DEEP switch

[Iheartreverb]

After years of playing with the deep switch I'm finding it near on impossible to like anything else. Which is silly considering this is my crappy practice amp in my spare room.

Now the deep switch adds 8db at 50hz which other people are telling me is crazy!
Surely it's not that crazy if it is achieved easily by an EQ slider and is fitted as standard to loads of Ashdown Gear?

Any thoughts/advice people?

[Moos3h]

Don't worry about numbers, let your ears tell you if it's working or not.

Ss long as there is no unwanted distortion evident and you like the sound then all is well.

[Graham]

You might, though not definitely, find in a live mix it doesn't sound good with that much bass in your tone, but if it sounds good to you for practice in your spare room then that's all that matters.

[Dave_the_bass]

The beauty of the Ashdown switches (IME) is that you can engage them for home practice at low volume and have a lovely rich tone. When you get in to a full band setting you can turn the switches off, turn the volume up, and have a similar tone that sits nicely in a full band mix.

[Iheartreverb]

[quote name='Dave_the_bass' timestamp='1386494157' post='2300566']
The beauty of the Ashdown switches (IME) is that you can engage them for home practice at low volume and have a lovely rich tone. When you get in to a full band setting you can turn the switches off, turn the volume up, and have a similar tone that sits nicely in a full band mix.
[/quote]

Sort of my problem is that I can't mirror that tone without that switch and I'm currently looking at pedals such as a Boss Bass EQ and EHX mole to do a similar thing.

I play in an instrumental rock band so there's lots of times where my bass is more at the front playing over ambience and stuff so I have to think about more that just how to sit in a mix with everyone else

[Beer of the Bass]

A few years ago I had one of the early MAG combos, the 1x12" tiltback version. Being a small un-ported box, the deep switch helped to counter the lean bass response of the cab, so I used to use it all the time. This turned out to be a problem, as the DI out was post EQ, and I didn't realise I was sending something to the FOH which sounded like a dub record, when the sound I actually wanted was much more neutral. I did this for ages until I heard recordings straight from the board from a couple of gigs and realised what was going on...

[Guest bassman7755]

The problem with extreme EQ is that it is not just changing the tone of individual notes - it is boosting the volume of some notes at the expense of others.

if we look at the range of notes around 50hz midpoint:
E[sub]1[/sub] 41.20 837. F[sub]1[/sub] 43.65 790. F[sup]#[/sup][sub]1[/sub]/G[sup]b[/sup][sub]1[/sub] 46.25 746. G[sub]1[/sub] 49.00 704. G[sup]#[/sup][sub]1[/sub]/A[sup]b[/sup][sub]1[/sub] 51.91 665. A[sub]1[/sub] 55.00 627. A[sup]#[/sup][sub]1[/sub]/B[sup]b[/sup][sub]1[/sub] 58.27 592.

You can see that this will lead to a massive increase in fundamental volume of the notes around the bottom E and A strings. In any gigging or recording situation this likely to result in 2 things: the mix level of the bass being either overpowering or inaudible depending whether you are playing notes in the boosted zone, and the sound being generally hard for listeners to discriminate the actual notes your playing since our brains tend to use overtones to perceive pitch especially when your get down to low 100s of Hz.

[JTUK]

Deep switches OR too much bass is a tone killer... IMO.

I think you need to practice with the sound you use live.

[Iheartreverb]

[quote name='JTUK' timestamp='1386509544' post='2300816']
Deep switches OR too much bass is a tone killer... IMO.

I think you need to practice with the sound you use live.
[/quote]

Thanks for advice. I really don't have a "live" sound. I have a bedroom sound and then a practice room sound I don't like because it doesn't sound like the bedroom.
I'm only just moving into a proper practicing and gigging situation

[Iheartreverb]

[quote name='bassman7755' timestamp='1386509042' post='2300809']
The problem with extreme EQ is
[/quote]

But is it THAT extreme? It's a standard function on some brands and only notch up on one slider of an EQ?

I really appreciate your input, this is exactly why I posted it here. I'm struggling to get my heard around firstly why it is seemed to be that extreme when so many players have a EQ pedal and secondly why everything minis this function seems harsh and horrible.

[deepbass5]

There is a reason we all like bass, but it has more to do with how our ears work
If we go back to the old Trace graphic amps when funk was King, and I guess when Mr King was Funk we all had a big smiley face on a graphic amp, to counteract our hearing deficiencies.
Deep switches and shelving Eq's are a good thing IMO. But where we need to be careful is in the harmonics that follow after the fundamentals and continue to emphasize the bass. Make sure these low frequencies you have dialled in don't bloom all over the mix, so you may need to cut the low mids 200Hz < 500Hz depending on the room. So a parametric Eq may be very handy. (three knob with Q are best)
As much as I love my Mark Bass and my GK mb500 fusion, the contours centres are fixed on these popular lightweight heads and do not always deal with the bloom that is a consequence of boosting the Lows.
So my input would be experiment with cutting mids either on a good bass preamp (j-retro) or foot pedal parametric.

[Guest bassman7755]

Personally I think that overall EQ on a bass guitar signal should be used primarily for environment compensation e.g. like you would do on your home stereo, and not for "tone".

The best place to establish your core bass tone is via pickup type/placement/mix because all notes are affected more or less evenly.

Bare in mind that views on this are probably not widely held (even if they are right )

[Thurbs]

I plug a Little Giant (1000w version) in to a midget T and hitting the deep switch turns the cab from a angry monster to a whole world of earth shattering bass, even at full volume.

[Musky]

[quote name='Iheartreverb' timestamp='1386516182' post='2300904'] But is it THAT extreme? It's a standard function on some brands and only notch up on one slider of an EQ?

I really appreciate your input, this is exactly why I posted it here. I'm struggling to get my heard around firstly why it is seemed to be that extreme when so many players have a EQ pedal and secondly why everything minis this function seems harsh and horrible. [/quote]

It's extreme because that 8dB represents an increase of over six times the power at 50hz. That can be a real threat to your speaker(s) if you start pushing up the volume. The fact that EQ shaping offering greater levels of boost is available on most amps doesn't mean it can be used with impunity - after all most rooms are equipped with plug sockets, but they need to be treated with a degree of respect as well.

I'd imagine that as this is a practice amp it's being used at relatively low volume and most likely isn't capable of producing much in the way of low bass. Using the deep switch is a way of compensating for this, and if the volume is kept corresponding low things stay within the speakers limitations.

You don't say what amp you're using for rehearsals with the band, but if it's sounding harsh you should probably looking to tame the upper mids and treble. It's the overall balance of frequencies you want to adjust, rather than boosting particular frequencies. Don't be afraid of cutting to get the sound you want. Boosting the low mids can do wonders for beefing up your sound as well.

Alternatively the harshness could be the speakers complaining if you're giving them massive amounts of boost at low frequencies...