chilievans Posted January 8, 2011 Share Posted January 8, 2011 AM i right in thinking that if I change my tone pot from 250 ohms to a lesser or greater ohms it will result in a change of sound from my bass? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ancient Mariner Posted January 8, 2011 Share Posted January 8, 2011 Maybe. Do you use the tone control at all? A bigger value will allow it to sound a bit brighter when on 10, and a lower value will be just like your existing pot turned down a bit. It won't make the bass sound *different*, but it might give you more of the same. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KiOgon Posted January 8, 2011 Share Posted January 8, 2011 [quote name='chilievans' post='1082231' date='Jan 8 2011, 03:50 PM']AM i right in thinking that if I change my tone pot from 250 ohms to a lesser or greater ohms it will result in a change of sound from my bass?[/quote] I think you mean 250 Kohms, that K is a bit important like & it depends on your wiring but in a word 'NotaLot' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icastle Posted January 8, 2011 Share Posted January 8, 2011 [quote name='chilievans' post='1082231' date='Jan 8 2011, 03:50 PM']AM i right in thinking that if I change my tone pot from 250 ohms to a lesser or greater ohms it will result in a change of sound from my bass?[/quote] Sort of, but not in the way I suspect you are trying to achieve. What will happen is the 'sweep' from bass to treble that your 250KΩ pot currently has will either be shifted or cut off (depending on the value of the pot you put in). I guess the best question to ask at this point would be: what is it that you are trying to achieve? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmshaw37 Posted January 8, 2011 Share Posted January 8, 2011 I took the tone control out of my punisher, not much difference between that and tone full on - maybe a bit brighter, but not much! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chilievans Posted January 8, 2011 Author Share Posted January 8, 2011 [quote name='icastle' post='1082302' date='Jan 8 2011, 04:58 PM']I guess the best question to ask at this point would be: what is it that you are trying to achieve?[/quote] Just trying to understand the workings of the bass. Not really thinking of changing anything apart from putting in a series parallel switch Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icastle Posted January 8, 2011 Share Posted January 8, 2011 [quote name='chilievans' post='1082409' date='Jan 8 2011, 06:27 PM']Just trying to understand the workings of the bass. Not really thinking of changing anything apart from putting in a series parallel switch[/quote] Ah right. In rather simplistic terms (I am a simplistic person after all!)... On a passive bass, all the tone control does is 'shove' some of the pup signal through an unpolarised capacitor. Signal going through that capacitor 'loses' it's treble. Therefore when you turn the tone control to 'full treble' you are getting the natural sound of the pup, and conversely - turning the tone control to 'full bass' shoves the output of the pup through a capacitor. Changing the pot to a different value would be like changing the way your car accelerator pedal works - it'll still tick over when you foot is off of it but it won't make it go any faster... if that makes any sense at all? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chilievans Posted January 8, 2011 Author Share Posted January 8, 2011 [quote name='icastle' post='1082424' date='Jan 8 2011, 06:38 PM']Ah right. In rather simplistic terms (I am a simplistic person after all!)... On a passive bass, all the tone control does is 'shove' some of the pup signal through an unpolarised capacitor. Signal going through that capacitor 'loses' it's treble. Therefore when you turn the tone control to 'full treble' you are getting the natural sound of the pup, and conversely - turning the tone control to 'full bass' shoves the output of the pup through a capacitor. Changing the pot to a different value would be like changing the way your car accelerator pedal works - it'll still tick over when you foot is off of it but it won't make it go any faster... if that makes any sense at all? [/quote] Makes sense to me bud. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lfalex v1.1 Posted January 8, 2011 Share Posted January 8, 2011 Changing the value of the capacitr, however, would have a more predictable effect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Heeley Posted January 8, 2011 Share Posted January 8, 2011 [quote name='Lfalex v1.1' post='1082695' date='Jan 8 2011, 10:49 PM']Changing the value of the capacitr, however, would have a more predictable effect.[/quote]...in the amount of treble cut off as the tone knob is turned down, the [i]ramp[/i] of the tone pot. On 10, a change of cap value will have no significant audible difference. [ducks] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icastle Posted January 8, 2011 Share Posted January 8, 2011 [quote name='Al Heeley' post='1082738' date='Jan 8 2011, 11:24 PM']...in the amount of treble cut off as the tone knob is turned down, the [i]ramp[/i] of the tone pot. On 10, a change of cap value will have no significant audible difference. [ducks][/quote] What you ducking for? That's totally correct ya big wuss Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lfalex v1.1 Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 [quote name='icastle' post='1082741' date='Jan 8 2011, 11:28 PM']What you ducking for? That's totally correct ya big wuss [/quote] It IS correct, but if you're running the tone control @ 100% "open" all the time, why have one at all? (see the post about the Punisher earlier on) If there's a specific tone that having a 250k pot in that position gives you, a 250k resistor would work just as well! Then you could ditch the tone capacitor altogether and have a tiny bit better (read shorter, simpler, more robust) signal path. If that bothers you at all. What exactly are you trying to achieve by changing the pot value? Dogma says (in passive instruments) that the convention is; 250k volume pots (audio taper/log) for single coil pick-ups 500k volume pots (audio taper/log) for humbuckers But that's VOLUME. The only tone control convention I'm aware of is that tone controls are usually linear pots. That, and the general acceptance of either 0.47pf and/or 0.22pf capacitors for tone control purposes. In any event, none of these components are expensive enough to preclude you from buying every single combination and simply trying them out to see what sounds/works best for you... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Heeley Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 ducks as some purists maintain that even at tone on 10 the cap and the pot have their own inherent capacitance, inductance and resistance that can influence the circuit, pickup impedence and hence colour the tone, that removing all from the circuit improves clarity, etc. Whilst this may technically be true it is the stuff of snakeoil as I do not believe in a controlled blind test even a trained sensitive musician will be able to tell the difference. Since I have spent the last few years playing bass for a punk band standing too close tot eh drummers cymbals I'm lucky to hear the doorbell ring. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyfisher Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 [quote name='icastle' post='1082302' date='Jan 8 2011, 04:58 PM']I guess the best question to ask at this point would be: what is it that you are trying to achieve?[/quote] I agree. While I wouldn't want to discourage anyone experimenting with such things it should be noted that the tone control on a (passive) bass is just about the simplest type of low-pass filter possible (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Low-pass_filter) so it's hardly the best place to start if you're trying to significantly shape the tone of a rig. All it does is reduce the amplitude of the higher frequencies and the only thing the pot does is to change the cut-off frequency, i.e. the frequency at which the roll-off starts to occur. Changing the pot may allow the cut-off frequency to be moved beyond the range of the existing pot, but there comes a point after which there's not a lot of point in moving the cut-off frequncy anyway, expecially on a bass guitar. Changing the pot (or the cap) won't make any difference to the rate of roll-off though, so the options for changing the bass tone are very limited indeed. Which is why, of course, pedals and multi-band tone controls on amps are so popular. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chilievans Posted January 11, 2011 Author Share Posted January 11, 2011 The reason I was asking is purely to enhance my knowledge. Thanks for all your help guys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost_Bass Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 (edited) Altough the vast majority of P-Basses come with the standart: Vol: 250k log pot Ton: 250k lin pot Cap: 0.22uf configuration my Maison P-Bass copy came with: Vol: 500k log pot Ton: 500k lin pot Cap: 0.47uf i tried the other variables cause the material is unexpensive and ended up maitaining the first setup. the bass just sounded more fuller with the tone pot rolled off and crisppier with it maxed out. I think is a mather of taste. Don't know how far the pickups signal can affect the choice. Mine were mildy hot (10k). I read somewere that hot pickups would be better off with 500k pots and the 250k pots would be suitable for the colder ones but i'm not sure that's a right asumption. Nothing like taking out the soldering iron and spending a afternoon experimenting. Be carefull with the burns though! cheers edit: mistake on the pu value. Edited January 11, 2011 by Ghost_Bass Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icastle Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 [quote name='Al Heeley' post='1085279' date='Jan 11 2011, 11:10 AM']ducks as some purists maintain that even at tone on 10 the cap and the pot have their own inherent capacitance, inductance and resistance that can influence the circuit, pickup impedence and hence colour the tone, that removing all from the circuit improves clarity, etc. Whilst this may technically be true it is the stuff of snakeoil as I do not believe in a controlled blind test even a trained sensitive musician will be able to tell the difference. Since I have spent the last few years playing bass for a punk band standing too close tot eh drummers cymbals I'm lucky to hear the doorbell ring.[/quote] If you're hanging around with punk drummers you're lucky that anyone rings your door bell... I agree with your snakeoil sentiments. Given that all passive electronic components have a 'leeway' in tolerance, a variable value dependant on temperature and different characteristics at different frequencies, I'm sure a lot of it is more subjective and/or imagined than reality. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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