batteries once a year, regardless. Now, however, I have a battery tester, and use that once every few months. I have had a working active bass on 7 volts, and less. But that was my bass (Washburn XB500), which doesn't help you. There is a circuit that I have, but never fitted*, which lights an LED when the voltage drops below a certain predetermined level. You might set such a circuit to 7.5v, so that it never reaches the 7.2v that tripped you up. * one of my old basses would run off of 5v, and my spare (same model) had a 10 year old battery in it that still worked! I then bought a new bass that had an active/passive switch, so I no longer needed it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EliasMooseblaster Posted February 18 Share Posted February 18 Some devices will work fine down to a lower voltage, others will complain or crap out as soon as the battery dips below 8.9V! As a cheapskate who likes to wring every last coulomb out of a battery, I've found that pedals and active basses will start to complain a lot earlier than, e.g., digital tuners or metronomes, so the higher-demand devices get treated to fresh batteries, while my tuner gets the hand-me-downs. See also bike lights vs remote controls, when it comes to AAAs... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dankology Posted February 18 Author Share Posted February 18 Thanks for the replies. It turns out it was a combination of issues. My lead had an intermittent loose connection as did one of the spade connectors to the output socket. While sorting this out, one of the other spade connectors (from the tone pot) crumbled... I couldn't bodge a repair of the spade connector but remembered belatedly that I had a whole set of unused EMG connectors in my spares drawer. All seemed well with the older battery but I've replaced that anyway. Will just have to remember to replace that wee connector cable in case I ever sell the spare pickups I nicked it from. Not sure I'm entirely convinved of the benefits of these plug and play solderless connector systems - seems like more points of potential failure with the added bonus of making a simple soldering iron fix more problematic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boodang Posted February 18 Share Posted February 18 Why are people being so stingy about replacing a silly pp3!!! Especially when the options are new battery vs bass packing up half way thru a gig. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boodang Posted February 18 Share Posted February 18 4 minutes ago, Dankology said: Thanks for the replies. It turns out it was a combination of issues. My lead had an intermittent loose connection as did one of the spade connectors to the output socket. While sorting this out, one of the other spade connectors (from the tone pot) crumbled... I couldn't bodge a repair of the spade connector but remembered belatedly that I had a whole set of unused EMG connectors in my spares drawer. All seemed well with the older battery but I've replaced that anyway. Will just have to remember to replace that wee connector cable in case I ever sell the spare pickups I nicked it from. Not sure I'm entirely convinved of the benefits of these plug and play solderless connector systems - seems like more points of potential failure with the added bonus of making a simple soldering iron fix more problematic. Of course, if you want to minimise the points of potential failure just go passive, so much less to worry about. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dankology Posted February 18 Author Share Posted February 18 15 minutes ago, Boodang said: Of course, if you want to minimise the points of potential failure just go passive, so much less to worry about. I think there's a logical conclusion to that train of thought that involves not playing at all... 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boodang Posted February 18 Share Posted February 18 10 minutes ago, Dankology said: I think there's a logical conclusion to that train of thought that involves not playing at all... Absolutely, once you go passive you’re a hairs breadth from giving up completely. Replacing pp3 batteries is what gives meaning to our entire musical existence! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boodang Posted February 18 Share Posted February 18 Actually I think there’s a lot to be said for going passive beyond the mere technical, and certainly not the start of a journey towards not playing at all. I’ve got a passive jazz, a passive Di (stagebug)…. less to worry about means I’m not focused on setup and focused on the gig, the music and performance as opposed to chasing down which bit of kit has failed me now. In fact, thinking about it, maybe going active is a step towards not playing at all as now you’re more focused on the technical side and losing sight of why you’re there! Just an idol existential train of thought of course. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cato Posted February 18 Share Posted February 18 (edited) 1 hour ago, Dankology said: At first I thought I'd muted the amp - no. Amp on/off - nothing. Tried my back up (passive) bass - nothing. This makes me think there's more than a dead battery going on here. Unless you'd accidentally knocked the volume on your passive bass down to zero (we've all been there) then with neither bass making a noise then the issue is almost certainly further down the signal chain. Edited February 18 by Cato 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EliasMooseblaster Posted February 18 Share Posted February 18 1 hour ago, Dankology said: My lead had an intermittent loose connection as did one of the spade connectors to the output socket. While sorting this out, one of the other spade connectors (from the tone pot) crumbled... ... Not sure I'm entirely convinved of the benefits of these plug and play solderless connector systems - seems like more points of potential failure with the added bonus of making a simple soldering iron fix more problematic. I'm with you here: don't know if it's just companies using cheap spade connectors, but I've had amps spontaneously fail on me, only to open them up and realise, yep, it's one of the spade connectors on the power switch. Must have got a bump going down the stairs because it's just popped right off the terminal. Easy enough to fix, but it makes you worry if the next time it's going to fall off will be the middle of a song! Obviously I can see the benefits of a solderless system - easier to fix, surely! But if they were harder to break in the first place, you wouldn't be fixing them as often. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimR Posted February 18 Share Posted February 18 Operating voltage of a PP3 is 7.4 volts. Strange but true. If it drops below that it won't work. It's late and I could go into internal resitance and multimeters with infinite resistance. But if it measures 7.4v it's good. Some electronics will tolerate a 'dead' battery better than others. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted February 18 Share Posted February 18 3 hours ago, bass_dinger said: I tend to replace batteries once a year, regardless. Yup, that's me too. January's job is replacing all the batteries in all current gigging basses, and checking all the others. 3 hours ago, bass_dinger said: There is a circuit that I have, but never fitted*, which lights an LED when the voltage drops below a certain predetermined level. Ooh. Do you have a schematic of said circuit, pretty please? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bass_dinger Posted February 18 Share Posted February 18 59 minutes ago, Rich said: Ooh. Do you have a schematic of said circuit, pretty please? I bought it from someone on basschat.co.uk so it is not something that I designed. However, I should still have the circuit, unused, and looking for a bass to be installed into. Contact me, if you wish, and I can share details. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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