lobematt Posted August 10, 2011 Share Posted August 10, 2011 I have searched for this but found threads about Jazz basses and Corvette Stds haha, I'm just looking for a couple of jazz standards that have fairly common chord changes that can be applied to a fair few songs. Thanks in advance! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muzz Posted August 10, 2011 Share Posted August 10, 2011 Moondance! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doddy Posted August 10, 2011 Share Posted August 10, 2011 Blues Changes and Rhythm Changes (The changes to 'I Got Rhythm') are both used for a load of standards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bilbo Posted August 10, 2011 Share Posted August 10, 2011 Best ones in bold..... [b]12 bar blues (thousands) Rhythm Changes (thousands - I can name 48)[/b] All Gods Children Got Rhythm (5) [b]All The Thngs You Are (6) Cherokee (9) Confirmation (5)[/b] Fine and Dandy (6) [b]Honeysuckle Rose (8)[/b] Sweet Georgia Brown (6) Back Home Again In Indiana (5) [b]What Is This Thing Called Love (6)[/b] Love Me Or Leave Me (6) [b]Out Of Nowhere (5)[/b] Lady Be Good 6) [b]How High The Moon (6)[/b] Pennies From Heaven (5) Acknowledgement to David Bakers How To Play Bebop Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bilbo Posted August 10, 2011 Share Posted August 10, 2011 [quote name='Muzz' post='1334867' date='Aug 10 2011, 12:37 PM']Moondance! [/quote] I can delete posts, you know Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowdown Posted August 10, 2011 Share Posted August 10, 2011 Autumn Leaves is another one for getting your ears tuned into 2/5/1, and the circle of fifths (or circle of fourths) Garry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bilbo Posted August 10, 2011 Share Posted August 10, 2011 Summertime. Actually, the past 5 posts give you the requisite material to gig successfully for the rest of your life. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lobematt Posted August 10, 2011 Author Share Posted August 10, 2011 [quote name='Bilbo' post='1334912' date='Aug 10 2011, 01:01 PM']Summertime. Actually, the past 5 posts give you the requisite material to gig successfully for the rest of your life.[/quote] Cheers, that's the plan haha!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bilbo Posted August 10, 2011 Share Posted August 10, 2011 You will, of course, bore everyone senseless and become part of the problem that is killing jazz in the provinces: stagnation. Learn them then never play them again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lobematt Posted August 10, 2011 Author Share Posted August 10, 2011 Not that I'm particularly well educated in jazz but I'd have to disagree with that. Surely making the changes your own and what and how you choose to play through them is what jazz is about? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bilbo Posted August 10, 2011 Share Posted August 10, 2011 [quote name='lobematt' post='1334953' date='Aug 10 2011, 01:21 PM']Not that I'm particularly well educated in jazz but I'd have to disagree with that. Surely making the changes your own and what and how you choose to play through them is what jazz is about?[/quote] Yes and No. In the course of researching my Paul Chambers biography, I interviewed a guy called Dan Pliskow from Detroit who had the same teacher as Chambers. He sent me his own biography which included the set list from his very first gig in 1953. It consisted of Stella By Starlight, Autumn Leaves, All The Things You Are etc etc. THe model of taking standards and 'making them your own' has some legitimacy historically but the reality is that most people who play these tunes are regurgitating cliche after cliche. As a listener and jazz fan, it bores me rigid. For the lay person, I can see why they would walk away. The best traditions of jazz are of improvisation, innovation and exploration. The 'repertory' movement will turn Jazz into a museum tour. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lobematt Posted August 10, 2011 Author Share Posted August 10, 2011 I see your point and I have always wondered how so many famous jazz musicians get away with just playing 'covers' (as I used to call them in my even less educated days!) But as you said, if I learn them changes well I can gig for the rest of my life on them and in a toss up between earning money for playing my bass and the risk of boring seasoned jazz musicians I know which way I'm going to go with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doddy Posted August 10, 2011 Share Posted August 10, 2011 [quote name='lobematt' post='1334979' date='Aug 10 2011, 01:32 PM']But as you said, if I learn them changes well I can gig for the rest of my life on them and in a toss up between earning money for playing my bass and the risk of boring seasoned jazz musicians I know which way I'm going to go with it.[/quote] In fairness though,you won't earn much money playing jazz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lobematt Posted August 10, 2011 Author Share Posted August 10, 2011 Maybe not but along side function gigs, lessons and whatever else I can get my hands on it all goes towards earning a living from making music. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bilbo Posted August 10, 2011 Share Posted August 10, 2011 [quote name='lobematt' post='1334979' date='Aug 10 2011, 01:32 PM']But as you said, if I learn them changes well I can gig for the rest of my life on them and in a toss up between earning money for playing my bass and the risk of boring seasoned jazz musicians I know which way I'm going to go with it.[/quote] I was being facetious. The material we are discussing is getting more and more tired and there are fewer and fewer places that will tolerate it. Most credible jazz venues are turning their backs on this 'model' of jazz in favour of more contemporary forms. All you will be left doing is playing retirement dos and 80th birthday parties. If your motives are entirely mercenary, form a tribute band. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faithless Posted August 14, 2011 Share Posted August 14, 2011 Tired material? No offense, Bilbo, but I think it's the way You are looking at it. You see, the problem today is that lots of upcoming jazz cats want to look hip and play 'todays' stuff like Robert Glasper, etc, without studying tradition- bebop, and then wondering why their stuff is not happening. What's really turning Jazz into museum thing is not the old stuff - its the tandem of todays 'modern' stuff + the ability to record and get it to the daylight for any w***er who thinks that his stuff is worth as much attention as Pat Metheny's new album. I'm back to shedding Autumn Leaves, seriously. easy Laimis Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bilbo Posted August 14, 2011 Share Posted August 14, 2011 Knock yourself out, Faithless. I never buy standards cds and am reluctant to buy any cd with even one standard on because its lazy programming. If anyone has anything new to say on Autumn Leaves, let me know. Until then, I stick with 200 versions I already have and listen to some of the new stuff! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faithless Posted August 15, 2011 Share Posted August 15, 2011 [quote name='Bilbo' post='1340136' date='Aug 15 2011, 12:37 AM']Knock yourself out, Faithless. I never buy standards cds and am reluctant to buy any cd with even one standard on because its lazy programming. If anyone has anything new to say on Autumn Leaves, let me know. Until then, I stick with 200 versions I already have and listen to some of the new stuff! [/quote] Ok, will do, but I can bet all these guys could play bop before they done this: What I'm missing about your opinion on this - how do we get our head around jazz - from the day one checking out Glasper rather than Lester Young? You must be kidding me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bilbo Posted August 15, 2011 Share Posted August 15, 2011 There is a myth around that you have to start at te beginning at work your way through it all to get to the stuff we hear today. There is some value in the idea but it is not the only way to make sense of the concept of improvisation or of swing etc. As the path from King Oliver to the Glasper's of this world gets longer, its harder to absorb it all before you get to play something of value. The great American Songbook is not the only source and the fact that it is held in such high esteem is as much commercial as it is aesthetic. Some of those songs are bl**dy awful Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faithless Posted August 16, 2011 Share Posted August 16, 2011 Well then, who said that you have to go from King Oliver up to Glasper(who do you think he learned from, if not from Herbie, Dizzy and other greats?) to 'get it down'? If we're looking that way, I don't really think one needs to go more than after 1965~ - everything we hear today was already invented by that time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bilbo Posted August 16, 2011 Share Posted August 16, 2011 There are a while raft of influences bearing down on Jazz that could not have happened before 1965. A lot of the world jazz influences are new, hip hop rhythm stuff has come in, new instruments are being explored - I guess it depends on what you value and what you consider to be Jazz. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faithless Posted August 16, 2011 Share Posted August 16, 2011 (edited) Well, I'm a bit of W Marsalis follower, speaking about what I take for Jazz and what not. Anyway, my point (to the OP) was that you have to learn to play bop FIRST for two reasons - learning to improvise is the quickest way to become a good player; secondly - knowing the tradition well will help you with your own music (doesnt matter what you're into - modern jazz, funk, latin.. call it what you want) no end, because Jazz is the basis of most contemporary music forms. Edited August 16, 2011 by Faithless Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lobematt Posted August 16, 2011 Author Share Posted August 16, 2011 [quote name='Faithless' post='1341571' date='Aug 16 2011, 10:12 AM']Well, I'm a bit of W Marsalis follower, speaking about what I take for Jazz and what not. Anyway, my point (to the OP) was that you have to learn to play bop FIRST for two reasons - learning to improvise is the quickest way to become a good player; secondly - knowing the tradition well will help you with your own music (doesnt matter what you're into - modern jazz, funk, latin.. call it what you want) no end, because Jazz is the basis of most contemporary music forms.[/quote] Thanks man, that's all I was after Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dad3353 Posted August 16, 2011 Share Posted August 16, 2011 Good morning, all... I hesitate to contribute here (after all, I'm only a drummer; what would I know..?), but I somewhat disagree with some of the above posts. I have been playing (modest...) bass and guitar for many years, and have been patiently working through all sorts of genres over the years. I prefer the term 'swing', in fact, when referring to these standards ('jazz', as Bilbo points out, is a rather delicate soubriquet...), but when all is said and done, a good tune is a good tune. The compositional 'rules' which come into play in this idiom are an excellent grounding for backing or improvising. What may be stale old clichés to a harded 'pro' can be refreshing to a younger, or less experienced audience. Mozart, Beethoven and all are still being, not only performed, but studied and renewed with interpretations unthought of in past generations. My particular example would be 'Misty', for which I have probably 3 dozen different transcriptions. The version from our friend Major Minor for solo bass, which he kindly wrote out for us all, stands very highly on any scale of merit, imho, and I would not call it out-dated, or 'old hat'. I'm certainly not 'married' to 'jazz' (swing, bebop; whatever it's called...), I appreciate quite a wide gamit of material (60's Dead and Airplane, Pentangle, Magma, Gojira, Joni Mitchell, Rimsky Korsakov... the list is far too long...), but I would rather encourage our OP in his exploration of these standards (who knows..? He may well turn out a new definitive 'Autumn Leaves'..!), whilst not neglecting other musical domains. I don't believe that one becomes 'stale' with these, but quite the reverse. Just my (humble...) tuppence worth... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bilbo Posted August 16, 2011 Share Posted August 16, 2011 We are all actually in agreement but I just wanted to urge people not to deify the bebop/hardbop school of jazz - its potentially as cliche-ridden as any other genre. There is a lot to be gained from standards but more to be gained by looking outside of the cloisters of neo-classicism and out into the wider music world. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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