Bass Scales

[Nate Caplan]

Hi

i'm by no means an expert, but i was surprised to read on the comments below this video saying that there are different scales for basses and guitars? i always thought that a scale was a scale?


[url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ljwKdwuCniQ&lc=HHZdqGjK7iyLEn-QXiyiIin6WIl2pzV5LNu5bXKTcqM&feature=inbox"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ljwKdwuCniQ&lc=HHZdqGjK7iyLEn-QXiyiIin6WIl2pzV5LNu5bXKTcqM&feature=inbox[/url]

so i'm not sure if i'm embarressing myself by being ignorant. i'm franks dad100 (on the comments section)

can anybody enlighten me?

[risingson]

I didn't read the comments, but a scale is a scale. You play a C major scale on a bass, it'll be musically identical to playing a C major scale on a guitar. The only difference between the two instruments is the facility to play much lower notes on a 4 string electric (a low E on electric bass is one octave lower than a low E on a guitar), as well as each instrument's tonal characteristics.

Disregard any misinformation about scales being different on either instrument, it simply isn't true.

Edited January 24, 2012 by risingson

[thepurpleblob]

Where does it say that? I read through a few pages of comments and couldn't see anything about different scales. There were (of course) some comments about scale *lengths*. Sure you weren't getting confused with that?

[SteveK]

[quote name='thepurpleblob' timestamp='1327411119' post='1510703']
Where does it say that? I read through a few pages of comments and couldn't see anything about different scales. There were (of course) some comments about scale *lengths*. Sure you weren't getting confused with that?
[/quote]
Don't know if it's OK to copy and paste from YT. If not, Mods can delete.
This is the quote:
"Some bass scales involve notes that wouldnt sound too great playing on the guitar octave. the lower bass octave allows said notes to blend in and become more viable."
Absolute tosh!
As risingson says, a scale is a scale.

[Nate Caplan]

i thought so. feel free to back me up on you tube. thanks for clearing that up.

[risingson]

[quote name='Nate Caplan' timestamp='1327414749' post='1510815']
i thought so. feel free to back me up on you tube. thanks for clearing that up.
[/quote]

I would say a better idea was to never be drawn into commenting on anything on Youtube. Far too many people who like to think they're some kind of authority on subject 'X', despite having literally no idea what they are talking about. You're never ignorant for asking questions.

[Fat Rich]

[quote name='SteveK' timestamp='1327412641' post='1510740']
Don't know if it's OK to copy and paste from YT. If not, Mods can delete.
This is the quote:
"Some bass scales involve notes that wouldnt sound too great playing on the guitar octave. the lower bass octave allows said notes to blend in and become more viable."
Absolute tosh!
As risingson says, a scale is a scale.
[/quote]

I don't think the YT poster was saying that scales on bass are any different to scales on any other instrument, just that you can play more exotic scales on bass because of the lower register.

If you played some of the notes that Jamerson played on Motown, but with a bright zingy tone or on a brighter instrument people would look at you like you made a mistake. On a bass with a nice fat wooly sound it just creates a bit of passing tension without drawing too much attention to what's causing it.

[Nate Caplan]

well he clearly makes a reference to bass scales. you say you couldnt play some of the licks that jamerson played on guitar. thats about licks tho, not scales. i've tried looking up the difference between a bass scale and a guitar scale and i couldnt find anything. a scale is a scale then!

[Fat Rich]

Licks all come from scales (well most do anyway unless you're some kind of octaves only slap fiend), often with a few out of key notes to create tension or to lead to the next chord.

A lick could come off a diminished scale or maybe a whole tone scale, they would sound pretty out there on some instruments but you can get away with a lot on bass. And if you go too far and really mess up just give the guitarist a frown and shake your head, everyone will think he messed up. By the end of the song, he'll probably be thinking he messed up.

Edit: Clarified the slap comment so as not to start the old slap arguments again

Edited January 24, 2012 by Fat Rich

[BottomE]

[quote name='Fat Rich' timestamp='1327416616' post='1510861']
I don't think the YT poster was saying that scales on bass are any different to scales on any other instrument, just that you can play more exotic scales on bass because of the lower register.

If you played some of the notes that Jamerson played on Motown, but with a bright zingy tone or on a brighter instrument people would look at you like you made a mistake. On a bass with a nice fat wooly sound it just creates a bit of passing tension without drawing too much attention to what's causing it.
[/quote]
I read it like this too - and i agree.

[Alec 'Aleb' Mills]

I just wonder whether this guy is talking about chords and their inversions?
Like a D7 with D in the bass sounds a lot better than a D abouve the chord, as there is no lower 'pulling power' for the chord, so to speak.

[musophilr]

Is it true that although the scales themselves are the same irrespective of instrument, there are some fingerings that work better on one instrument than another?

EG classical guitar scales often are organised to that they can be played "in position", which means the player can find a bass note and a melody note within reach, whereas the strictly 3 notes per string scales the rock widdlers use require at least one position shift and cover 2 octaves and a fourth.

Does a bass player use "stretch fingering" on the lower frets to play a 3-note-per string scale? I think you'd need big hands to do that.

So wouldn't the question be about fingerings suitable for basses being not necessarily the same fingerings you'd use on a guitar?

[SteveK]

[quote name='Fat Rich' timestamp='1327416616' post='1510861']
I don't think the YT poster was saying that scales on bass are any different to scales on any other instrument,just that you can play more exotic scales on bass because of the lower register.

If you played some of the notes that Jamerson played on Motown, but with a bright zingy tone or on a brighter instrument people would look at you like you made a mistake. On a bass with a nice fat wooly sound it just creates a bit of passing tension without drawing too much attention to what's causing it.
[/quote]I'm going to have to ask for an example, because I honestly don't have a clue what you're saying.

[crez5150]

What's the luckiest note in the scale?
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
,
D, because it has a flat by the C.


Coat....

[steve-soar]

[quote name='crez5150' timestamp='1327449181' post='1511607']
What's the luckiest note in the scale?
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
,
D, because it has a flat by the C.


Coat....
[/quote]keep coat in cloakroom, that was good.

[steve-soar]

I think someone has just hit me in the back of the head with a brick. What is going on?

[EssentialTension]

Scales don't vary from one instrument to another instrument.

[EssentialTension]

[quote name='Fat Rich' timestamp='1327416616' post='1510861']
I don't think the YT poster was saying that scales on bass are any different to scales on any other instrument, just that you can play more exotic scales on bass because of the lower register.

If you played some of the notes that Jamerson played on Motown, but with a bright zingy tone or on a brighter instrument people would look at you like you made a mistake. On a bass with a nice fat wooly sound it just creates a bit of passing tension without drawing too much attention to what's causing it.
[/quote]
If you copied a Jamerson line exactly, but one octave higher (i.e. on a guitar), it would sound fine. It might not be what any of the Motown guitarists would have chosen for their line but it wouldn't sound like a mistake.

[risingson]

[quote name='musophilr' timestamp='1327443768' post='1511468']
Is it true that although the scales themselves are the same irrespective of instrument, there are some fingerings that work better on one instrument than another?

EG classical guitar scales often are organised to that they can be played "in position", which means the player can find a bass note and a melody note within reach, whereas the strictly 3 notes per string scales the rock widdlers use require at least one position shift and cover 2 octaves and a fourth.

Does a bass player use "stretch fingering" on the lower frets to play a 3-note-per string scale? I think you'd need big hands to do that.

So wouldn't the question be about fingerings suitable for basses being not necessarily the same fingerings you'd use on a guitar?
[/quote]

The space in between frets on the bass guitar does mean that beginners learning scales will be subject to an unnatural amount of stretching in the hand, but initially this should be compensated by choosing to learn finger-per-fret patterns higher up the neck, say on the 8th fret of your E string (C) to avoid wrist pain and then to creep down the neck as the hand begins to adapt.

I find that position playing from both bass and guitar are easily transferrable as concepts, but the approach to touch with each instrument should be compensated for with good technique. I would argue there are more subtleties dynamically to be had from playing electric guitar than bass, depending on what music you're playing. But bass and guitar's close relation to each other means that the underlying concepts of position playing remain very similar, until you run up against the major 3rd interval that gets thrown up with the G and the B on guitar.

[xilddx]

Notes are notes. Scales are scales. A kiss is just a kiss.

[EssentialTension]

[quote name='silddx' timestamp='1327451681' post='1511663']
Notes are notes. Scales are scales. A kiss is just a kiss.
[/quote]
A is just a

[originalfunkbrother]

[quote name='silddx' timestamp='1327451681' post='1511663']
Notes are notes. Scales are scales. A kiss is just a kiss.
[/quote]

A chair is still a chair.

[musophilr]

[quote name='risingson' timestamp='1327451233' post='1511651']
The space in between frets on the bass guitar does mean that beginners learning scales will be subject to an unnatural amount of stretching in the hand, but initially this should be compensated by choosing to learn finger-per-fret patterns higher up the neck, say on the 8th fret of your E string © to avoid wrist pain and then to creep down the neck as the hand begins to adapt.

I find that position playing from both bass and guitar are easily transferrable as concepts, but the approach to touch with each instrument should be compensated for with good technique. I would argue there are more subtleties dynamically to be had from playing electric guitar than bass, depending on what music you're playing. But bass and guitar's close relation to each other means that the underlying concepts of position playing remain very similar, until you run up against the major 3rd interval that gets thrown up with the G and the B on guitar.
[/quote]

Thank you, that's helpful.