Setting Pedal Gain (Compressor)

[Rodders]

Hi All, 

 

I understand there probably isn't a foolproof way of doing this as every gig and rehearsal is different. I wanted to ask how do I go about setting the gain on my compressor (Keeley Bassist) vs the gain and master volume on my amp so that everything cooperates happily. 

The only other thing I have on my board that has a volume adjustment is a Radial Bigshot I/O, if that makes any difference. 

 

Any and all advice is much appreciated.

[ped]

Is this an input gain? You want to set the gain so that your bass sends enough signal to the compression circuit. Too low and the pedal won't do anything, too high and it'll squish too much. Once set you shouldn't need to adjust it again unless you switch instruments. 

[Rodders]

7 minutes ago, ped said:

Is this an input gain? You want to set the gain so that your bass sends enough signal to the compression circuit. Too low and the pedal won't do anything, too high and it'll squish too much. Once set you shouldn't need to adjust it again unless you switch instruments. 

 

Yes I think so, if I'm understanding the Keeley's controls correctly, how do I know when I'm sending just enough signal? I had wondered why at times the compressor wasn't doing much and at times I was wondering if it could be the cause of distortion..

[ped]

It's why metering is useful on compressors like the MXR, but you can tell by setting your desired ratio and backing off the gain until it does what sounds best, probably upping the output to match. I'm not familiar with the Keeley but they mostly act in the same way. More gain in = more immediate crossing of the threshold into the ratio you set. Time to play!

[Rodders]

Thanks Ped, much appreciated Sir! I will give it a go!

[ped]

No probs, someone will no doubt be along to correct me but that's how it's always worked in my head! As for your amp, it's kind of the same - gain up until you feel it reacts best, whether that's slight saturation or the best signal/noise ratio, then output vol to taste. Usually the best place is so that the gain clip light flashes when you play your hardest, which is basically doing the same as an indicator on a compressor would do, except on an amp it overdrives the preamp, on a comp it starts to compress or limit.

[thodrik]

I have had the Keeley Bassist for  about 7-8 years. 

I honestly don't think about it too much. I think I use it 'wrong' but I generally work from left to right on the pedal:

 

- first I set the compression level (i.e. how much do I want to compress the signal?)

- then I set the threshold (i.e. when do I want the compression to kick in?). The LED will change when the compression kicks in so it is easy to tell when the compression is working; 

- then I set the gain (i.e. how loud the output signal is). 

So I kinda use the gain control as a master volume for the pedal as per the specs it is not an input gain but an output gain. https://robertkeeley.com/product/bassist-compressor/

If you turn the compression completely off you can use the pedal as volume boost by pushing the gain control. Since people associate 'gain' with input gain it probably would have been better if the 'gain' control on the pedal was called 'volume'. 

 

 In the whole time I have had the pedal I don't think that the gain control has been lower than 11 o'clock or higher than 1 o'clock. 

 

[Jakester]

12 minutes ago, thodrik said:

then I set the threshold (i.e. when do I want the compression to kick in?). The LED will change when the compression kicks in so it is easy to tell when the compression is working;

 

For the OP I think this is the key point.

[ped]

Ah I see, yes in that case the threshold's your boy

[pete.young]

I think this refers to "make-up" gain, boosting the output signal to make it the same volume as the uncompressed signal. When you compress the signal you are likely to lose some volume.

 

I do the same as Thodrik with my Becos, which has a similar set of controls, and use the mk. 1 earhole to raise the compressed volume to the same level as the uncompressed (pedal off) volume once i've got the desired amount of compression.

[ped]

I wrongly assumed the Keeley has an input gain and output level, most of the comps I’ve used have that setup

[Osiris]

The user manual for the Keeley says that the Gain control is for adjusting the output volume to make up for any volume drop as a result of the compression. I'd paste in the definition but my crappy little tablet won't allow me to copy the appropriate text for whatever reason 🙄 so here's a link to the manual for anyone interested - 

 

https://robertkeeley.com/woo/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/GC2BassistManual.pdf

 

As I understand it there are 2 different types of gain control, some compressors use one type whereas other designs use the other. The first, like the Keeley has what is often called make-up gain. It's used to boost the compressed signal back up to unity i.e. the same volume as when the pedal is bypassed. So to answer what @Rodders is asking, set the threshold and ratio to how you want them, then use the Gain control to adjust the output volume to the same level as when the pedal is on or off. You can also use it as a boost too but you'll likely raise the background noise level by doing this.

 

The other type of gain control is like @ped says, where it controls the level of the input signal against a fixed threshold, I seem to think that 1176 designs use this type of gain design.

 

I could be wrong on all of this but that's how I understand they work and differ in their designs.